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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think he can’t get away with this? Marriage breakdown.

452 replies

SheIsStuck23 · 15/11/2023 07:21

I posted this on the Relationship board yesterday but only got two replies so I’m now posting it here because I’m desperate for help and advice.

I’m posting because of all the fantastic knowledge and support that is offered on here to women who want to escape shitty relationships and because I don’t know how to help my friend.

I’m going to see her in a few days time and I would love to be able to give her some guidance.

The back story of her and her husband:

Together for 13 years.
Married for 7 years.
They have two children aged 11 and 8

My friend was a SAHM until the youngest started school and then she started a college course in order to get into a career. She should get her qualification late next year.

Her husband works in banking and she thinks he earns about £95k.

My friend has never had any access to his earnings and all she has had since the birth of their first child eleven years ago is a monthly “allowance” that he gives her, as well as the child benefit.

He pays for the mortgage and bills and keeps the rest of his earnings to himself.

Their marriage has been very rocky for about 3-4 years (he’s awful) and a few months ago my friend told her husband that she didn’t want to be with him anymore. He made lots of promises about how he’d change (which he’s already been promising for many years with nothing changing) but she said enough is enough.

A year or so ago she had suggested marriage counselling but he wouldn’t pay for it and still won’t.

Their house is worth £400k and she wants to put it on the market but she knows he won’t agree. They are still living there together (separate rooms) and my friend says the atmosphere is just horrendous. She wants to start divorce proceedings but is terrified about how he will react and she doesn’t have access to any money to pay solicitor fees anyway.

He has now stopped giving her a monthly allowance (out of spite I imagine) and so all she has now each month is the child benefit money. She has to use this to buy things for herself and for the children, and for her travel costs back and forth to college.

He’s treating her so badly and it’s just a mess. It’s just awful. He’s telling their daughters that my friend wants to break up the family and he’s the victim…..

Surely he can’t get away with this?

She has no other family nearby and she feels completely trapped.

How can I help her

OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
Notmetoo · 15/11/2023 13:53

It's not true that she shouldn't get child benefit or that she will have to pay it back she can claim and should to make sure she gets the NI credit otherwise there will be implications for her state pension
What will happen is her husband will pay more tax to offset the cost of the child benefit.

Youcannotbeseriousreally · 15/11/2023 13:54

Catpuss66 · 15/11/2023 13:46

Do you really think you are helping the OP? She probably worried & vulnerable & you are saying she has to worry about paying the CB back which at this moment in time is the only thing feeding her children.

Show quote history

The OPs friend needs all the information about every single thing, to put herself in the strongest, most indisputable position. to play his game back at him. She needs to write down everything, with all the tax, money, eligibility criteria, she needs spreadsheets, evidence and she needs legal advice once she has all this together

you’ve been unhelpful by trying to hijack a thread , trying to prove me wrong and then just being rude.

Toastcrumbsinsofa · 15/11/2023 13:54

How on earth is your friend managing to feed her family on just child benefit money? That’s less than £200 a month!

Bilbo63 · 15/11/2023 13:55

If she is at uni she can get a loan and child maintenance grant. She will be able to continue her course - contact student finance. She can claim UC as well, even though they are still living together. It will be reduced because of student finance, but she will get something. I wish your friend the best of luck - it sounds horrendous. Unless you have been in or witnessed a relationship like this you truly don't understand. The erosion of choices and autonomy is gradual - I hope she gets out asap.

Maze76 · 15/11/2023 13:57

@SheIsStuck23 Your friend has a couple of options- if I were in her shoes I would suck it up , tells hubs a i want to try again, stick with the marriage until my course had finished and then look at divorce etc.
I know this may not be a popular choice, however she has children to think of and really, is one more year going to make that much difference if it gets her in a better position to secure her qualifications, and in turn a better paid job?

EsmeSusanOgg · 15/11/2023 13:59

SheIsStuck23 · 15/11/2023 08:16

Thank you for this information about the child benefit and I shall get her to re-check that she should be receiving it 👍

Show quote history

If either partner is earning more than £60k (taxable earnings) child benefit stops.

LaurieStrode · 15/11/2023 14:05

2jacqi · 15/11/2023 12:26

@SheIsStuck23 inheritance is not considered part of matrimonial assets. no idea about what happens if she has paid off mortgage with it but she definitely needs to speak to a solicitor about that. there will be proof of that payment somewhere. Do not nominate that father for dad of the year.

