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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be annoyed by SIL making these comments towards my DD

785 replies

nhd · 15/12/2023 15:00

SIL is very much a feminist, very woke etc but to the extreme. My DD is 3.

DD is the first grandchild to ILs and first niece / nephew to my SIL. (I think) she wants to remain child free at least for now, so she sees DD as her closest small person. SIL and PIL want to take an active part in the upbringing of my DD which I'm not necessarily against - the more loving people a child is surrounded by the better in my view. SIL and I aren't very close but we have a good relationship in that we get on when we are together but wouldn't choose to hang out as a 2 without my DH or wouldn't share deep personal secrets. All this is to say that SIL is a nice person, loves DD and doesn't make these comments maliciously I think, but they still really really irritate me and I think they're harmful.

Comments that she will make:
Eg1. We are discussing schools and I mentioned in passing mixed / single sex secondary school and dating boys. SIL instantly comments "or girls if she chooses to date them!"
Eg2. SIL comes over and DD shows her some biscuits that we made that afternoon whilst DH was at football. SIL "you know, just because you're a girl doesn't mean you need to stay home and bake. You could have gone to football with Daddy if you wanted" (DD was excited to bake, she has never expressed any interest in football).
Eg3. I am helping my daughter to put on a dress (gave her a choice of 2, she picked this one) before we go to a family function. SIL comes in (we don't live together but we were driving her there so she came to our house first) and DD runs to hug her but as we've got to leave, after a few mins, I say "come on, let's finish getting dressed, you'll look so pretty". At this point DD is wearing a stained vest, PJ bottoms and one sock. SIL "that's okay, you don't have to look pretty for anyone. You look how you like! Would you like to go like this?" I'm all for giving kids choices but surely I can at least encourage my daughter to wear clean clothes and dress up for occasions? Of course I'd let her wear something else if she didn't like a dress but why put ideas in her head?
Eg4. And the "you don't have to look pretty for anyone" is an ongoing thing. I was once putting on make up before heading out for date night, SIL came over to babysit. DD started copying me, pretending to put on make up, then came up to the mirror and said "wow so pretty, like mummy!" SIL once again said to her "but remember, you don't have to ever try to put on make up or change yourself to impress a man"

OP posts:
MsRosley · 15/12/2023 18:40

I've been a feminist all my life and even I think your SIL is being bloody annoying/borderline rude about you. Let your DD choose what she wants to do/be like. As long as you're not actively reinforcing gender stereotypes, you're good.

PS. Football is fecking boring, and if you SIL ever starts with the 'questioning your gender' shit, kick her out and lock the door behind her. There are feminists, and then there are so-called 'feminists' who are happy to encourage kids to believe they are the opposite sex and set them on a medical pathway for life.

Lifeomars · 15/12/2023 18:41

What does "very woke" mean?

MsRosley · 15/12/2023 18:41

Lifeomars · 15/12/2023 18:41

What does "very woke" mean?

That she's a pain in the arse.

pinkfones · 15/12/2023 18:42

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 15/12/2023 18:38

She sounds like a PITA to me.

A Dsis of mine was like this with her very little dd. Nothing remotely girly - that was until her dd was no longer a baby, and had a mind of her own!

To me it’s anti-feminist to behave as though all girls’ things are somehow inferior to the boys’ equivalents. If a 3 year old girl can’t wear a nice dress and be told she looks pretty, I don’t know what the world’s coming to.

My dd was the least ‘girly’ girl imaginable, but never sought to influence her own dd one way or the other - but at only 2 yo I remember Gdd wanting to wear a ‘pitty’ dress.

Feel free to hold up your hands in horror!

Also this is so true.

Being a feminist is not dressing and acting in a no -binary/masculine way.

I had a manager years ago who was a woman and could run rings around every cocky and pig headed man who worked there. Was she masculin, not in the slightest.

Snowdogsmitten · 15/12/2023 18:43

I’m more like your SIL than not so I’m probably a bit biased. I refuse to use the word ‘pretty’ when talking to or about my daughter.

