to not like DH to snap his belt at DC, even in a jokey way?

[Pollyputtheteaon]

Today DC was being a bit challenging so DH snapped his belt at her pretending he was going to hit her with it. I have genuinely never in my life heard a belt be snapped and it's quite loud! He had folded it in half and sort of pulled it taut and slackened it to make the noise.

I have always associated that sort of gesture with domestic violence and it isn't a theme (even as a joke, not that one should joke about it) I want in our home. DC is only 7 months so she won't understand at all but I feel like if I don't mention it it's just something he might do later?

I asked DH conversationally if it was something his dad did and if he was ever hit. He said sometimes. DH very rarely talks about his dad and he died before DH and I even met. But from the sounds of it MIL was controlled, DH was hit. Before I knew this, MIL came across as quite a nervous, timid lady and I cAn definitely see how that happened... Anyway DH always says he is very different from his dad or he will describe his dad as a very traditional man etc. DH is generally a very gentle person and i don't think I've ever heard him even raise his voice. My own dad is very similar and quite a gentle giant, he never raised his hand or even when fighting with my mum he never came across menacing. That's just some background.

AIBU to tell DH not to snap his belt ever again meaning someone was going to get hit, even in a jokey way?

That's reminded me that my mum used to storm out of the house when she was angry at us, telling us she was going to live in a house with nice children. I was always absolutely terrified.

This all seems to have been forgotten by her now.

Why do people always suggest leaving as a knee jerk reaction? If OP leaves the partner will get sole charge of the child at least every other weekend possibly 50:50. At least if they are together she can keep an eye on things.
And no a court will not stop a father having contact with his child based on this incident

Of course she has ‘forgotten’. Abusers often ‘forget’ their own behaviour. Yet more examples of gaslighting!

My stepdad did the snapping belt thing once when I was a kid, I've never forgotten it and it's one of the (many) reasons I hate him.

I disagree, whether he would actually hit the child is not the point (I hope he wouldn't actually hit a baby with a belt!)

It's the response to an upset, crying baby of a threat of physical violence rather than comforting and trying to help them that demonstrates the issue here.

If your father said he would brain you when you were crying because you were ill or in pain, because he was annoyed that you were crying that would be bad.

If he said it in joking exasperation when you had misbehaved that is slightly different

Even if he never raises a hand to the child, if he doesn't have the instinct to love and comfort rather than control and punish their normal behaviour, they cannot have a good relationship.

It’s horrifying that he threatened a 7 month old like that, even as a “joke”.
He absolutely has to learn correct parenting. If he finds the completely normal crying of a 7 month old helpless infant “challenging”, how the hell will he cope when she’s two years old and being genuinely challenging? Or when she’s 10 and asserting her own personality?

Men who do and say things like this are a real concern, because real aggression is often disguised as jokes. But you seem to be more worried about not “micromanaging” him. When it comes to a child’s welfare, if you have to micromanage, so be it.

Please get some support it is extremely concerning to hear of an adult threatening a baby. Honestly if she was mine he wouldn't be getting near her until he completed a parenting course. Nobody is that naive to know that his behaviour is not acceptable. Your poor baby.

Hello all,

Just wanted to update about the chat I had with DH.

I told him that it was the first time I had never heard a belt snap, and I would like the same reality for our daughter. I said it isn't a theme that I want to even joke about in our home. And also how at some point babies will be aware of what we're doing but not be able to understand that it's a joke and he will inadvertently frighten her. He was completely supportive and said he wouldn't ever do it again.

Like another PP advised, I didn't bring up the therapy or his past in that same conversation. However, since then I've been chatting about how my own childhood might be skewing my perspective on things and DH also said he's been thinking about the same.
Edit: forgot to mention that he said "this might give me an insight into his childhood" and I said if he did ever want to talk some more he can feel safe talking about it with me

That’s a positive outcome and I’m glad he is in agreement.

That sounds positive OP. Thanks for the update.

Good start, OP. However, what did you mean about "you don't disagree well" before?

It sounds like you are tiptoeing around his feelings a lot, including in this conversation. You are putting it out there about your own perspective possibly being skewed, hoping he will pick up the hints and engage about his own. But are you afraid of more direct communication with him? Of "setting him off" in some way?

Mien your dc crying awoke a bad memory. Maybe he was reminding himself of that noise and reinforcing to himself he would never be like his df... Don't let a non event ruin your relationship.. I quite often say I will sell or give away my teens but it is just talk.. And nobody would bloody have them. They aren't scarred...

Our disagreements sometimes escalate into full blown arguments. It isn't DH that is "set off". When I'm triggered I get really furious and cry and start shouting. DH almost never raises his voice. He never likes speaking about difficult things, and if he can he will bury his head in the sand forever.

In terms of being afraid of more direct communication. He can get quite defensive about his family and so if I choose my words carefully he will be receptive, if not he might go into defense mode. It isn't entirely his fault, I haven't been kind in the past about his family. But it's because I was finding him trying to get me involved in his family (hanging with his mum and sister) irritating. We have nothing in common and I just wanted to have cute dates with DH rather than spend an afternoon with his family.

My grandad used to snap his belt like that, either pretending to chase me/bro around to 'get' us or we'd stick our fingers in the gap and try to pull it away before he snapped it, so I wouldn't have a problem if it was done jokily like that, but not at 7m ffs 🤣

FFs what a load of drama llamas on here. Did you missthe bit where the OP says he said it in a jokey way with a jokey face. The baby is 7 m old! She isnt going to understand or be afraid and it is a maasive stretch to think he would threaten let alone hit her when she is old enough to understand!

