Page 14 | Do I have unreasonable expectations of SAHP role?

Babysharkdodo123 · 2023-10-18T11:01:11+00:00

Currently on mat leave with 4 month old. 22 month old in nursery couple of days as no family around to help and wanted to keep routine. Dog needed to go to vets this morning for routine boosters so I asked DH if he could take her as i would have to juggle both kids and dog. Appointment at 8.30am so before work. He said no "why couldn't I do it as he was at work earning the money" (for ref I only get SMP). I then got asked what I was doing today (meeting friends new baby) which was met with "oh, I thought you could get through some of the laundry". So AIBU that household maintenance ie dogs, drs appointments, cleaning, laundry, cooking, grocery shopping should be shared in non working hours? If I was at work and DCs in nursery then no one would be home to do all of these jobs so they'd have to be shared out. Just because I'm on mat leave I don't think it should be expected that I do everything and DH wakes up, leaves and earns money.

Katypp · 19/10/2023 13:33

Cornflakes44 · 19/10/2023 13:19

@LuckySantangelo35 where has she said she thinks she has to dedicate every minute to enriching the kids? I'm sure like all parents she has some space away from them during the day, but I think the point is, should she spend this 'break' tidying or does she use it to make herself food, have a shower, make a call? From this thread it sounds like every second should be spent in industry, otherwise youre lazy, or not coping. I don't see why she has to slog her guts out doing everything when her husband only has to work.

Oh that is ridiculous! 'Only has to work' ... 'slogging her guts out' meeting friends for coffee - please tell me you're joking??

LolaSmiles · 19/10/2023 13:35

I wonder if this is a question of phrasing, because what I think she’s actually asking is “in non-working hours, should we share chores?” (Because her DH isn’t doing chores in his non-work time.) And people are interpreting it as “should chores be delayed until non-working hours” (even though OP does do chores in the day).
I think you're right.

I read it as OP is (rightly) fed up if she's ended up doing everything, but her proposed solution is that the chores should be parked until outside the working day because she think her days should be for entertaining baby/toddler, doing enriching things not laundry and cleaning.

I can see how someone else might have read the original AIBU as should both parents be doing their fair share outside the working day, whilst acknowledging that the person at home would still be expected to do some chores.

There's an obvious middle ground that most parents fall into, which is that the parent at home does some chores through the day, and does some cool things with baby/toddler, and has some time where everyone chills out. Then the working parent also does a fair share when they're home.

Cornflakes44 · 19/10/2023 13:40

@Katypp looking after a baby, toddler and doing all the household chores would be a massive slog. Toddlers create so much mess, babies demand so much attention. I have a toddler and baby and a day at work is a piece of cake compared to a day with them. It's such a luxury to only have to work and not to have to worry about household stuff. I don't see why having another baby let's her husband off that side of things.

Missdemeanorz · 19/10/2023 13:41

LolaSmiles · 19/10/2023 12:14

Bumpitybumper
It's not patronising. It's a fact of life.

There's been an explosion of classes, sensory play group, baby massage, baby yoga, all with the expectation placed on parents that if they're not spending every waking minute "making memories" and running themselves into the ground with endless enriching activities then they're somehow shit parents. Same with the in perfect playroom displays, the right tuff tray activities, the day packed with endless entertainment. Nobody is a shit parent for letting their children have some down time (whether that's so the parent can have a cup of tea or because the laundry needs loading in the machine).

I wasn't harping on to less developed countries in particular. There are a lot of countries around the world who don't buy into this expectations of primary caregivers being endless entertainers.

Many Nordic models of parenting involve elements of free play and not carting around babies to endless classes. There's some interesting takes on French parenting and how they teach patience. Babywearing is done in many different ways around the world and the children remain with parents. It isn't a "less developed" country practice. It's a practice that exists in many cultures and countries.

The idea that a parent in the UK can't stick a load of washing on because it's bad for their toddler to have 10 minutes without super duper enriching experiences is nonsense.

This is an extension of the PTFA, an instance of making a child's life a wonderful experience from conception to death. All managed via Google Diary which ties into the nursery and school diary you know😂
PITA.
This is women micromanaging themselves and their children to the nth degree with nonsense backed up by feminist rhetoric.

spitefulandbadgrammar · 19/10/2023 13:41

with respect in my opinion he is doing these things for you and it’s very sad you can’t be grateful when your partner helps you.
🤣🤣🤣

Katypp · 19/10/2023 13:45

Cornflakes44 · 19/10/2023 13:40

@Katypp looking after a baby, toddler and doing all the household chores would be a massive slog. Toddlers create so much mess, babies demand so much attention. I have a toddler and baby and a day at work is a piece of cake compared to a day with them. It's such a luxury to only have to work and not to have to worry about household stuff. I don't see why having another baby let's her husband off that side of things.

