To think the Labour Party has lost its mind..

[Certainfailure]

Absolutely fuming with some of the clowns in the Labour Party.
25 points ahead of the Conservatives in the opinion polls.
Starmer slowly making the party electable and moving away from the reputation of the party being a left wing student activist group and terrorist supporters. The next GE theirs to lose.
And now word on the grapevine is that 40 odd MPs are ready to resign from the front bench because of they disagree with Starmer’s stance on a ceasefire. Quite a few labour councillors have already resigned from the party and now stand as independents. Big names like Rayner and Burnham have already stuck their oars in too.
Really cannot believe that a conflict thousands of miles away, albeit tragic, has now assumed more importance than the frightful state of the country. That these people are quite happy to throw away the progress that’s been made electorally for the sake of a frankly almost unsolvable conflict that’s lasted 70 plus years and is incredibly complex whilst the country is rapidly falling apart and in desperate need of change.
If Starmer resigns over this, no way will I ever vote Labour again and I say this as a life long labour voter for the last 35 years. Thought we’d seen the last of Corbyn and his vote losing influence but nope, there he is, with his little pet project, destined to scupper yet another GE for Labour. Anyone feel the same way ?

I totally disagree. Corbyn was increasing the Labour membership and gaining support. But because previously Pig shagging prime minister promised a referendum Tories got in, albeit with the help of the LibDems. Then the mess of the whole thing rumbling on divided the country and Johnson made it clear he would get Brexit done, so the knuckle draggers voted for him while Corbyn would not reveal his stance on Brexit. The media did a number on him and he lost support. The only reason Labour are now electable is because of the shambolic effect the Tories have had on the country. Brexit was always going to cause more problems than it solved, the economy sank and we had the cost of living crisis while it emerged how much corruption was going on in government. It’s nothing to do with Starmer, he has no charisma and while that shouldn’t be an issue, and for me it isn’t, the electability is not his doing. It’s the Tories doing.

Maybe the centrists should fuck off as Labour was established as a left wing party and had totally lost its way. Centrists have historically been the Lib dems.

No resignations yet I note

Fair enough, although I think the Labour Party were established (through the trade unions) to give the working man a political voice, rather than solely as a left wing party.

No it wasn't. It was set up to represent the working class by a coalition of religious groups ( the Quakers) and Trade Unions. It was never set up as a Socialist Left wing party. The Left have never won in elections in the entire history ofvthe Labour Party. If they don't want to win elections, they should be a pressure group, not a political party.

Corbyn has been eurosceptic for his entire time in Parliament. He didn't just turn up. He has been an agitator on the back benches for 40 years. People who had known him for all the time he was an MP did not want to serve in his Cabinet.

I suspect it's because our government isn't actively supporting those.

Well they do / did / will court Chinese, Russian, Saudi, etc money with no issue. I also don't actually recall any politician being asked for their opinions on the actions of the beligerants in the conflicts in Ethiopia, Sudan, Myanmar, etc, so maybe they do actively support them too for all we know.

Or perhaps with large Muslim populations they are just more aware of the nature of the problem and more prepared to stand up for their electorate which is the role of the current elected mp

Interesting, you'd think with over a quarter of a million Yemini Muslims dead at the hands of the Saudi government (plus who knows how many Saudi Muslims too) those elected mps would have stood up for their electorate before and resigned over our continued dealings with the House of Saud.

Wonder what's different here?

Saudi Imams have been the ones who have imported a radical version of Islam into British mosques. When I was young, Muslims never lived like this. We never saw Niqab outside of Kensington. They will never criticise Saudi Arabia, because that's where their funding comes from. The Royal Family love a bit of hobnobbing with the absolute Monarchs of the ME dazzled by their money, power and horses. But not a word about Yemen from any one of these morally principled MP's and councillors.

The fact that there is such a spectrum of views in the main parties is a facet of our stupid electoral system.

Ah yes 97 . In which a mad Christian war monger manages to remain sensible for one term of government.

@MrsSlocombesCat I’m old enough to know that most general elections are like that. Very rarely does a charismatic inspirational leader come along with policies that transcend political lines. Blair maybe was the exception or even Atlee. But back in the day people flitted back and forth between Labour and Conservative usually voting for the least worse option at the time.

They are elected to serve the UK, not the interests of a foreign nation. Their electorate's foreign interests shouldn't even factor into it.