She lost that protection of her inheritance when she mingled it with marital assets. Did she never bother to educate herself about such matters?

OP, can you or your husband watch the kids nights and/or weekends so she can work?

LaurieStrode · 15/11/2023 14:06

Maze76 · 15/11/2023 13:57

@SheIsStuck23 Your friend has a couple of options- if I were in her shoes I would suck it up , tells hubs a i want to try again, stick with the marriage until my course had finished and then look at divorce etc.
I know this may not be a popular choice, however she has children to think of and really, is one more year going to make that much difference if it gets her in a better position to secure her qualifications, and in turn a better paid job?

Except that's another year inna toxic, damaging environment for the kids.

AcrossthePond55 · 15/11/2023 14:12

@SheIsStuck23

Right now the ONLY thing your friend needs is legal advice. If she won't accept the money from you as a gift, then tell her it's a loan against the time when she is free. Because she will need legal advice to get free from this abusive prick. I might be tempted to tell her I've already pre-paid for a consult so she might as well go so I don't 'waste' my money.

Would/could her parents help her out financially or even just offer additional emotional support? Has she spoken to them about him? So many abusive men engineer disagreements with their victim's friends and families to keep them isolated and dependent. If this has happened to your friend and her family please encourage her to 'break the silence' and get in touch with them. It could be that they're waiting desperately for her call. Yes, she may have to hear 'we told you so', but it will be well worth it.

IMHO, the very last thing she needs to do is stop schooling. I might feel differently if she still had a couple of years to go, but she only has 7 months. The 3 months exam results waiting time could be spent working IF she can figure out childcare. Finishing her schooling could be the difference between being able to afford a little rental until the finances are legally settled and being stuck living with that abusive shit whilst fighting it out. If she can at all bear to grit her teeth and keep going I'm sure she'll be glad she did in the end.

Maze76 · 15/11/2023 14:18

The op hasn’t said the husband has treated the children in an abusive way. I know what you are saying and yes, they will have some awareness of what’s happening.
it’s a choice- the children will still have access to their father, there is nothing to say that a divorce will mean that the mother will be awarded sole/ majority custody, especially given her lack of job.
For the sake of 1 year, I think it’s worth considering

WifeOfTiresias · 15/11/2023 14:18

LongLostTeacher · 15/11/2023 08:14

It’s great you’re supporting your friend. I would say legal advice is an absolute must. As they are married she will be entitled to half of the marital assets, so she will not be left with nothing.

I might not have got this right, but I am surprised there is child benefit money coming in if the H is on £95k. If it has been claimed incorrectly it will stop and I would assume it would need to be repaid. Sorry to add a potential problem.

Its fine to receive child benefit in this situation as it is the responsibility of the higher earner to declare the benefit received in their tax return then repay it to HMRC. It is solely his responsibility to do this not your friend.

Tinklyheadtilt · 15/11/2023 14:20

Love the fact that OP buries the husband (he is awful!) but not once mentioned anything about her friend that she had done wrong.

Abovethepalms · 15/11/2023 14:33

You clearly can’t have all the facts. How can she be paying for household food for 4 and commuting and everything else on c. £40 per week?

and what on earth possessed her to spend her inheritance on paying off the mortgage? Why didn’t she squirrel it away for precisely this situation.

how long have you known this friend, could she be fishing for donations?

SurprisedWithAHorse · 15/11/2023 14:38

Tinklyheadtilt · 15/11/2023 14:20

Love the fact that OP buries the husband (he is awful!) but not once mentioned anything about her friend that she had done wrong.

Why, what do you think the wife has done wrong and how would you do it better? Remember he won't contribute to childcare or look after the kids himself.

Ohtobetwentytwo · 15/11/2023 14:42

I'd advise her to speak to citizens advice. I think there might be an option to get a court order to pay for legal fees but she needs urgent, unbiased advice.

Bouffe · 15/11/2023 14:44

There's a lot of 'yes, but' going in in your responses, OP. 'She could do that, but...' 'She's been told to do this, but...' When women are absolutely desperate to escape an abusive marriage they tend to grab whatever means they can to get away. So I'm wondering what's going on.