It was the norm not so long ago, with fewer labour-saving appliances to help. What happened?
And before anyone says yes but women were depressed etc, I'm not sure today's whirlwind of being supermum is that good for people's MH either. It wouldn't be for mine.

Cornflakes44 · 19/10/2023 13:52

@Katypp trying to do it all is what wreaks women's mental health. Being told that every second of their day should be spent doing things for other people. Or that coffee with a friend or playgroups are an indulgence and if they just cleaned the bathroom while having a bath they could keep on top of it. The only solution to women burning out is men also doing their share. But that seems too radical based on a lot of the replies on here.

SouthLondonMum22 · 19/10/2023 13:56

Lovepeaceunderstanding · 19/10/2023 13:29

@Babysharkdodo123 , with respect in my opinion he is doing these things for you and it’s very sad you can’t be grateful when your partner helps you. You are at home all day, you get time to socialise with friends during what you think of as your working day, I’m pretty sure he does not. I’ve been there with two small children and I know it’s possible to run the home and look after them. Being a stay at home mother (which you are at present) is a traditional role which I believe should be respected. The stay at home parent is the backbone of family life. Your child goes to nursery twice a week I believe? What on earth do you do during that time?
Were you looking for people to criticise your husband and back up your venom? I can’t do that but I will say the way he is approaching his obvious frustration with the situation is not especially helpful, you two need to have an honest discussion about your expectations of this situation and you both need to be prepared to listen to the other and be reasonable. Good luck.

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Maternity leave and stay at home mother are different things to me since a SAHM is usually a long term agreement and like you said, is a more traditional role which not everyone wants or agrees with.

OP shouldn't be 'grateful' that her DH cooks or does the laundry and it certainly isn't 'helping', it is basic things you just do as an adult in a house where some of the laundry will belong to him and cooking will also include his own food which he will eat so benefits himself as well as the household.

Lovepeaceunderstanding · 19/10/2023 13:59

SouthLondonMum22 · 19/10/2023 13:56

Maternity leave and stay at home mother are different things to me since a SAHM is usually a long term agreement and like you said, is a more traditional role which not everyone wants or agrees with.

OP shouldn't be 'grateful' that her DH cooks or does the laundry and it certainly isn't 'helping', it is basic things you just do as an adult in a house where some of the laundry will belong to him and cooking will also include his own food which he will eat so benefits himself as well as the household.

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@Babysharkdodo123 @SouthLondonMum22

I wonder how much of her husband’s work the OP does?

Blahblah254 · 19/10/2023 14:02

Katypp · 19/10/2023 13:31

Some people really do make life difficult for everyone. Is the 'normal' thing to do these days not to take kids to toddler group/ swimming or whatever in the morning, wear them out, have lunch, put them for a long nap then do chores? It was the routine all my group had when ours were little.
I can't imagine leaving the house when washing etc needed doing with no plan to do it (ie when I got back for instance). Why would you do that when you are the one most able to fit it around your day?
There is so much nonsense spoken about looking after children at home now. From the ridiculous posts about not being able to have a shower through to posts like this one. And the idea that looking after the children is your 'job' to the detriment of anything else that needs doing is just idleness, tbh

Lol @Katypp. Long naps - if only! Whilst on mat leave my baby wouldn’t nap for longer than 20 mins at a time, and wouldn’t be put down without screaming. I couldn’t baby wear due to a birth injury. All babies are different.

spitefulandbadgrammar · 19/10/2023 14:03

Lovepeaceunderstanding · 19/10/2023 13:59

@Babysharkdodo123 @SouthLondonMum22

I wonder how much of her husband’s work the OP does?

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What is your “gotcha” here? Are you saying that laundry etc is OP’s job as a SAHM (she’s not, she’s on maternity leave), therefore if DH does some, OP should do some of his work? Because extrapolating from that, childcare is OP’s job…but it’s also DH’s job, since they’re his children. And OP does it all day, therefore she does lots of DH’s job. Gotcha checkmate white rabbits and no returns.

GCSister · 19/10/2023 14:06

I wonder how much of her husband’s work the OP does?

Ridiculous comment.

SouthLondonMum22 · 19/10/2023 14:06

Lovepeaceunderstanding · 19/10/2023 13:59

@Babysharkdodo123 @SouthLondonMum22

I wonder how much of her husband’s work the OP does?

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Very similar to how much DH looks after their baby alone, I imagine.

Goldbar · 19/10/2023 14:16

Lovepeaceunderstanding · 19/10/2023 13:59

@Babysharkdodo123 @SouthLondonMum22

I wonder how much of her husband’s work the OP does?

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You should have said 'paid work'. I wonder how much of the OP's paid work her husband does?

Chores and childcare (unpaid work) are a joint responsibility, although the precise allocation might vary depending on circumstances.

