Page 6 | Is this appropriate for a teaching assistant?

loiss85 · 2023-11-03T12:55:15+00:00

If you found out that your 15/16 year old child (in Year 11) had been to a birthday party at the home of their class teaching assistant (the party being for the TA's child, a classmate of your child), and alcohol and vaping had taken place at this party which was actively condoned by the TA, how would you feel? Is this appropriate conduct for a TA?

Froooty · 03/11/2023 22:59

loiss85 · 03/11/2023 12:59

The TA provided some of the alcohol and certainly had a very permissive, casual attitude to it being drunk in her home.

Complaint to the school and head teacher. In writing. Immediately. This is sack-worthy behaviour, no question, the TA needs frog-marching out the school gates.

tiggergoesbounce · 03/11/2023 23:06

No, It is not in any way "bizarre" to want to remain anonymous, on an anonymous forum .... 🙈😂

But i very much doubt it would be outing to explain what part you play in this situation that you seek advice on and in my opinion, yes it is bizzare.

HateMyselfToo · 03/11/2023 23:21

There's bound to be alcohol and vaping with that age range.
The teaching assistant was very naive to put themselves in that position. As a parent, it's kinda understandable, as a TA foolish.
I'd either tell my offspring that due to my position I'll have to have a zero tolerance approach to anything underage happening, host it elsewhere so not on my property, or say vapers or drinkers need parental permission (some won't mind.)

Motherofacertainage · 03/11/2023 23:27

It depends on the relationship between the parents of the guests and the TA. For example as her child is in the same academic year she may well know them outside her role at school and therefore have very different relationships with them. If you are not one of the parents of the guests it's definitely not your business. Yes the boundaries are blurred in this scenario but those calling for the TA to be sacked should bear in mind the chronic shortage of TAs especially in secondary. If their conduct at work is professional then they are worth clinging on to at almost any cost. They are paid a pittance, nowhere near the same as teachers so should not be held to the same standards.
.

donquixotedelamancha · 03/11/2023 23:50

loiss85 · 03/11/2023 16:53

*It's got nothing to do with her being a TA

It's to do with her being a parent who's values you don't share.*

It's got everything to do with her being a TA - that's the whole basis of my question. The role she is in relative to these children makes her conduct inappropriate, in my opinion. It's nothing to do with parenting values - I couldn't give a toss what she allows with her own kids. But she should not be condoning underage drinking amongst the kids she teaches. That's a professional boundary breach to me.

It's not underage drinking. It's perfectly legal to drink in a private home in the UK from age 5.

donquixotedelamancha · 03/11/2023 23:55

loiss85 · 03/11/2023 16:40

@pinksavannah

That's not strictly true though is it. She's a TA regardless and there are codes of conduct that professionals are expected to adhere to outside of that context too. For example, if I were a social worker or therapist, and I drank socially with one of my clients but I only did so outside of working hours and away from the office, my conduct would still rightly be called into question. It's a conflict of interest

No, there aren't. TAing is not a profession. There are no statutory codes of conduct.

I don't think you are unreasonable to say there is potential for problems in what the TA was allowing in her home but you are being very unrealistic in your expectations of 'standards' for a low paid job.

AuntieObnoxious · 04/11/2023 00:06

Most parties of Yr 11 students involve alcohol & vaping. At this point she is a parent not a TA.
All parties, according to my kids, are like this & to be honest once I was about 16 all the parties I went to had alcohol and ‘fags’.

OP why do you think her child should have a different party to their peers because their parent is a TA?
What were the parties you went to at that age like OP?

GreenAppleCrumble · 04/11/2023 00:53

The thing I’m struggling with is the idea that 16 year olds are definitely going to vape. Why exactly?! No one smokes any more. Why on earth do they need to vape at a party? If the host says ‘no vaping’ are they seriously unable to follow that?!

ACGTHelixA · 04/11/2023 01:08

loiss85 · 03/11/2023 16:53

*It's got nothing to do with her being a TA

It's to do with her being a parent who's values you don't share.*

It's got everything to do with her being a TA - that's the whole basis of my question. The role she is in relative to these children makes her conduct inappropriate, in my opinion. It's nothing to do with parenting values - I couldn't give a toss what she allows with her own kids. But she should not be condoning underage drinking amongst the kids she teaches. That's a professional boundary breach to me.

in the uk in private premises under the law, it is not counted as underage for drinking, its only if in pubs, and so on, that it needs to be 18 and over

Mopbucketmoo · 04/11/2023 06:10

Did the t.a/mum ask you if your child was allowed to have alcohol and vape?
My son was 17 last month and his friends are between 16-18, he had a small gathering at our home for his friends. I said I would provide a small bit of alcohol (kopparbergs and Buds) for the kids who were allowed it and double checked with their parents before hand to gauge what the situation was, and a couple of them were allowed 2 small bottles each. Would never have served alcohol to older teens without double checking with parents first, think it was irresponsible of her to do so whether she is a t a or not is irrelevant

electriclight · 04/11/2023 06:31

If you are genuinely concerned that children might be at risk, you yourself can report this as a safeguarding concern directly to your local safeguarding hub. In fact, you have a responsibility to do that I am worried that you haven't done it already.

If you do not think that any children are at risk, but you think that it was unwise for her to supervise such a party, you should call her school to put your mind at rest and let them handle it from there.

They will investigate and take it from there. What happens next can only be pure speculation on here as op has heard this information third hand. The TA would need an opportunity to explain her side of the story and it may well be a different, more sensible one than op has heard.

