To refuse to take my learner driver on fast dual carriageways

[Laundryandtoil]

DS is nearly 18 and has got a driving test booked next month. He’s had loads of lessons (think I’ve paid for 70 hours of instruction at least!) and his instructor says he is test ready and should pass. I bought him a little car a few weeks ago and I’ve been taking him out in it to practice. DS wants to drive to visit his grandma (my mum) an hour away, accompanied by me obviously as he is still a learner. The route involves fast dual carriageways and then winding country roads. I’ve said my nerves aren’t up to sitting beside him at 70mph on the A3 but AIBU? He thinks I am because he has been on similar roads with his instructor and had no incidents - and he says how can he get experience if I won’t let him.

Didn't realise it was different in England. Northern Ireland learners and R drivers have to stick to 45mph no matter what type of road they're on

That sounds more dangerous tbh

It's the law in Northern Ireland for all learners and R drivers

I totally agree. It's madness

Really? Thats so strange, and sounds kind of dangerous. Surely drivers need to learn to drive at the normal road speeds or suddenly they have passed and have free reign! Whats an R driver?

I honestly think it's so dangerous. An R driver is a restricted driver, so they can only do 45mph on all roads for a year after getting their test. To be fair though we have one of the highest rates of death by speeding of young drivers, so that's probably why we have it here

In UK? You can't take a learner on the motorway, instructors can because they be in dual controlled cars.

I always thought that learners not being able to go on motorways was ridiculous as it's definitely different to driving on other roads. I am really glad that it has changed now, my DS was ready for his test but couldn't get a date so they spent the lessons they didn't really need driving on the motorway which I was really glad of.

Not surprising, as we seem to be behind the times, but it's still prohibited here

Personally, even though I think it's probably dangerous to drive that much slower than the limit it would make me happier to think that DS wasn't whizzing about with his mates (not that he is but I am totally paranoid).

That would be scary. Here in Northern Ireland we have R plates for the first year so can't go above 45 mph.

this only came in during 2018, total craziness it took so long! I think its fair enough that you can't go on without an instructor before passing. I wonder how many dont ever go on the motorway before passing, I have heard of lots of instructors not taking learners as it's not part of the test.

Decided, having read all the comments on here (thank you) - we will do the journey on Thursday. DS has impressed me on all the City drives (involving complex roundabouts and South Circular) he has done with me so far. He’s done several dual carriageways with his instructor and had 78 hours worth of lessons (I’ve just totted up!) so is more than ready. Issue is my nerves and I will keep a lid on them as I don’t want to hold my poor DS back. Will update you all on how it went on Thursday eve !

Yeh I know what you mean. I'm happy now that my daughter has her test she is 45mph for a year for her to get used to the roads, driving etc. But my problem is she won't drive on the motorway due to being restricted and I'd love her to have the practice

We need it to be fair. Our death by dangerous usually speed driving is through the roof

Does the 45mph limit apply to someone with N plates ( newly qualified) from Ireland too? Ds just passed his test yesterday so just curious.

No restrictions on speed with N plates as far as I'm aware

@HeavenKnowsIamMiserableNow is the Hogsback where you get thrown into the A3 at Guildford and it's going at 50 but the slip road is about 3metres long? I'm glad I'm not the only one who shits myself there!

If you’re driving down the A3, be aware that it’s very slow both in directions close to where it joins the M25 at junction 10, due to major roadworks. Part of the A3 is restricted to 50mph and only 2 lanes…..only another 2 years until the roadworks are finished!😫

On the subject of nasty A3 slip roads, I hate joining the A3 (in either direction) by the cathedral - if I’m going north, I get on by Stoke crossroads, as you have your own lane. Coming off the A31 to join the A3 at Guildford scares me as the slip road is so short.

The M25 is also very slow at J10 (the A3.) I'm sure it will all be splendid when it's finished.

I wonder how many dont ever go on the motorway before passing, I have heard of lots of instructors not taking learners as it's not part of the test.

Lots. I learnt to drive where the nearest motorways were in the next counties - 50 miles in 1 direction, 60 in the other. It's just not feasible in an hour's lesson or test. There are great parts of Wales and Scotland and Cornwall and elsewhere which aren't close to a motorway. Some probably aren't close to a dual carriageway with the same speed limits as a motorway, either. But if those roads must be compulsory, so should narrow country lanes with high banks and random hazards such as a tractor or flock of sheep. Many people don't know how to drive on those roads either.

The driving test should prove you are able to manoeuvre the car, perceive hazards, drive at a speed suitable to the road and conditions, and know the rules of the road. If you can do all that well enough, it's assumed you're capable of adapting to faster roads.

Depending on where exactly you are, can his instructor not take him on the A3 first so it is not the first time he has done those speeds? I passed my test in March and did sections of the A3 nearly every lesson. It was great to get some practise of multiple lane fast roads before passing my test and trying out motorways.

Also it's worth noting some test routes have the A3 as part of the test.

And another thing, just check the stretch you will need. I may be wrong but it turns into the A3(M) at some point which I don't think learners can drive on.

OP based on your location the A3 could very well be part of the test route. Routes from Morden and Tolworth can include it (but not all do). Not sure about any others.

I’m a driving instructor, yes we have dual controls but in certain situations there isn’t much we can practically do (such as speeding out of trouble, I’d love a dual accelerator). If you’re going to do it then be that second pair of eyes, ask if he’s noticed that car doing whatever it’s doing, if he looks like he’s getting into a troublesome situation then instruct ‘slow down’ etc. Use your experience to see what might happen, watch or ask him too to see if he’s similarly picking out hazards.

It might be you’re slightly scared of that road. Most of my learners have parents who are scared of certain roads/roundabouts and the anxiety is catching, I have to try to demystify and give them experience as the examiner certainly won’t avoid those roads. But that’ll be your hang up, not necessarily something that’s inherently dangerous.

After 70 hours I imagine he’s incredibly competent. But an atmosphere of anxiety isn’t good for a learner, so maybe get someone else to stand in? A parent relationship doesn’t help sometimes with learning to drive, I say that knowing I’ll be teaching my son in two years and it won’t be easy!

TBH if you are going to be a nervous wreck with him then I'd say no not this time. You might panic him.

I remember going out with mine when they were learners.
I've paid money at Alton Towers for white knuckle rides like that.
That said, they need all the practice they can get, so it would seem churlish to refuse.