We have enough problems of our own without slapfighting over some war happening half a world away.

10 to 6 and this flood of resignations somehow has not manifested itself.

I wasn't saying they were supporting an electorates foreign interests.

It is reasonable for the electorate to be aware of what is happening in the world and have an opinion on it and expect our nation to stand up for peace and common humanity - we may be an island but no country exists in a vacuum

I was implying that the Muslim community in particular might find the current war someone horrific, closer to home , an empathy for others that some people can't raise

Kind of like the Jewish community in the uk felt on oct 7th you know - a kindred spirit with those harmed

We can hope so, then Labour could turn back to being a socialist-light party like it’s supposed to be instead of the neoliberalist spawn of the devil that Blair and Starmer want. Neoliberalism, just like the liberalism that preceded it, have already caused environmental and social destruction. How much more of it do you want us to swallow? Not to mention the propaganda and lies to the contrary.

Starmers stance on the vast majority of policy decisions align with the Conservative party’s. Give or take some wish-washy non-statements and empty rhetoric on other issues. If Labour comes to power it will be business as usual save for some crumbs thrown to the masses. Anger will remain.

The party that seems to align with your political views are those civilised brutalisers in the Conservative Party OP. I think it says something that you’re willing to turn a blind eye to say the bombing of hospitals including neo-natal units and 99% civilian death rate in Gaza for the sake of an empty political victory.

I for one am proud to a socialist who gives a shit about alleviating the suffering of others.

Thought we’d seen the last of Corbyn and his vote losing influence but nope, there he is, with his little pet project, destined to scupper yet another GE for Labour

Thing is, OP, the Corbynista types don't go away; they just lurk waiting for their next chance while the more moderate members try to keep them hidden so as not to frighten off too many voters

Frankly, anyoone who imagines antisemitism in the Labour party has been "dealt wwith" is kidding themselves; they're too wedded to "minority interests" for that, and Jewish people certainly aren't their preferred minority

Overall I agree once again with Noicant. Starmer's stance may upset the far left, but they've got nowhere else to go anyway, and it just may work with many floating voters who prefer moderation to hate

Very rarely does a charismatic inspirational leader come along with policies that transcend political lines. Blair maybe was the exception or even Atlee

Indeed, and whatever we each think of him personally, Blair won three elections whereas Corbyn led his party to the worst electoral defeat in the thick end of a century

Frustrating for the ultra left headbangers, I know, but the inconvenient fact remains that the electorate tend not to like extremists - which is why, with too many of them in government right now, so many of us are politically homeless

Overall I agree once again with Noicant. Starmer's stance may upset the far left, but they've got nowhere else to go anyway, and it just may work with many floating voters who prefer moderation to hate

They have loads if places to go ( Workers Party/Socialist Workers Party/Communist Party etc) they just don't want to go.

At the end of the day, when voting, the electorates almost always votes on the basis of domestic not foreign policy. The Falklands War being an exception, and that was a war we were involved with. Palestine on the whole will not be at the forefront of most voters minds when they vote. Luckily the Tories are busy tearing themselves to pieces over Suella Braverman. Some activists may care about this but most people will forget. Including those on the marches in a years time. Because we can't do anything about it. Netenyahu couldn't care less about what the British Labour Party says. Hamas love the marches all over the places filled with people in Hamas scarves as a fashion accessory. But other than that, they don't care either.

True enough, Angrycat, but I was thinking more of parties who'd stand any hope at all of forming a government, and if people wouldn't have Corbyn I can't quite see the SWP/Communists making the cut

This. This is just standard lefty moaning in Labour. It's always been there. They are just very pissed that they are no longer in charge.

No resignations yet. How unsurprising.

This is just standard lefty moaning in Labour.

A city's mosque leaders are urging Labour councillors to ask Sir Keir Starmer to resign for refusing to back a Gaza ceasefire.

Preston's 20 mosques have set a deadline of 17:00 GMT for councillors to sign a letter calling for him to go.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-67375322

Yeah. This so isn't going to happen. There are literally biographies of left Labour politicians who made a career out of this. If Keir Starmer can't handle a few Labour councillors then he has bigger problems. It's a good test of leadership which every successful Labour leader has to do.

a recent survey by Muslim Census of 29,000 responses suggests 66 per cent of Muslim voters would no longer back Labour in the next general election.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/british-muslims-gaza-palestine-starmer-b2442555.html