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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be sad none of my friends offered to help me move?

133 replies

tvenclines · 28/10/2023 14:31

Pretty much that
I live alone and the only family I have is my dad but he is late 80s.
I've had 4 days to pack up my 2 bed house and move.
Not one of my friends has offered to move
Or even ask how I'm getting on with the packing.

Both of my good friends I've helped before
One of them I spent two days when she moved scraping woodchip off her walls
The other I helped her pack up to move

I've just been left
I'm feeling overwhelmed
I really could of done with some help
I don't want to ask for it-they know I need it
They know my circumstances
Aibu ?

OP posts:
Reugny · 28/10/2023 18:42

AbbeyGailsParty · 28/10/2023 17:40

YANBU a real friend would have offered to help you pack, helped with cleaning and brought you some lunch/tea to have while packing.

I would never offer to help people pack as every single person I know who has moved from university halls to houses has had to throw out stuff.

I will clean for some people, help dispose of stuff that has been sorted, I will move boxes into cars/vans and even drive stuff over for people in their teens up to mid-20s.

DisquietintheRanks · 28/10/2023 18:43

Changingplace · 28/10/2023 16:49

Unless someone asked me to help move house I’d assume they’d booked removals/were fine.

How would they know you need help unless you ask? Moving is awful, but I wouldn’t assume anyone who was needed my help unless they asked me specifically.

Well I don't know about you, but I talk to my friends about the stuff going on in their lives and I can't imagine a conversation about moving without discussing packing. Nor can I imagine not offering to help a friend who was single. It doesn't take much imagination to realise it may be a struggle.

OP I don't think YABU.

Natsku · 28/10/2023 18:48

This is the kind of thing that you need to ask people to help with, I'm sure plenty of people would want to help if they only knew you needed help. We call it talkoot where I live, and the person asking for help provides food (and maybe drinks) for the people helping move and that always brings plenty of helpers!

pinkyredrose · 28/10/2023 18:49

AbbeyGailsParty · 28/10/2023 17:40

YANBU a real friend would have offered to help you pack, helped with cleaning and brought you some lunch/tea to have while packing.

Funny!

JellyKoala · 28/10/2023 19:12

Antst · 28/10/2023 18:41

There isn't a context. Thank you for demonstrating my point. The excuses!

I wouldn't expect friends to help because I'm able to manage everything myself, but having helped all of them, I'd certain notice if they didn't offer it and doubt our relationship would be quite the same. So interesting that people elsewhere behave so differently.

Of course there's a context.

There's a context to everything.

You think if you helped someone to move at some point in their life when you offered to do so, but when you were moving possibly years later, they had kids to look after, a job they couldn't take time off, were ill or disabled, or had other plans at 4 days notice that wouldn't be context? Or they helped you move a studio flat when you embrace minimalism and other people were also helping but they're moving a bigger property and have 15 boxes that are just their lego sets or ornaments? Or that they were extremely clean and tidy people and you weren't so the cleaning required is huge?

There's no context at all? And it would all be just excuses?

Whyohwhywyoming · 28/10/2023 19:18

YANBU. If your friend helped you move and you accepted that help and now they’re moving and you know they are on their own and you don’t offer to help you are a shitty person and using the excuse of “oh but they haven’t asked” to make you feel better about the fact that you know you should offer but you can’t be bothered so you haven’t.

Antst · 28/10/2023 19:19

JellyKoala · 28/10/2023 19:12

Of course there's a context.

There's a context to everything.

You think if you helped someone to move at some point in their life when you offered to do so, but when you were moving possibly years later, they had kids to look after, a job they couldn't take time off, were ill or disabled, or had other plans at 4 days notice that wouldn't be context? Or they helped you move a studio flat when you embrace minimalism and other people were also helping but they're moving a bigger property and have 15 boxes that are just their lego sets or ornaments? Or that they were extremely clean and tidy people and you weren't so the cleaning required is huge?

There's no context at all? And it would all be just excuses?