What if it had slipped from his grip and hit your baby??? I helped a man who’d been whipped in the head with a belt buckle in the street and the amount of blood was horrific, I can’t imagine what it would do to a child. That’s before you unpack threatening a baby with physical violence instead of offering comfort or feeling violent towards a baby.

I’m intrigued that you have nothing in common with his Mum and sister- you have your DH and now your DC in common, don’t you?

But more fundamentally, how has your DH turned out to be someone you love and connect with so strongly if you can’t find any common ground at all with his family? Did he leave home very young and get an education and career that has set him apart from his family?

My own in-laws are very different to my DH in many ways (eg one sibling in law is a vegan climate change campaigner and DH is a meat-loving city type) but there is something shared via their upbringing that means I can see in the siblings some of the qualities I love in my DH. Similarly, my brother and I lead very different lives but we have a very similar sense of humour.

This is just musing I guess, perhaps they are lacking shared positive qualities from their childhood because it was fearful and abusive.

I totally agree that the belt-snapping thing is way over the line, and you were right to demand a talk about it, and to be watchful going forward, but, really? A zombie movie on the TV? At 7 months they don't know the difference between that and Peppa Pig.

What are you on about?? It’s not a joke, it’s not funny in any way.

Threatening to injure a little baby is no joke at all, particularly when coming from someone who has first hand experience of being assaulted in that way himself.

A smile on his face is meaningless given his words and actions.

Well, you have insight into which aspects of your own behaviour are less desirable - shouting, being reactive - although you are allowed to have feelings and express them. And it is frustrating when an avoidant person doesn't share their own feelings. But you have obviously moved on from those kinds of outbursts and are now very consciously modifying yourself around him. Hopefully not too much?

How much insight do you think he has into his own behaviour and personality type? The expectations of compliance and not rocking the boat around his family members must be connected, too, to how he grew up, even though his mother was not the abuser.

You seem to feel suggesting therapy for him would be overstepping the mark or poorly received. The feelings must be very complex - it's not just about the father who's not there any more, but also about the mother who could not protect the children, and he also could not protect her. Good therapy really would help.

Just to add, the issue with "DD being challenging" is that locating the problem with the 7 month old, who has no other means of expression than crying, is the kind of thing that sometimes precedes justifications of violence, "she was pushing my buttons" kind of thing.

Of course the choice of words itself wouldn't be an issue if someone said "DD was being challenging, I needed a break from the crying so I put her in the cot and walked out of the room and counted to ten." But when the next step is to pick up a belt and say "she'll get it if she doesn't stop" then yes it's disturbing. The knee-jerk reaction is "things which irritate Daddy must be stopped".

And already, you, OP, are picking up that message that Daddy must be protected from all unpleasant feelings. Children definitely absorb this, too, and without adult levels of insight they may blame themselves when things go wrong and he either confuses them with threats of violence or avoids them emotionally.

@Pollyputtheteaon I still remember the first time my mum hit me with a belt. Imagine someone being flogged with a whip. I was five years old.

Mum died back in September and despite phone conversations I hadn't seen her in 14 years. Is that the future you want for your child?

Think long and hard about your future with him. Be strong for your child. Wishing you you and your baby all the best

Until we had DS we never really talked about our respective childhoods with regard to parenting and discipline and the disparity between the parenting styles of our parents was vast. I'd always thought that the awful stuff I and my siblings experienced were of the times, but realising DH had a very different experience - and a really good one, despite having parents of the same era, ethos, religion, and background, it shocked me. My siblings are on a similar journey of enlightenment. Some of us have had therapy and others are strongly considering it. But he's got you, and he seems very willing to learn and understand so that's great.

When I'm triggered I get really furious and cry and start shouting. DH almost never raises his voice. He never likes speaking about difficult things, and if he can he will bury his head in the sand forever.

I've a couple of suggestions from my own experiences. I'm naturally quite emotional and know I can get reactive. But I also know that my initial reaction is often not the best approach. So, when we have a disagreement, often we park it temporarily to consider the issue. And we always park it if we feel ourselves getting angry. We've a no-shouting rule, and have stuck to that for the last 18 years bar once or twice.

I realised some years ago that all my emotions initially present as anger, and by reminding myself of that, I feel out what is the driving emotion - fear? frustration? envy? sadness? taken for granted? and I can then explore why I'm feeling that way and begin to structure what I want to say, and by labelling my emotion it really helps me verbalise it effectively without getting upset.

Our aim in these discussions always is to listen to each other and find a common ground - we may not agree with the other but we respectfully give their views our full attention. Our secondary aim is to find a ground somewhere in the middle that both of us can live with.

When I get stressed, I can veer towards being panicky and tearful. I find that I can successfully diffuse that feeling by cracking a joke about it or a bit of dark humour. That allows me to focus on the issue at hand and it's kind of morphed into into a valued skill that I use in my job as well as in my relationship.

DH had an ex that would go apeshit at the littlest things so he started off burying or ignoring issues with me. However, over time seeing my approach I think he has found it easier to talk about stuff that he used to bury or ignore. So a healthier dynamic grew out of knowing I would not fly off the handle if he wanted to broach something.

We don't always get it perfect but I am pretty proud of how we communicate especially now our DS is older and learning to express his own issues in a healthy way. So maybe that's another focus - you and he need to work on a better communication style so that you can model that to your DD.

Cannot stand being called a 'drama llama' it is purely a way to invalidate people. If you don't agree, fine but it doesn't mean others are wrong or they should be put down for sharing their experience.

Many of us have experience of this exact situation. And if you have you know there is more to it than purely a 'joke'.