From what you've said she chose to spend the money she inherited on tuition fees rather than legal advice or leaving him. She could have contacted Women's Aid and got free legal advice, or asked for a free 30-minute consultation with a lawyer at any time — but she hasn't. As a student she should be able to access student support where she may be able to get advice and help. But she hasn't. Maybe she has a plan — finish training, get work, leave the bastard — and she uses you to offload on.

If you want to help, you could offer to pay for her to get good legal advice. You could offer her and the children the opportunity to leave the marital home and live with you. But those are big asks and maybe by letting her offload on you you're already giving her something useful.

beaconhead · 15/11/2023 14:48

Please tell your friend to go to the police as this sounds like very much like coercive control.

Original poster
SheIsStuck23 · 15/11/2023 14:50

Abovethepalms · 15/11/2023 14:33

You clearly can’t have all the facts. How can she be paying for household food for 4 and commuting and everything else on c. £40 per week?

and what on earth possessed her to spend her inheritance on paying off the mortgage? Why didn’t she squirrel it away for precisely this situation.

how long have you known this friend, could she be fishing for donations?

Edited

I agree that I don’t have all the facts as I also don’t see how she can afford it all and that’s one of the things that worries me most. I’m assuming she must be getting money from somewhere but I know it won’t be from him. She’s not fishing for money as she refused any that I’ve offered her. I’m hoping when I see her she will tell me how she’s managing to cope. I said earlier that I don’t think she’s eating properly in order to keep costs down, and she’s potentially having to cancel one of her children’s hobbies as she can’t afford to pay for it so I do know she’s struggling. I’m guessing that so far she’s been able to cope because she’s had some money put aside from when she got her monthly allowance, but I’m assuming that’s at the point of running out now which is why she’s not managing anymore. I don’t know, I’m just speculating but I’m sure things will be clearer once I’ve seen her and properly spoken to her.

I said in a previous post that when she got her inheritance the marriage wasn’t at a point where separation/divorce was on the cards. It’s only over the last 18 months that his behaviours has escalated to the point where she just can’t stay with him anymore. She had to pay off the mortgage with her inheritance as her husband said that he’d only agree to her doing her studies (and effectively not working) if she agreed to do that.

OP posts:
Original poster
SheIsStuck23 · 15/11/2023 14:56

Bouffe · 15/11/2023 14:44

There's a lot of 'yes, but' going in in your responses, OP. 'She could do that, but...' 'She's been told to do this, but...' When women are absolutely desperate to escape an abusive marriage they tend to grab whatever means they can to get away. So I'm wondering what's going on.

From what you've said she chose to spend the money she inherited on tuition fees rather than legal advice or leaving him. She could have contacted Women's Aid and got free legal advice, or asked for a free 30-minute consultation with a lawyer at any time — but she hasn't. As a student she should be able to access student support where she may be able to get advice and help. But she hasn't. Maybe she has a plan — finish training, get work, leave the bastard — and she uses you to offload on.

If you want to help, you could offer to pay for her to get good legal advice. You could offer her and the children the opportunity to leave the marital home and live with you. But those are big asks and maybe by letting her offload on you you're already giving her something useful.

When she received her inheritance, about 4 years ago, the marriage wasn’t brilliant but it was ok and the idea of a future separation and divorce wasn’t even in her mind so she had no reason to plan for it.

She’d always wanted to gain a qualification for a good job and so that’s why she used the inheritance to pay for her studies (and pay off the mortgage at her husband’s request).

It’s only over the last 18 months that the marriage has deteriorated to the point where she now wants to leave him.

OP posts:
NoSquirrels · 15/11/2023 15:05

EsmeSusanOgg · 15/11/2023 13:59

If either partner is earning more than £60k (taxable earnings) child benefit stops.

Show quote history

This is not correct @EsmeSusanOgg

Child benefit can still be claimed. The difference is that if the higher earner earns more than £60,000 they will have to pay it all back in tax. But it can still be paid out no matter what the higher earner is paid as a wage. It doesn’t automatically stop being paid, HMRC will just claim it back in taxes.

It’s important not to give incorrect advice on this as in situations like OP’s friend, where financial abuse is possible, it’s crucial the lower earning or non-earning parent can still access the money.