Those are excuses. They're statements of the type of relationship you want to have with people. You obviously get to decide on your boundaries but I'd drop a "friend" like that like a hot potato. It's up to you whether to take the advice, of course, but I'd consider whether there might be nice people who stay away on hearing that kind of attitude.

People who refuse even to offer to help single friends who are moving after they have helped with the same thing are not the kind of people I have anything to do with! Good night!

Wheredidyougonow · 28/10/2023 19:20

The friend who you helped for 2 days, should have offered!!

melj1213 · 28/10/2023 19:40

Antst · 28/10/2023 18:41

There isn't a context. Thank you for demonstrating my point. The excuses!

I wouldn't expect friends to help because I'm able to manage everything myself, but having helped all of them, I'd certain notice if they didn't offer it and doubt our relationship would be quite the same. So interesting that people elsewhere behave so differently.

There's always context.

The OP has to move in 4 days

Scenario 1: she has known about the move for months, done nothing about it and is then expecting all her friends to drop everything to help her pack up everything with zero notice for free because she doesn't want to pay an extra £200 (that she can well afford) to the moving company to do it all for her?

Scenario 2: she has somehow found herself on an emergency situation where she has had 4 days notice to leave, done as much as possible herself but realised there is no way she can do it all alone in the time frame, can't afford the £200 for the moving company to do it and is now desperate for an extra set of hands to do whatever they can to help?

In the former situation if I was free I might try to help if/when I could but wouldn't be going out of my way to rearrange my plans; in the latter situation I would rearrange anything I feasibly could to help as much as possible. With such little notice I couldn't take time off work to help so any help would have to fit around my shifts.

Right now it is the start of half term where I am so I have an expensive trip organised with DD tomorrow (travel to a nearby city 2hrs away on the train, an exhibition at a museum she wants to see, dinner and a show she's wanted to see, stay over in a hotel, shopping and then home at lunchtime on Monday) that I have had booked for months - I wouldn't be cancelling that for either scenario, but in the latter scenario I might proactively call my friend and say I won't be back till Monday but since I had the whole day booked off work and we'd be back by lunch if she needed help Monday afternoon then just give me a call and I'd come over as soon as I could to help for the afternoon.

Antst · 28/10/2023 19:42

melj1213 · 28/10/2023 19:40

There's always context.

The OP has to move in 4 days

Scenario 1: she has known about the move for months, done nothing about it and is then expecting all her friends to drop everything to help her pack up everything with zero notice for free because she doesn't want to pay an extra £200 (that she can well afford) to the moving company to do it all for her?

Scenario 2: she has somehow found herself on an emergency situation where she has had 4 days notice to leave, done as much as possible herself but realised there is no way she can do it all alone in the time frame, can't afford the £200 for the moving company to do it and is now desperate for an extra set of hands to do whatever they can to help?

In the former situation if I was free I might try to help if/when I could but wouldn't be going out of my way to rearrange my plans; in the latter situation I would rearrange anything I feasibly could to help as much as possible. With such little notice I couldn't take time off work to help so any help would have to fit around my shifts.

Right now it is the start of half term where I am so I have an expensive trip organised with DD tomorrow (travel to a nearby city 2hrs away on the train, an exhibition at a museum she wants to see, dinner and a show she's wanted to see, stay over in a hotel, shopping and then home at lunchtime on Monday) that I have had booked for months - I wouldn't be cancelling that for either scenario, but in the latter scenario I might proactively call my friend and say I won't be back till Monday but since I had the whole day booked off work and we'd be back by lunch if she needed help Monday afternoon then just give me a call and I'd come over as soon as I could to help for the afternoon.

No, there really isn't. There often are excuses and justifications and that's why some people don't have supportive friends. I've noticed it's a sad reality about the UK. Many people have no idea how to have healthy relationships.

