AIBU to take my son into the female changing room?

[JustKeepSwimmingAlong]

I’ve taken my kids swimming tonight, both have separate swimming lessons and I swam with one while the other had theirs. Eldest is male, 9 and has multiple additional needs including ADHD, ASD and some physical disabilities which means he struggles to change himself. Youngest is in nursery so can dress herself but does need supervision. We got out the pool and realised all the changing rooms were full. There were 8 classes on over multiple pools, as well as general swim on at the same time. There’s only two family/accessible changing rooms and the others are all individual. There were literal queues for the large changing rooms.
I then noticed people going out of the group change. I’ve not used it before, but there was a male and a female changing room, so we went in the females. There was no one in it so started laying out the kids clothes and getting them to shower. Got them out the showers and started to get them dressed and people started coming in. There were a couple of mums with young girls and boys, and then a teenager looking girl came in by herself. She immediately came over to tell me that we were in the female room. I explained my son needed help getting changed and the changing rooms were full, but this room had been empty so we’d used it rather than standing wet and cold waiting for a changing room.
We were nearly Finished and my son was fully dressed when she arrived. He sat next to me, facing the wall and we left within a few minutes. During this time, she did get changed, so we didn’t delay her. Now I’m wondering if I was unreasonable?
I don’t want to make anyone uncomfortable, but I really don’t know what else I could have done in the situation? There’s too many classes and too few changing rooms, and we need a larger/accessible one, but they’re the only ones with baby change so they’re really
Popular. The lessons are every week so now I’m wondering what I can do next week? Would I be unreasonable to keep using the group change if there are no other options available?

@Theoriginalmrscillianmurphy

and you did mock. You just expect to get called out by someone with an actual disability, who is affected when men and boys push into the women’s communal changing rooms.

@Thedm I did not mock you. How can someone mock a disability they know nothing about.

Have a word with yourself.

@Thedm

IT IS UNREASONABLE TO ASK AN AUTISTIC PERSON TO QUEUE.

THEY CANNOT DO IT WITHOUT IT CAUSING THEM HARM.

1. They cannot comprehend the passage of time or put bounds on it.
2. It puts untold distress upon them because they can’t understand nor quell their anxiety
3. It causes sensory overload because of the proximity to other people - smells, noise, visual stimuli, proprioception.
4. The after effects are days long

https://best-practice.middletownautism.com/teachingcoreskills/waiting/#:~:text=Time%20is%20an%20abstract%20concept,1%20minute%20or%20several%20hours.

She was confident enough to challenge. The kid is 9.

@Thedm

She doesn’t bloody have to.

She has said he is autistic, adhd with physical disability.

For an autistic - speaking from the point of view of being one and of having autistic children - to be standing trying to wait in a line dripping wet and freezing is a horrendous sensory experience with high stress.

To not understand that is utter muppetry.

@Robinni

Well, you’re just very wrong. My son is autistic, as I’ve said. He can queue. Many many autistic people can stand in a queue. My son’s issue was with the water on his skin, so I dried him in the queue. The OP didn’t say a word about her son being unable to stand and wait his turn, she did say that he didn’t like the dripping sensation and that was the issue with waiting. She could dry him off.

Waiting around can “often” be a trigger, as can many many things. But not for every single person with autism. The OP needs to find a way to manager her son in these situations. For her, it is the dripping. So big dry robe in and dry him off. Take some time on it whilst the queue goes down. Or find whatever works for her. As long as it doesn’t involve a female only space.

@Robinni
Sbe does actually have to do something though, because she cannot use the female group change. The fact that the OP herself says she won’t ever do it again means that there are other options, including waiting and drying him whilst they wait. She didn’t use that option because the easiest one was to walk into the female space, but now she knows she can’t. So that’s one less person invading women’s spaces with men. Isn’t that good.

I think OP did say he couldn’t wait We have a wearable towel that usually means we can manage, but it wouldn’t work if we were stood waiting for long periods of time and would trigger a melt down.

@TomeTome

If I remember correctly, the sentence right before that was her saying it was because of the dripping water so she uses the wearable towel as a stop gap until getting him dry. So, if she can’t get into a cubicle then she can dry him in the open plan area or in the disabled toilets. Not in the female only space. Because that’s for females, inviting girls his age. He can’t be in there.

Until they've reached what age?

That's the issue.

@Thedm

Why on earth are you making your son go through this????

The accommodations at theme parks, airports, public transport, leisure centres, just about every other place you can think of in relation to queuing are there for a reason.

Because people who are autistic need these accommodations to be put on a level playing field with neurotypical individuals.

Level playing field. Equality.

To reject hard won accommodations is to disadvantage the disabled individual.

Just because I CAN sit an exam without extra time or manage for a limited period in a queue, doesn’t mean that I SHOULD… because ultimately when you add up all these little things that I can do if I push myself, it causes detriment to my overall health and increased stress that disadvantages me by comparison to a person who doesn’t have autism.

Seriously, level that playing field and take advantage of all the supports that are out there, because life as an autistic is damn well stressful enough without being a martyr about it.

