To ask what should happen now? DD attacked by other students

[RainInNovember]

DD is 15, shes had a few issues with people, got into a few arguments, nothing major and mainly over whatsapp etc, she does seem to get involved in the drama. But a lot of her friends are similar and there are often fallings out but then friends again the next week.

I just had a message from dd at school. she said two girls who she used to be friends with have waited outside her lesson for her and followed her. once she was on her own they put a coat over her head and started punching her in the head and pulling her hair and dragging her about.

she has told school and she said the girls are currently in isolation, I have called school who said they're investigating now and will call me back shortly.

I have never dealt with anything like this before. I just want to know what to expect and how seriously they should take it.

I'm not sure of your point - because you know a school with even worse discipline then OP should be grateful?
Our DC was hurt at school. It was an accident - although the other DC had behaved irresponsibly. The other DC was given a two-day exclusion. For something like OP is describing, both pupils would have been excluded for at least five days.

No, not grateful

Just showing the different approaches and the luck of the draw as to the way 'incidents' are handled (or not)

And whilst you'd think suspension is the right approach, apparently (according to DGC) the children like that because it's 'holiday' At least internal isolation is boring and keeps them off the streets

Double good luck then.

If they're crap it's very hard to do anything about it

@Nanny0gg Ah, ok. Yy in our school the DCs' attitude to suspension is impacted by the parents' view of it. Although I do know some DCs who have said it was like a holiday but their parents said something completely different. And those DCs haven't misbehaved since so it did seem to deter them.

The good thing about suspension is that it inconveniences the perpetrators' parents.

I'm not being sarcastic. In the days when my LA did allow some temporary exclusions, the threat of an exclusion did make some parents reassess their attitude.

Many years ago, I was at a meeting with a parent whose darling boy had made comments of a sexual nature to me. He was at our school as the result of a placing request and had a long history of disruptive behaviour.

The purpose of the meeting was merely to get the mother to acknowledge that there was a problem and to extract a promise that his behaviour would improve. The mother was quite intransigent until the Depute said: "Fair enough. Then we'll just exclude him for a week and you'll be stuck at home with him all day."

She caved.

The Depute would get into trouble for saying that nowadays, of course, and my LA no longer allows schools to issue such exclusions.

I think you should contact the police again OP and explain the two further assaults that have happened today. The police saying "their hands are tied" isn't good enough. What's the issue stopping them from taking it further? At the very least they could go and speak to the girls and their parents and give you and your DD a plan of action in case it happens again.

The school have got to either disappoint you, or the parents of the other girls. They're currently probably trying to work out which route will be the easiest. Make sure it's not you.

That's infuriating. The head of year is victim blaming and insinuating trouble for your daughter for her reaction to repeatedly being assaulted and threatened.

Why shouldn't a 15 y/o victim seek advice and comfort from their mum when assaulted?

The truth is he doesn't want her to tell you anything, because he wants to keep the assaults under wraps.

It's like all these brutal school beating videos that end up on social media and in the press: the schools' reactions are usually self-righteous declarations that filming itself will be banned, and anyone caught filming or sharing such incidents will be punished severely.

This benefits absolutely NOBODY but the schools themselves and the perpetrators. It encourages a culture of silence and violence.

This.

My experience as a middle manager in a school tells me that it's the so-called 'pushy parent' who is listened to.

I'm not suggesting that you go down this route straight away, OP, but if you have legal insurance you might consider a lawyer's letter?

Agreed, @slore .

Recently a video showing an attack in a region where I used to work went viral in Scotland. The Director of Education made the usual statement about keeping young people safe and the challenges caused by Covid.

In actual fact, such assaults in the region have been going on for years - it's just that they weren't filmed.

One of the things that I don't miss since giving up my full-time job is stopping assaults. Mind you, even as a supply teacher I've had to do that once. Frankly, I'm now too old and unfit for it. (Arthritis slows me up these days.)

Dd just had a message from a boy in her class saying RE teacher was doing a new seating plan and Girl 1 said can (dd) sit next to me, we're best mates!!

And Girl 1 & 2 bragging in two different lessons to people about the attack.

I'm going in tomorrow I've had enough

I'd keep her off until this is sorted out satisfactorily. Imagine if you had to go into work knowing that your colleagues had recently put a coat over your head and punched you repeatedly, and were barging you as you moved about the building, and engineering ways to get in physical proximity to you. There is absolutely no way we would expect adults to deal with this shit, it's ridiculous.

My friend recently pulled her teen DD out of school after a long and sustained string of incidents involving physical attacks and intimidation which the school were determined to play down. She wishes she had gone in harder from the start but she trusted the school to do the right thing, yet the only thing they were focussed on was covering their arse. You're only going to get one chance to sort this out, do what you need to do.

