To be annoyed by SIL making these comments towards my DD

[nhd]

SIL is very much a feminist, very woke etc but to the extreme. My DD is 3.

DD is the first grandchild to ILs and first niece / nephew to my SIL. (I think) she wants to remain child free at least for now, so she sees DD as her closest small person. SIL and PIL want to take an active part in the upbringing of my DD which I'm not necessarily against - the more loving people a child is surrounded by the better in my view. SIL and I aren't very close but we have a good relationship in that we get on when we are together but wouldn't choose to hang out as a 2 without my DH or wouldn't share deep personal secrets. All this is to say that SIL is a nice person, loves DD and doesn't make these comments maliciously I think, but they still really really irritate me and I think they're harmful.

Comments that she will make:
Eg1. We are discussing schools and I mentioned in passing mixed / single sex secondary school and dating boys. SIL instantly comments "or girls if she chooses to date them!"
Eg2. SIL comes over and DD shows her some biscuits that we made that afternoon whilst DH was at football. SIL "you know, just because you're a girl doesn't mean you need to stay home and bake. You could have gone to football with Daddy if you wanted" (DD was excited to bake, she has never expressed any interest in football).
Eg3. I am helping my daughter to put on a dress (gave her a choice of 2, she picked this one) before we go to a family function. SIL comes in (we don't live together but we were driving her there so she came to our house first) and DD runs to hug her but as we've got to leave, after a few mins, I say "come on, let's finish getting dressed, you'll look so pretty". At this point DD is wearing a stained vest, PJ bottoms and one sock. SIL "that's okay, you don't have to look pretty for anyone. You look how you like! Would you like to go like this?" I'm all for giving kids choices but surely I can at least encourage my daughter to wear clean clothes and dress up for occasions? Of course I'd let her wear something else if she didn't like a dress but why put ideas in her head?
Eg4. And the "you don't have to look pretty for anyone" is an ongoing thing. I was once putting on make up before heading out for date night, SIL came over to babysit. DD started copying me, pretending to put on make up, then came up to the mirror and said "wow so pretty, like mummy!" SIL once again said to her "but remember, you don't have to ever try to put on make up or change yourself to impress a man"

OP, it sounds ridiculously annoying. It's not your SIL's place to "complement" the education you're giving your very young daughter by constantly piping up every time an activity she considers girly is being done. And the clothes intervention was utterly and completely out of line.

If she was really passionate about the cause, rather than being self-righteous and a busy-body, she'd model by example and maybe get ve your dd a football or toy cars for Christmas.
I strongly suspect none of the posters who claim to be team SIL would tolerate similar comments from their relatives.

I would tell her the comments aren't welcome and if she's concerned about the education you're giving your daughter she's free to have a grown up conversation with you but under no circumstance do you want her making these types of comments in response to parenting decisions you have made. It is not her role.

I strongly suspect none of the posters who claim to be team SIL would tolerate similar comments from their relatives. I suspect the same @Commonsense22 and I also suspect that if the SIL decides to become a parent in the future, she’ll greatly resent it if the OP makes any comments.

i think that it is a lot harder to 'condition' a child than the team SIL posters are implying

are you joking? Gender conditioning is everywhere and it causes so many people so much pain. I’m not saying it’s actually particularly successful in making people completely change their core identities or characteristics, but it’s very successful in making people feel uncomfortable in their own skin and restricting their confidence in different activities, ambitions and life choices,. Etc.

I agree with the SiL views, but I think she's a complete pain in the ass. An utter pain in the ass.

Who does she think she is to hastily correct your comments to your dd like that? Also, the way she handles her differences-with YOUR child-is ham fisted and overbearing.

I do hate the phrase woke, however. It's a stupid, meaningless slur.

I'm not going to start talking about that, because people will start talking about trans issues and it will become a complete bin fire. I still think that the SIL is a bore and a busybody, who needs to mind her own business.

But She’s her aunt!

I’m so grateful for the different adult role models i had growing up, and wish i had had more.
my parents are alright but their outlook on the world partial and limited, as it is with us all.