If OP’s son was 11 in age and developmental terms I think you’d have a point. But he’s just turned 9, and this was a once off occasion out of desperation and panic.

I have every faith she will complain to the powers that be high enough up so that change is actioned.

@Robinni

My daughter is autistic and I would never dream of jumping queues etc. she is as capable of queuing as anyone else. From the day she was diagnosed I've never let autism be an excuse, she's an adult now due to graduate university this summer. Autism does vary so there are some with more severe/comorbidities but for people like my dd, queuing is part of life, they learn

@Robinni

I did it with my son because there were other children in his swimming class with different needs, and for their needs, they had to go first. We were asked, we accommodated. My son could wait, as long as he was dry. Some kids couldn’t wait at all. But their parents spoke to staff before the lessons, and spoke to us. If my son couldn’t have coped, then we would have shuffled lesson times around to ensure all could be accommodated for their needs.

What I would never do is use the female open plan changing rooms for my son. Because he is my son, not my daughter and women and girls (especially the girls from his bloody class who were at lessons during the same time) deserve a female only space.

Using the women’s room is not a solution. You keep shouting at me about queuing and queue passes. Why do you think I disagree? But the OP didn’t use a queue skip or ask about it. She used the female only space and a teenage girl had to speak up to defend the space.

Im absolutely behind the OP having adjustments made for her son, but using the female only space is not an adjustment.

@LolaSmiles

Look the reason women’s spaces are the go to in these sorts of emergency situations is that

a) Mainly it is mothers taking care of the children or bringing them to swimming

b) Women are much less likely to be rapists, paedophiles, violent and so forth

Therefore women’s spaces are deemed to be safe for children.

OP’s son is 2 months older than this 8yo cut off point for boys. She didn’t bring a 24yo disabled man in there, I think some of the reactions on this thread are out of their tree bonkers.

Women’s spaces are for women, and young girls. Not for boys. We are not the back up for boys. It is unacceptable.

Totally disagree with the Mums who are persisting with getting their kids to queue when there are hard won accommodations available to them.

I also have degree level education @gotomomo and until my child was diagnosed I queued.

In fact I didn’t get diagnosed until after my child.

I now don’t queue and I can’t tell you the stress it has taken off me that I didn’t even realise I was holding.

The regret I feel that I didn’t have the support that my child now has is immense.

I’m telling you, from someone who has lived the autistic experience, let her have every support that is out there, whether you want her to conform to neurotypical ideals or not… because it does make a difference. It puts her on an equal footing to neurotypical people.

@Robinni jumping a queue, even if allowed, would upset my DD more than waiting. Rules are there for a reason, and she "can't" break them.

I know plenty of other people with autism that are similar.

@PosterBoy

Yes it is unthinkable because if you start sending children alone into mens changing rooms you put them at risk of assault, if you send the mother in with the child she too is at risk of assault.

If mother and son are in a female space they will not be assaulted.

@Robinni

What makes you an authority on how autism affects our children? In my son’s case, you are way off the mark. He doesn’t give a shit about standing in a queue. It doesn’t affect his life in any way. He has quite a few hobbies (comic cons, conventions) which require standing around waiting for presentations to start, even using a queue skip so many kids have them that you’re still queueing to meet people, it’s just part of life and luckily for him, has no ill effect.

He has his own triggers, we‘ve had to find ways to manage around those. But standing in a queue isn’t one. Assuming that all kids with autism cannot wait their turn is just really wrong, especially when you’re actually being told by their parents that it is fine.

This isn’t about whether the kid can stand in a queue or not. If he can but can’t be wet then she needs to dry him, if he can’t stand at all then OP does need to skip the queue and staff will arrange it. The question here was about using a female only space. She cannot do that.

@PuttingDownRoots

Which is why at every theme park, airport, event etc that we go to there is a separate - and often non existent - queue for disabled people.

@PuttingDownRoots

The rule is - you go to queue B rather than queue A because that is what you are entitled to do by law and it is set up to help you.

Just like accommodations at school, work etc. it’s no different.

@Robinni
We get it, you like the queue skipping. It works for you and that’s great. But stop trying to force it onto us when we know our kids.

Female spaces are not there to be a haven for boys. They don’t have to go into the men’s communal room and risk assault, but they are not allowed into the women’s. But luckily there are family changing rooms, and if his autism affects his waiting time then the OP can have an adjustment made and skip the queue. So I’m not sure what it is you think the problem is? The staff will assist her in getting him into a family change after he has showered. He doesn’t need to invade a female only space. The mum made a mistake, she is going to sort it. So why do you keep saying the female space should be available to him? He doesn’t need it, it isn’t for him and women and girls using it don’t want him there.

That my DD doesn't need. So by us not being there, it actually makes it easier for those who do need that particular consideration.

Speak to the pool staff for guidance and ask for an appropriate facility to be made available

If the female change was open plan then you should have waited for the group change. 9 is too old for a boy to be in an open change female changing room tbh