Chris002 · 15/11/2023 15:05

You say that she is stuck in the house with him and gives her no money
She has no family nearby

  1. When you go to visit are you driving ? If so help her pack her cases and stuff for the kids and take her back to your place
  2. Take her to her family
  3. Forget about college and kids schools etc they need to get away from this situation.
She will qualify for benefits if has no money 4 failing that stay with her until she can get into a refuge. offer her practical help, look after the kids offer her lifts or pay for taxi etc. If you have no transport then help to contact her family and wait with her until someone comes to collect her and the kids.
Namerequired · 15/11/2023 15:12

I can not believe people are advising she stay with him another year. He is abusing her. Would people advise this if he was beating her? Is that the only kind of abuse that matters still? In this day and age? Because he’s destroying her. Op if she’s telling you she can’t cope anymore, believe her. She’s obviously reached her limit with this awful human being.
Is he claiming the child benefit or is she? Because you said it goes into his account? If she isn’t claiming then she has missed out on those state pension years so that needs rectified (and remembered in the settlement). If it’s in her name, get her to change the account to her own bank account.
Get her to speak to women’s aid and also to her university. I would stop buying and cooking food for him. He might decide then he’s not paying for electricity etc but he would suffer from that so I have to think he wouldn’t follow through. She needs to see a solicitor, lots give a free half hour or wa could maybe signpost her.
Do not give up her course. That has to be a last last option. Find out what she needs to prove they are separated and claim uc, or student finance or whatever she can.

WifeOfTiresias · 15/11/2023 15:15

idontlikealdi · 15/11/2023 08:26

She needs to sort the child benefit it's 50-60 sliding scale and he should be filing tax returns to pay the high income charge which I am going to assume he hasn't been doing. Depending how long he has been over the threshold there is going to be a hefty tax bill.

He is abusing her, she should speak to women's aid and a solicitor asap.

She doesn't need to sort out anything with the Child Benefit. She should just keep claiming as she is entitled to as her DC main cater. The higher earner clawback is entirely her DHs responsibility to declare.

As this is her only income at the moment I wouldn't be giving it up.

MayThe4th · 15/11/2023 15:22

I think people are missing the point re the child benefit.

It sounds from what OP is saying that he is claiming the child benefit in his name and it is being paid into his account. Yes he is likely paying the tax on it, but the claim is in his name.

Therefore, if he decides to stop giving the CB to the OP’s friend she is going to be up shit creak, because in order for her to claim the child benefit, he will have to stop his claim. If he chooses not to do that then she won’t be able to claim child benefit.

Mymilkshakebringsallthepapstomycar · 15/11/2023 15:26

Namerequired · 15/11/2023 15:12

I can not believe people are advising she stay with him another year. He is abusing her. Would people advise this if he was beating her? Is that the only kind of abuse that matters still? In this day and age? Because he’s destroying her. Op if she’s telling you she can’t cope anymore, believe her. She’s obviously reached her limit with this awful human being.
Is he claiming the child benefit or is she? Because you said it goes into his account? If she isn’t claiming then she has missed out on those state pension years so that needs rectified (and remembered in the settlement). If it’s in her name, get her to change the account to her own bank account.
Get her to speak to women’s aid and also to her university. I would stop buying and cooking food for him. He might decide then he’s not paying for electricity etc but he would suffer from that so I have to think he wouldn’t follow through. She needs to see a solicitor, lots give a free half hour or wa could maybe signpost her.
Do not give up her course. That has to be a last last option. Find out what she needs to prove they are separated and claim uc, or student finance or whatever she can.

Probably because her studies are her best chance of future independence, and she has around 7 months to go before qualification. It's very common for women to be told to get their ducks in a row before escalating the end of the relationship. This poor woman has got to the end of her tether and told him she wants out before she's really in a position to go and preserve the strides she has made towards financial independence. That's obviously not her fault, he's pushed her to her limits, but it's hard to read that she might need to abandon her studies. There's lots of advice on here for her to apply to defer her course or claim financial assistance to help her to keep going, plus claim UC. No it's not ideal advice to tell a woman not to leave an abuser, but it's also not good advice to escalate a situation in a way that makes living conditions a lot worse and limit your options for escape. She's got nowhere to go, so her "leaving" him still entails her living under the same roof as him.

From the OP's posts, she doesn't claim child benefit. He does, and gives it to her in cash.