However, op does not read like someone who is genuinely concerned for a child's safety, but as a gossipy parent or disgruntled colleague who really just primarily wants to cause trouble for this member of staff.

rwalker · 04/11/2023 06:48

Well yes you could argue about professional boundaries
but sounds like a normal teenage party hats of for them for stay and supervising

the other alternative which no doubt would of solved the problem would of been for the TA to clear off out and leave them to it getting up to god knows what and drinking all sorts un supervised

personally I’d prefer a parent there but each to there own

Petrarkanian · 04/11/2023 08:01

I'm a TA in a secondary school, we talk about this scenario a lot, as a few of us have kids at the school. We know that providing alcohol to underage kids is a safe guarding concern so we don't.

Thats it, you don't give kids you work with alcohol, of course you don't.

I really can't believe anyone finds this acceptable.

Original poster

loiss85 · 04/11/2023 08:06

AuntieObnoxious · 04/11/2023 00:06

Most parties of Yr 11 students involve alcohol & vaping. At this point she is a parent not a TA.
All parties, according to my kids, are like this & to be honest once I was about 16 all the parties I went to had alcohol and ‘fags’.

OP why do you think her child should have a different party to their peers because their parent is a TA?
What were the parties you went to at that age like OP?

Parties I went to at that age were similar except for the key difference that my teacher was not pouring my drinks when I was underage whilst I went "thanks miss" 🙄 all kinds of weird.

OP posts:

Original poster

loiss85 · 04/11/2023 08:07

HateMyselfToo · 03/11/2023 23:21

There's bound to be alcohol and vaping with that age range.
The teaching assistant was very naive to put themselves in that position. As a parent, it's kinda understandable, as a TA foolish.
I'd either tell my offspring that due to my position I'll have to have a zero tolerance approach to anything underage happening, host it elsewhere so not on my property, or say vapers or drinkers need parental permission (some won't mind.)

Thank you! I'd have to the same approach too if I were a TA with a teenage child wanting a party with the kids I teach.

OP posts:

Original poster

loiss85 · 04/11/2023 08:09

tiggergoesbounce · 03/11/2023 23:06

No, It is not in any way "bizarre" to want to remain anonymous, on an anonymous forum .... 🙈😂

But i very much doubt it would be outing to explain what part you play in this situation that you seek advice on and in my opinion, yes it is bizzare.

Yes it most definitely would be outing, you'll have to take my word for that I'm afraid. I will not be bullied into providing information just to satisfy some nosy posters, when it's of zero relevance to the answering the question I've asked in my OP. Nobody needs that information to answer my question.

OP posts:

Catsanfan · 04/11/2023 09:27

You've had plenty of answers now, what is your plan of action?

Mumof2teens79 · 04/11/2023 09:47

GreenAppleCrumble · 04/11/2023 00:53

The thing I’m struggling with is the idea that 16 year olds are definitely going to vape. Why exactly?! No one smokes any more. Why on earth do they need to vape at a party? If the host says ‘no vaping’ are they seriously unable to follow that?!

Yes, unfortunately.
Too many kids and young adults have started vaping, when they never have smoked.
Not all of them, but certainly as many or more than smoked when I was at school 30 yrs ago.
They vape in the toilets at school throughout the day.

I didn't allow it in my home, but I also wasn't hovering or circulating round the garden to make sure they didn't.

CharlotteBog · 04/11/2023 09:49

Catsanfan · 04/11/2023 09:27

You've had plenty of answers now, what is your plan of action?

Yes, I'm curious too.
I understand you can do what the hell you like (within reason) on a anonymous forum and you owe no one anything but it would be nice to respond to the people who have engaged in your thread.

Nanny0gg · 04/11/2023 09:51

loiss85 · 03/11/2023 16:37

Just to be clear to those calling me "pearl clutching" and so on. It's not the providing of alcohol for 16 year olds per se that I am saying I disagree with. It's doing so when you're in a position of trust and work in a professional capacity to the child. I'm asking what people's views are on that specific scenario.

So what would you have thought if she'd been in a pub and had seen pupils in there drinking?

Nanny0gg · 04/11/2023 09:53

caramac04 · 03/11/2023 13:54

As a former TA I would have lost my job if my employer had found I’d allowed this at my house.

On what grounds?

Where in your contract does it dictate what you do in your home?

And presumably the students had their parents permission to go to the party

Sartre · 04/11/2023 09:54

LadyMonicaBaddingham · 03/11/2023 13:03

I am flabbergasted that a TA is allowed to work in the same YEAR GROUP as their own child, let alone in their actual class?! This has been directly against policy in every school I've worked in or with.

Commonplace. Our HOY had a daughter in our year so we always had to be careful when slagging her off…

Obviously the TA was hugely unprofessional here and needs reporting.

Nanny0gg · 04/11/2023 09:55

livvymc · 03/11/2023 16:53

Is her role actually TA? Around here, Year 11 would not have a TA in the class. In fact they stop at primary school level

No they don't.

Lots of TAs in secondary (and they teach classes there too, just like in primary)

Nanny0gg · 04/11/2023 09:55

loiss85 · 03/11/2023 16:53

*It's got nothing to do with her being a TA

It's to do with her being a parent who's values you don't share.*

It's got everything to do with her being a TA - that's the whole basis of my question. The role she is in relative to these children makes her conduct inappropriate, in my opinion. It's nothing to do with parenting values - I couldn't give a toss what she allows with her own kids. But she should not be condoning underage drinking amongst the kids she teaches. That's a professional boundary breach to me.

Show me a contract that covers that.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 04/11/2023 11:18

Nanny0gg · 04/11/2023 09:55

Show me a contract that covers that.

Show quote history

Don't need 'Do not give alcohol to children when they've been invited to your house' as part of the T&Cs of employment. The Staff Code of Conduct may well do so, however.

See also KCSIE 2023 - Part 4, 356-357 specify concerns about staff and that what they do 'includes behaviour that may have happened outside of school or college' as a transferable risk.