Seawaver · 28/10/2023 19:47

DP and I moved into together when I was 8 months pregnant and barely able to move without crutches. Now-DH’s friends rallied around to help both of us move but not a single friend of mine either offered or asked if I was ok and needed help (they were not aware DH’s friends were helping).

It made me feel down to think I always instinctively offer help to friends without prompting but the feeling isn’t mutual, but hey, we all have different outlooks on situations like this.

melj1213 · 28/10/2023 19:51

Antst · 28/10/2023 19:42

No, there really isn't. There often are excuses and justifications and that's why some people don't have supportive friends. I've noticed it's a sad reality about the UK. Many people have no idea how to have healthy relationships.

So if a friend was in Scenario 1 you are telling me you would make as much effort to help them as if they were in Scenario 2? Then you are a massive pushover

A healthy relationship includes having boundaries and not letting people walk all over you with entitled behaviour. I would help out a friend in scenario 1 if I could, but the "emergency" of the situation is entirely of their own making so I would not be going out of my way to help them at my own expense. Scenario 2 involves someone being in a situation they had no decision over so I would do everything I could to help them out because I know the situation was out of their control.

Pretending that some people aren't total users when it comes to relationships is massively disingenuous, as is pretending that the context of a request will have a bearing as to how much effort you put into fulfilling it.

UsingChangeofName · 28/10/2023 20:01

I've noticed it's a sad reality about the UK. Many people have no idea how to have healthy relationships.

What a daft generalisation

Antst · 28/10/2023 20:16

melj1213 · 28/10/2023 19:51

So if a friend was in Scenario 1 you are telling me you would make as much effort to help them as if they were in Scenario 2? Then you are a massive pushover

A healthy relationship includes having boundaries and not letting people walk all over you with entitled behaviour. I would help out a friend in scenario 1 if I could, but the "emergency" of the situation is entirely of their own making so I would not be going out of my way to help them at my own expense. Scenario 2 involves someone being in a situation they had no decision over so I would do everything I could to help them out because I know the situation was out of their control.

Pretending that some people aren't total users when it comes to relationships is massively disingenuous, as is pretending that the context of a request will have a bearing as to how much effort you put into fulfilling it.

I hope your approach works for you. I'm happy to have supportive friends and not to have to engage in the very disheartening thought processes you've demonstrated.

JellyKoala · 28/10/2023 20:29

Antst · 28/10/2023 19:42

No, there really isn't. There often are excuses and justifications and that's why some people don't have supportive friends. I've noticed it's a sad reality about the UK. Many people have no idea how to have healthy relationships.

See, many people will think it's you that doesn't have healthy relationships if you're going to drop someone if they didn't fulfil your expectations of what you think a friend should be and you don't see any possible reason why your friends don't drop everything to do things for you even if you haven't asked and you don't see how there could be any context in regards to your friends having their own lives or struggles or needs and it would all be just 'excuses'.

Narcissistic is so often overused on MN but that's exactly what you're describing. Setting goals and expectations for other people to fulfil for you, without them knowing what those goals or expectations are, then cutting them off because they didn't fulfil your unreasonable and unrealistic ideas of what a friend is, that you didn’t even communicate to them. Idealise (your idea of friendship) value (if they do what you want or expect even if you didn't ask ) and discard (when they didn't meet your expectations that they didn't even know they were supposed to meet).

I have lots of supportive friends and support my friends. But we have boundaries and don't set each other up with 'tests' that the other person isn't even aware of and can fail or pass. We're adults that know we all have different ideas of what a 'real' friend is and we communicate that to each other. Not get upset, angry, passive aggressive or cut someone out if they haven't passed a test that they weren't even aware of.