Complain to the governors tell them you are involving the local authority and Ofsted about safeguarding. And then follow through. Sometimes schools only act when their reputation becomes a factor.

I can't empathise enough how difficult you should be.

I would make a guess that both of these girls have parents who are difficult too. You need to be demanding; institutions like schools often shaft reasonable people because they are scared of the other side who looks more difficult. In some ways it's like dealing with a bully yourself. You have to hit them far far harder than they did to make sure that they know to leave you alone for good.

Absolutely this.

Keep going higher and higher. Make formal complaints to everyone you can think of.

There is anarchy in some schools and these schools appear to without the means to ensure discipline is upheld. This is very frightening for the future of this country. The Kids concerned might come in next time and attack someone with a weapon who knows a 'Pepper Spray a Taser or a Knife'. This is not me scare mongering . The kids concerned are not at all bothered about their conduct. Putting a coat over someones head really concerns me. This is not spear of the moment falling out stuff but organised gang type stuff !

The school need to get a grip very quickly or this could get out of control very quickly. Putting anything over someones face is a serious act and has connotations of being 'kidnapped' robbed or being pulled out of a car.

If at all possible take your husband or another adult with you? Again, with my former middle manager hat on, you need an adult witness with you.

Also, as I've said before, you may need to lawyer up. (A letter should be sufficient.)

ETA I am so bloody angry on your behalf. I've seen so much of this shit over the years.

There will be decent staff in the school, but their hands are tied. You need to become 'that' parent - push like mad.

I'll reiterate: when you go in @RainInNovember ask whether risk assessments have been put in place for the perpetrators. They won't be allowed to give you that info, but it'll worry them - it'll show them that you've done your homework.

Ask them what safety measures they've put in place to protect your daughter's physical and mental wellbeing.

They might well try to fob you off with an offer to change your daughter's classes and to let her leave classes and/or school early to avoid the bullies. That's not acceptable, in my view. It happens a lot - it's putting the onus on the victim to modify their behaviour/routine rather than the perpetrators.

Bluntly, if anyone should be inconvenienced or distressed by a change of timetable, it should be the thugs.

@RainInNovember

Write down all your facts and evidence, then present it tomorrow.

The bit about the girl asking that your DD sits next to her in RE etc... is just further evidence of the bullying. The RE teacher will no doubt be able to back that up.

I work in a school and a girl in my Y7 tutor group was being picked on and physically bullied. Needless to say that the two main culprits had quite a hefty suspension and will be re-suspended should they so much as breathe near her when they get back.

Schools need to gather evidence, so your daughter's friends are doing a great job of helping gather more evidence.

As that would be an extreme example, yes they would be permanently excluded.

But the other poster is incorrect many acts of ABH and GBH do not see pupils permanently excluded.

Many will either stay within the same school, be given a managed move or pushed in to Alt provision.

But permanently excluding child has become much harder and is not easy to do.

Towriteyoumustlive.

I hear stories like this all the time from my DD2 who is a teacher in a Inner City Comprehensive. It is actually frightening and everybody just seems to want to brush it under the carpet.

It is not 'normal' falling out to put a jacket over someones head. It is very serious and anyone who does that is a serious risk or needs the fear of god putting in to them.

I feel sorry for some kids who end up facing the sternest, consequences from schools. These kids often stand up to this ongoing subversive bullying. Often they are the ones who end up Suspended or Excluded because they are the ones who are seen hitting the bullies !

The schools are unaware or most likely do not want to know what is going on. I think teachers are frightened !

The fact she wants to do law is a reason to escalate it even more IMO to make sure it is recorded with the police. Insist on the police that you want them to charged - one punch in the head could kill. Do you want a solicitor who punched someone in the head so much for caring about the rights of others.

Doesnt matter on school or out of school have the police involved and insist on a criminal charge of assault. 15 is too old to put up with this kind of behaviour.

it was premeditated and designed to terrify - I imagine your DD was traumatised even if she is masking. Phone the police back and insist on them taking responsibility and the same with the headteacher.

in my experience one day exclusion is not enough - she will be back tomorrow and pissed off - in my experience kids need to be shown boundaries and the no police action could set up a bully for life eg I punched someone police weren’t interested!

They are heading towards a harassment charge. If your dd has evidence of the shoving in the corridor from the girl who tried to get her next to her in RE then that’s already 3 events. Harassment is 2 or more. I would be back on to the police if school do not get this sorted tomorrow. As pp said, any change in class/ routine should be done by the bullies not your dd.

You realise you can't insist the police charge on anything, it's for them investigate and decide on the outcome of that- not anyone else.

There’s a lot of poor info on this thread. Every single head has the power to exclude. LAs never make this decision. And no, the police do not charge for a first offence. See attached.