Wish44 · 15/12/2023 18:44

@Lifeomars viewing other people speech and actions as “teachable moments” for you to assert your political beliefs…

BodyKeepingScore · 15/12/2023 18:44

I wouldn't be annoyed by these comments. She's reinforcing some really important messaging in the life of a child she loves. All power to her :)

JustGerroffMe · 15/12/2023 18:45

Quite didn’t work

JustGerroffMe · 15/12/2023 18:46

Anisette · 15/12/2023 18:10

Out of curiosity, are you planning to go back to work, OP?

Why is this relevant?

Stokey · 15/12/2023 18:46

Hattie89 · 15/12/2023 18:31

Forgot to add I totally disagree that comments like “You’re so pretty” should be avoided. Saw something along those lines in a PP. I think we can all often tell our daughters etc they are beautiful while also reminding them looks aren’t important. I have a friend who was never told and it’s really affected her as an adult.

I don't think you need to tell your daughters they're beautiful to make them feel valued. I don't think I've ever said "You're so pretty" to one of my DDs. I may say "you look nice" or "that colour suits you" but I don't want them to feel they have to strive to be pretty. I tend to praise them for things they have made an effort to achieve rather than what they look like.

Naptrappedmummy · 15/12/2023 18:47

YANBU. You don’t need to add endless caveats and qualifiers to everything you say to enforce a message she won’t even care about at this age.

itsmylife7 · 15/12/2023 18:47

Nanny0gg · 15/12/2023 18:28

But you said it to your son

Not his child

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Yes, because I was making him aware !

JudgeJ · 15/12/2023 18:47

"you don't have to look pretty for anyone"

'No you don't dear, look at Aunt ??? for example'

JustGerroffMe · 15/12/2023 18:48

YaWeeFurryBastard · 15/12/2023 18:07

Wtf are you on about? Nobody is “bashing” SAHM, just pointing out that being a SAHM is not a bastion of feminism and therefore it’s good to have another feminist influence. Also nobody is ear bashing about men, you’ve literally made that up.

Show quote history

I consider myself a very strong feminist and I’ve been a SAHM.

This is your piss poor and ill-educated opinion.

Wish44 · 15/12/2023 18:48

@JudgeJ 😂

JudgeJ · 15/12/2023 18:48

BodyKeepingScore · 15/12/2023 18:44

I wouldn't be annoyed by these comments. She's reinforcing some really important messaging in the life of a child she loves. All power to her :)

She needs to keep her neb out, it has nothing to do with her how the OP chooses to bring up her daughter.

saraclara · 15/12/2023 18:49

Mirabai · 15/12/2023 17:23

Is anything she says actually not true though? What’s to dislike? Other than OP feeling undermined by it - but isn’t that her problem? (or his problem etc).😉

Edited
Show quote history

So when MILs chip in with truths, that's okay too?

pinkfun · 15/12/2023 18:50

Naptrappedmummy · 15/12/2023 18:47

YANBU. You don’t need to add endless caveats and qualifiers to everything you say to enforce a message she won’t even care about at this age.

So true! OP go with your gut feeling on this one.

I can only think the people on here who "love" your SIL are fighting some personal battles?

Northernparent68 · 15/12/2023 18:50

What’s your husband’s view

Wish44 · 15/12/2023 18:50

@YaWeeFurryBastard

raising children is an incredibly important job!

CHRIS003 · 15/12/2023 18:50

nhd · 15/12/2023 15:00

SIL is very much a feminist, very woke etc but to the extreme. My DD is 3.

DD is the first grandchild to ILs and first niece / nephew to my SIL. (I think) she wants to remain child free at least for now, so she sees DD as her closest small person. SIL and PIL want to take an active part in the upbringing of my DD which I'm not necessarily against - the more loving people a child is surrounded by the better in my view. SIL and I aren't very close but we have a good relationship in that we get on when we are together but wouldn't choose to hang out as a 2 without my DH or wouldn't share deep personal secrets. All this is to say that SIL is a nice person, loves DD and doesn't make these comments maliciously I think, but they still really really irritate me and I think they're harmful.