If we need help with something, we'll ask for it.if we can help to do it, we will. If we can't, that's also okay because we have empathy and don't set up all these unrealistic standards and expectations of what a 'friend' is. I have a friend who loves to bake, she makes cakes for every event and if someone is ill or going through something, she'll make a cake. She has been doing it for years because she enjoys it and it's how she shows she cares. I don't bake. If she expected me to bake a cake for her as some kind of expectation of our friendship, it would likely be not a very nice cake and would cost me a fair bit of money in equipment and ingredients.I don't have cake tins, I dont have kitchen scales, I don't have a food processor or even an electric whisk/beater. I don't have flour in my cupboard or vanilla or cooking chocolate or anything else. I don't bake! So I don't have those things. She can whip up a cake quickly and cheaply because it's an existing skill and hobby of hers and she already has 99% if not 100% of the ingredients in her cupboards.

So she doesn't expect me to tit for tat make her a cake. I do other things for her in our friendship.

A lot of MNetters have these expectations that other people should be like them and do what they do in relationships and friendships and then get pissy about it. And you see it all the time "AIBU, I always spend time picking out thoughtful gifts and so and so just gives vouchers and I'm upset". "AIBU, I organised a party for my friends birthday and they didn't do the same for me" "AIBU I threw a baby shower for my friend and they didn't reciprocate" "AIBU I made a weeks worth of meals for my friend when they were ill and they haven't done the same for me".

Seriously, don't do things that other people haven't asked for or expect, then judge that as the standard of what you expect from that person. You might think it's some kind of social contract and expectation but it's not one that they agreed to enter into!

Obviously, if some people do ask.a lot, take and then don't do anything in return, that's different but so much of the fuss and friendship threads on MN are because people do things they want to do without it being asked of them, then get all her up when they don't get the same in return.

It's very transactional and setting people up to fail a test they weren't aware they were being assessed on!

Antst · 28/10/2023 20:33

JellyKoala · 28/10/2023 20:29

See, many people will think it's you that doesn't have healthy relationships if you're going to drop someone if they didn't fulfil your expectations of what you think a friend should be and you don't see any possible reason why your friends don't drop everything to do things for you even if you haven't asked and you don't see how there could be any context in regards to your friends having their own lives or struggles or needs and it would all be just 'excuses'.

Narcissistic is so often overused on MN but that's exactly what you're describing. Setting goals and expectations for other people to fulfil for you, without them knowing what those goals or expectations are, then cutting them off because they didn't fulfil your unreasonable and unrealistic ideas of what a friend is, that you didn’t even communicate to them. Idealise (your idea of friendship) value (if they do what you want or expect even if you didn't ask ) and discard (when they didn't meet your expectations that they didn't even know they were supposed to meet).

I have lots of supportive friends and support my friends. But we have boundaries and don't set each other up with 'tests' that the other person isn't even aware of and can fail or pass. We're adults that know we all have different ideas of what a 'real' friend is and we communicate that to each other. Not get upset, angry, passive aggressive or cut someone out if they haven't passed a test that they weren't even aware of.

If we need help with something, we'll ask for it.if we can help to do it, we will. If we can't, that's also okay because we have empathy and don't set up all these unrealistic standards and expectations of what a 'friend' is. I have a friend who loves to bake, she makes cakes for every event and if someone is ill or going through something, she'll make a cake. She has been doing it for years because she enjoys it and it's how she shows she cares. I don't bake. If she expected me to bake a cake for her as some kind of expectation of our friendship, it would likely be not a very nice cake and would cost me a fair bit of money in equipment and ingredients.I don't have cake tins, I dont have kitchen scales, I don't have a food processor or even an electric whisk/beater. I don't have flour in my cupboard or vanilla or cooking chocolate or anything else. I don't bake! So I don't have those things. She can whip up a cake quickly and cheaply because it's an existing skill and hobby of hers and she already has 99% if not 100% of the ingredients in her cupboards.

So she doesn't expect me to tit for tat make her a cake. I do other things for her in our friendship.

A lot of MNetters have these expectations that other people should be like them and do what they do in relationships and friendships and then get pissy about it. And you see it all the time "AIBU, I always spend time picking out thoughtful gifts and so and so just gives vouchers and I'm upset". "AIBU, I organised a party for my friends birthday and they didn't do the same for me" "AIBU I threw a baby shower for my friend and they didn't reciprocate" "AIBU I made a weeks worth of meals for my friend when they were ill and they haven't done the same for me".

