Friends surrogacy

[Fatcat00]

Not a particularly close friend, but friend enough for me to be invited to social events etc. has recently told me she is having a baby due in April, I was shocked and congratulated her, she then says “surrogate… obviously”. I was a bit lost for words.

for context friend has recently divorced, they had been trying for a baby for 5 years, had IVF etc. I furthered the conversation and asked if it was her egg. Her response was “nah, I’m not bothered if it’s not my biological baby.. I just want a baby”. Followed by “I can’t be assed putting hormones into my body for the sake of my own egg”. I am just so shocked and speechless, I don’t agree with surrogacy for a number of reasons. Some of them being I don’t agree with the hiring of a woman’s body. I don’t agree with a baby being ripped away from its mother to suit someone else’s needs and the physical and psychological implications to both baby and mother as such. Why not just adopt?? If you don’t care for the child to be your biological anyway, why not adopt a baby who needs a parent?

it’s kind of made me look at her in a different light. She seemed very flippant about it (I’m aware this is just how she has came across I’m sure it’s a lengthy and draining process). She says she was put in touch with this woman through a friend who had used her.

essentially, this surrogate has just got pregnant for the purpose of handing over the baby to someone else in exchange for cash. I think I’d still be a bit 🤔 even if it was her own egg if truth be told.

I just can’t get my head around it. Am I being a bit of a bigot? Aibu to want to distance myself a bit? I don’t like feeling as though someone’s path to parenthood or happiness is “wrong” but it really doesn’t sit right with me and I’m not entirely sure why.

like what if a woman becomes pregnant and dies without a will

Even if you just stick with this example, if a surrogate dies in child birth without a will or without anything in place, her partner is the baby’s legal parent. There have been cases where the baby has remained with the partner and not given to the intended parents. So imagine the difficulty solving this problem on its own, without even looking at the infinite other possibilities of what could go wrong.

People who are pro-surrogacy need to acknowledge that they believe either

a) there are a multitude of things that could go wrong but they’re not prepared to do the work to solve them or
b) there are a multitude of things that could go wrong, including death, but they don’t care.

I wouldn't be friends with anyone who is a human trafficker. If I bought an adult, there would be outrage. Why does the age of the human being bought or sold make a difference?

Can someone explain to me why it's traumatic for a surrogate baby to be taken from its biological mother, so traumatic for the baby that it's inhumane.

But for adopted babies it's fine?

Parking all other arguments for one moment, am I missing something or is the above argument a contradiction?

Anyone who actually knows anything about adoption will tell you it’s not fine and adopted children need an incredible amount of support for all kinds of reasons.

But the people who typically reply ‘just adopt’ as if it’s the simplest thing in the world for all concerned rarely have any real knowledge about what it entails.

@HunterBidensBurnerPhone could you link to this research please?
Given how many babies used to lose their mother's at birth I'm really skeptical about such claims. It seems extraordinarily maladaptive to fail to bond with the people providing you with love and care just because you emerged from a different vagina.

It’s not fine . It’s a major decision that is known to cause trauma. And as such, to remove a baby from its mother and put the baby in foster care and up for adoption requires a Family Court judge to decide it’s best for baby. And judges only decide it’s necessary in absolute circumstances.

But not in surrogacy. The baby is just handed over.

That's the problem for me, when it comes to child protection we recognise the gravity of removing a newborn from their mother and try to avoid it unless absolutely necessary but it surrogate babies are somehow different?

Do people really think the fluffy intentions of the adults involved make a difference to the baby?

I would like to see some evidence about this trauma. Yes babies do bond with the smells and tastes of the birth mother but when they’re first born they very quickly attach to whoever looks after them. That’s why within the first month or so you don’t have all those attachment sleep issues.

Personally I think a good surrogate relationship can be wonderful. There is also the greater good of loving parents providing a baby with a home. Of course there can be major issues with the idea but it doesn’t mean it can’t work out for the people who do it properly.

Absolutely. That’s the most important part.

Of course, but there is a difference between a woman getting pregnant for her own sake and a pregnancy being commissioned which otherwise wouldn’t have taken place.

That greater good doesn’t exist in surrogacy because the baby wouldn’t exist without the commission- in adoption the baby exists already and the adoptive parent does a great thing for it.

Anti surrogacy is no better than anti abortion views. People are policing what women can do with their bodies.

I actually tend to agree. Clearly most people have never met a grown woman desperate to be a surrogate.

I also find it strange how some of these people are pro abortion up until birth but then think surrogacy is cruel.

I think we’ll have to agree to disagree. Maybe you need to speak to some children of surrogates to see.

It’s not policing women do with their bodies, it’s policing what people think they can do with women’s bodies.

No one has full body autonomy. Women can’t have an abortion at 39 weeks and humans can’t sell their organs.

If you believe women should be able to choose to be a surrogate, how would you structure surrogate contracts to ensure she isn’t exploited, and is adequately compensated for her commitment, while also protecting the rights of the baby?

There’s a child in the same year as my DD at school. Two dads. Surrogate in India. She told my DD that one day she’s going to go to India to meet her mum😢.

It's desperately cruel and selfish to deliberately create a motherless child. Heartbreaking.

Your position only makes sense if you think that having children is an altruistic act towards the child, which it plainly isn’t.

People have children because THEY want children (or they don’t bother to take steps to stop it happening)- no one has a child for the child’s benefit: the child literally doesn’t exist before the mother decides to get pregnant.

Getting pregnant and bringing up the child is not doing it a favour, it isn’t having its existence improved by being conceived is it?!

Surrogate pregnancy wouldn’t take place without a commissioning party, therefore the child wouldn’t exist without the commission.

It wouldn’t be floating around in space suffering because no one had conceived and birthed it, waiting for someone to do the altruistic job of bringing it to life.

I have never met a woman desperate to be a surrogate.
What are the main motivations for this and have the ones you've known gone through with it?

Would you agree with people, male and female, buying and selling kidneys?

Really? I’ve spoken to a couple curious. Pregnancy is incredible!! I’m currently loving mine ☺️ for some women it’s a whole purpose and state of being. I’ve said earlier that Im also part of a Facebook group for sahm who are desperate to surrogate.

I also don’t personally know any homeless people but I am very, very aware they exist.

They only difference is we may need our kidneys. You can produce multiples babies. Kidney donation is also much worse physically than pregnancy for a lot of women.

In an ideal world if we had multiple kidneys - yes!!

That’s very sad. I do worry about surrogacy in places like India. I hope she’s ok .

I have a friend who’s only just turned 30 and for various medical reasons no longer has her own eggs. She is going down the egg donation route and using her husband’s sperm. Yes she is paying for the egg so she is paying for her baby. She has done a lot of counselling and intends to inform her child and bring them up with the ability to contact their egg donor if he/she wishes. Is this also immoral and wrong? Probably for a lot of you it is, which is very sad.

I paid for my baby too. She’s very expensive! 🤣 No one wanted to answer about that though and about if I’m a disgusting human being, creating a human who didn’t need to exist. Doesn’t matter if we’ll be a loving family who will give the the world.

For other, I guess ivf is more ‘acceptable’ now whereas ten years ago perhaps these same posters would have called me disgusting for creating multiple blastocysts which I may not be able to use. To be fair, even I felt weird about it until I understood exactly how it worked.