Comments that she will make:
Eg1. We are discussing schools and I mentioned in passing mixed / single sex secondary school and dating boys. SIL instantly comments "or girls if she chooses to date them!"
Eg2. SIL comes over and DD shows her some biscuits that we made that afternoon whilst DH was at football. SIL "you know, just because you're a girl doesn't mean you need to stay home and bake. You could have gone to football with Daddy if you wanted" (DD was excited to bake, she has never expressed any interest in football).
Eg3. I am helping my daughter to put on a dress (gave her a choice of 2, she picked this one) before we go to a family function. SIL comes in (we don't live together but we were driving her there so she came to our house first) and DD runs to hug her but as we've got to leave, after a few mins, I say "come on, let's finish getting dressed, you'll look so pretty". At this point DD is wearing a stained vest, PJ bottoms and one sock. SIL "that's okay, you don't have to look pretty for anyone. You look how you like! Would you like to go like this?" I'm all for giving kids choices but surely I can at least encourage my daughter to wear clean clothes and dress up for occasions? Of course I'd let her wear something else if she didn't like a dress but why put ideas in her head?
Eg4. And the "you don't have to look pretty for anyone" is an ongoing thing. I was once putting on make up before heading out for date night, SIL came over to babysit. DD started copying me, pretending to put on make up, then came up to the mirror and said "wow so pretty, like mummy!" SIL once again said to her "but remember, you don't have to ever try to put on make up or change yourself to impress a man"

How to deal with SIL
EG1 - Don't take any notice - honestly you don't even need to think about secondary school age yet !!
EG2 Just ask SIL If she wants a cake ! Tell her niece is only 3 she wouldn't understand what she is saying anyway and we have just enjoyed ourselves making cakes no need to read any more into than that,tell her to lighten up a bit !!

EG3 & 4 - This one is a bit more OTT - honestly need to ask her why she takes everything so seriously ! You need to be a bit more assertive in establishing the on going relationship between aunt & niece - saying things like thisn't a problem atm cos daughter is only 3 - she doesn't understand but as she gets older she will listen to comments like this. If this was me I would say to SIL that I respect yours views on life but you need to respect mine and I would prefer that you didn't make these comments to my daughter. When you have kids I will respect your views too.
Remind her your daughter is a child not a teen ! She doesn't have kids of her own so
She doesn't know how to relate to them - she has probably been watching too many woke social media influencers and doesn't live in the real world lol!

Naptrappedmummy · 15/12/2023 18:51

JudgeJ · 15/12/2023 18:48

She needs to keep her neb out, it has nothing to do with her how the OP chooses to bring up her daughter.

Show quote history

Yes funny how so many posters are all ‘beak out, how they raise their child is none of your business’ until it’s something they personally agree with.

justasking111 · 15/12/2023 18:51

Meowandthen · 15/12/2023 18:32

I think it’s a good thing to counterbalance your comments about your daughter having to be pretty. Not a good idea to put in a child’s head as there is far too much pressure on girls to look a certain way. This message sink in when they are young.

My mother a narcissist used to tell me that it was a shame I had my father's side of the families looks rather than hers and men would ever only want one thing from me. Because I wasn't pretty.

Yep that does affect you

Lifeomars · 15/12/2023 18:51

OakElmAsh · 15/12/2023 17:43

She may be going a little full-on for a 3 year old, but honestly, girls can't hear enough of these messages, they hear soo much everywhere as they go through life about appearance, looking pretty etc that there can't be enough people harping on about there being more to life than looks, that whoever they choose to love is ok, that there's no such things as "girl" and "boy" hobbies
.
You will not be only influence as she gets older, so Go SIL for already being a voice that will counter the thousands she will hear later on about girls having to be/behave a certain way!!!!

I only wish that had been the case when I was growing up. I was a pretty teenager and young woman, I was also bright and witty and I vividly recall being told to tone down my wit and intelligence as "men are not attracted to clever women"!! Brains last, beauty fades

Naptrappedmummy · 15/12/2023 18:52

Lifeomars · 15/12/2023 18:51

I only wish that had been the case when I was growing up. I was a pretty teenager and young woman, I was also bright and witty and I vividly recall being told to tone down my wit and intelligence as "men are not attracted to clever women"!! Brains last, beauty fades

Show quote history

What’s wrong with celebrating beauty? Brains are also genetic to a large extent yet it’s ok to celebrate intelligence?