Seriously, don't do things that other people haven't asked for or expect, then judge that as the standard of what you expect from that person. You might think it's some kind of social contract and expectation but it's not one that they agreed to enter into!

Obviously, if some people do ask.a lot, take and then don't do anything in return, that's different but so much of the fuss and friendship threads on MN are because people do things they want to do without it being asked of them, then get all her up when they don't get the same in return.

It's very transactional and setting people up to fail a test they weren't aware they were being assessed on!

Welp, it works for me! I have friends who are generous and I'm generous with them. We don't keep score as far as reciprocating favours but everyone does what they can! Yes, I sure would drop anyone selfish. Life is too short!

WorriedMillie · 28/10/2023 20:39

If you only had 4 days, it sounds like a rather hurried move, so maybe the friends were just busy this week? I’d always offer to help where possible, but some weeks are absolutely packed for me, so while I’d always try and accommodate with sufficient notice, at the last min, I likely couldn’t help.

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 28/10/2023 20:40

Oh! I wouldn’t even imagine friends would help me move, or that I would be expected to offer. Just wouldn’t cross my mind this was a thing.

melj1213 · 28/10/2023 21:27

Antst · 28/10/2023 20:16

I hope your approach works for you. I'm happy to have supportive friends and not to have to engage in the very disheartening thought processes you've demonstrated.

I notice you didn't actually answer my question so I'll put it to you again: if a friend was in Scenario 1 - where the "emergency" is entirely of their own making - you are telling me you would make as much effort to help them as if they were in Scenario 2 where the "emergency" is entirely out of their control?

Poppysmom22 · 28/10/2023 21:50

If you are going to rely on other people for you happiness than you'll be disappointed every time

ACGTHelix · 28/10/2023 21:52

dont expect assistance and then in theory no disappointments.

Testina · 28/10/2023 21:54

LividTwunt · 28/10/2023 14:49

I just got divorced and downsized massively. I have a toddler.

The move was, for many unexpected reasons, traumatic (in the genuine sense of the word).

I am an adult and capable of arranging people to do what I can’t do myself. Thus I paid for packers and movers, even though I’m hardly floating in cash.

The person who I bought off did NOT do this and had a breakdown (again, in genuine sense of the word) on moving day. The knock on effects on a number of people are devastating.

People need to own their shit. If you need help, you pay for it or ask for it.

You know someone who had an actual breakdown because they were stressed and fucked up on moving day? I find it really hard to believe that it wasn’t just the final straw, and if they’d had packers, the breakdown would have come a week later over something else, surely?

BiddyPop · 28/10/2023 23:46

I am married but moving solo for work reasons - DH has travelled to DMIL this weekend when I need to move carloads from storage home for movers coming this week. I've already mostly emptied my work office alone. And done most of the shopping needed for fitting out a 2nd household (to not take what they need).

I am allowed (very grudgingly) the day for packers but the 2 days to prepare haven't been possible. And I should have 2 days to move and get unpacked into temp accommodation before having to turn up in the office overseas, but I have to go to the office for the morning for meetings, go to the airport at lunchtime, and do my first meeting on a different topic at 9am the following morning...

Caught between 2 bosses, dd who just wants me gone so she can use my car, and DH who says he supports me but...feeling the burden quite a lot tonight as I only got home from Ikea at 9:30 due to new boss saying I'd need to host receptions in my apartment which I hadn't expected so I needed more than the 6 place settings of crockery I had organised. Cutlery will have to wait til I get there.

junbean · 28/10/2023 23:46

That's why they have the saying you find out who your friends are when you're moving.

PeloMom · 28/10/2023 23:49

I wouldn’t offer. And I’ve never asked. Whenever I needed to move and as I got to have to move more and more stuff I accounted for men with a van in my moving costs. Otherwise I did it on my own