Children are not the property of their parents, they are people in their own right and benefit from having different relationships with diff people. Their wellbeing is the business of all who care about them.

also I wasn’t talking about being trans, I was talking about the everyday conditioning that we all experience, that makes eg girls feel like their value is defined by having a particular skinny body shape, etc etc. (just one very basic example),

I don't expect women to do something they don't want to do, all I said is that it isn't a feminist choice.

We also can't ignore the fact that women are conditioned from birth to be carers just as men are conditioned from birth to be providers. It isn't a coincidence that it's usually women who want to be SAHP's. That's part of the problem.

I suppose it does depend on your parents, to be fair. My parents are very cosmopolitan so I didn't need a ton of outside influences: if anything, I thought other people's households growing up were kind of dull. That said, there is nothing in the OP to suggest that the SIL is correct in her views, she is clearly a very rigid person and probably would impose her own stereotypical view of life on her own kids, if she ever had them (so refusing to let a daughter play with dolls or wear dresses) Oddly enough, I bet she would not welcome outside interference herself.

I think your SIL is a fabulous role model for your daughter tbh ❤️

What on earth have trans issues got to do with this?

Because the aunt is saying these things when the child has made her choice and is therefore undermining the child's right to choose.

Why? Role models do just that, they model behaviour, not just bleat and preach.

@VanityDiesHard "That said, there is nothing in the OP to suggest that the SIL is correct in her views, she is clearly a very rigid person"

How bizarre! She appears to have been making suggestions, not imposing her views! Are you reading a different post?

This 🙄

Nowhere in the post was it said the SIL doesn’t also model her feminist behaviour.

i brought both my daughters up saying things like the OPs SIL, and both my teenage girls are doing fine 😌

No, are you? She is definitely pushing her views. Do you really think it is normal, when shown someone's work (in this case, baking) to tell them ' you know you don't have to do that because you are a girl/boy, you could be doing x activity instead'? Because I don't. I think it is weird and rude.

My sense is that the bleating and preaching comes from the OP, trying to get a 3 year old to get dressed by telling her she’ll look ‘so pretty’.

What's wrong with wanting to look pretty, though? Does anyone really want to look ugly?

Because it's only expected for girls to look pretty and only girls are encouraged to do basic things like getting dressed to look pretty.

OP has said she wanted her daughter to look clean and smart, it's only because her daughter is a girl that she used pretty instead.

Women who want to be sahm generally do it because they just gave birth to them and might be breastfeeding, and there is a biological drive for many mammals to stay close to their young.

It isn’t that they are conditioned to be carers- babies aren’t just a thing that needs taking care of, they are people’s family!

That’s not to say that women who don’t feel like that or can’t stay at home are any less mothers, they just have a different situation or feelings.

The fact you expect women to put collective ‘good’ above their own wants and needs in order to qualify as making feminist decisions shows that you expect more from women than you do men.

Why are you comfortable saying that women who don’t sacrifice themselves for the greater good are making less feminist choices? Why does sacrifice of self = feminism?

Also, did you have a response to my question about your heteronormative comments earlier?

You don't know that for certain, do you? I mean, I agree that OP might have used the word 'handsome' instead of pretty for a male child, but I have heard parents of all children encourage them to dress up and look attractive, not just 'clean'. That only becomes a problem IMO when it veers into toddlers and tiaras territory. I maintain that the SIL sounds like some feminazi stereotype and I'm not surprised that the OP is sick of her.

I don’t even know where to start with this.
i suggest watching the hunchback of notredame? Beauty and the beast?

Maternity leave is available when women have just given birth for up to a year. You don't need to be a SAHM for that.

Of course they are conditioned to be carers. Studies show that adults treat boy babies and girl babies differently, it starts from day dot.

Huh? Surely in Beauty and the Beast the Beast is transformed? Are you talking about Shrek? Anyway, those stories are fiction and I am talking about real life, where being put together and smart counts for a lot. There is another thread on AIBU atm about whether wealth equals good looks, and the consensus seems to be that while you can't buy beauty, you can buy 'good looks' just by paying attention to grooming and self presentation.

It's the societal pressure placed on girls, the same pressure isn't placed on boys when it comes to looks like it is with girls.