All adults in a household have a responsibility to contribute towards the running of that household.

anon0007 · 19/10/2023 14:20

My husband learnt very quickly that my job as sahm was to our child and not maid/cleaner/chef/event planner to everyone.

Katypp · 19/10/2023 14:23

Cornflakes44 · 19/10/2023 13:52

@Katypp trying to do it all is what wreaks women's mental health. Being told that every second of their day should be spent doing things for other people. Or that coffee with a friend or playgroups are an indulgence and if they just cleaned the bathroom while having a bath they could keep on top of it. The only solution to women burning out is men also doing their share. But that seems too radical based on a lot of the replies on here.

Don't agree, sorry. I would expect exactly the same if my husband was at work, as would many on this thread I suspect. People are projecting this to be a feminist issue when it isn't - it's just a case of whoever has the most spare time should be doing the most chores so that both parties can have maximum down time. That's common sense, surely?
Having a coffee with a friend IS downtime. People are keen to describe looking after children as 'their job' but you wouldn't be able to go for coffee with friends in a 'real' job, therefore this is leisure time and to suggest it's anything else is just silly.
As I said upthread, looking after 2+ children and doing the housework used to be the norm for a lot of women, and much less of a fuss was made about it.
I have been a full-time mum, a full-time worker, a part-time worker, self-employed and a home worker, and being a full-time mum was the easiest and most leisurely by a county mile

LolaSmiles · 19/10/2023 14:25

The only solution to women burning out is men also doing their share. But that seems too radical based on a lot of the replies on here.
To be fair have many people on this thread said men shouldn't do their share?

There's always a healthy dose of poor hard working man needs his slippers warming on housework threads, or weird posts desperate to attribute neurodiversity to good old fashioned male-pattern laziness, but I don't think expecting a parent at home to do some chores is the same as saying the other parent doesn't have to lift a finger.

Sayitaintso33 · 19/10/2023 14:25

anon0007 · 19/10/2023 14:20

My husband learnt very quickly that my job as sahm was to our child and not maid/cleaner/chef/event planner to everyone.

I hoped you learnt just as quickly to thank your Dh for his generous good nature.

Katypp · 19/10/2023 14:25

anon0007 · 19/10/2023 14:20

My husband learnt very quickly that my job as sahm was to our child and not maid/cleaner/chef/event planner to everyone.

Such a pompous response. I honestly don't know how you can say that with a straight face. Or are you one of those people who thinks a messy house is a badge of honour because you are too busy being mother of the year?

anon0007 · 19/10/2023 14:27

@Katypp where did I say my house was messy or that I was mother of the year?

spitefulandbadgrammar · 19/10/2023 14:27

I have been a full-time mum, a full-time worker, a part-time worker, self-employed and a home worker, and being a full-time mum was the easiest and most leisurely by a county mile

But that’s your experience and your kids and your jobs. It’s not that way for everyone. I find my job a million times easier and less tiring than taking care of two children all day; I don’t find it at all leisurely. And I’m fairly slatternly and not aiming to be super mum.

It’s also easier to go for coffee with a friend in my lunch break and finish whole sentences and thoughts and hot beverages. Coffee with a friend on maternity leave isn’t downtime if you have children with you: it’s childcare with caffeine.

Lovepeaceunderstanding · 19/10/2023 14:28

spitefulandbadgrammar · 19/10/2023 14:03

What is your “gotcha” here? Are you saying that laundry etc is OP’s job as a SAHM (she’s not, she’s on maternity leave), therefore if DH does some, OP should do some of his work? Because extrapolating from that, childcare is OP’s job…but it’s also DH’s job, since they’re his children. And OP does it all day, therefore she does lots of DH’s job. Gotcha checkmate white rabbits and no returns.

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@spitefulandbadgrammar I’m saying that while on maternity leave a person is in the role of stay at home parent. I’m saying that the parent who goes out to work is as deserving of appreciation for their contribution to the household as the stay at home parent. I’m saying I’ve bought up two children and have a reasonable understanding of what’s entailed and that under most circumstances it should be possible to get through most general household tasks while at home with children. I’ve done it. I do think that not much consideration is being given to the parent who goes out to work here, they work full time and need some time off too not to mention leisure time all together as a family. The OP has one of her children in nursery two days a week for goodness sake! I’m saying that I wouldn’t blame her partner for becoming resentful which reading between the lines it sounds like he might be.

Coffeerum · 19/10/2023 14:30

Cornflakes44 · 19/10/2023 13:52

@Katypp trying to do it all is what wreaks women's mental health. Being told that every second of their day should be spent doing things for other people. Or that coffee with a friend or playgroups are an indulgence and if they just cleaned the bathroom while having a bath they could keep on top of it. The only solution to women burning out is men also doing their share. But that seems too radical based on a lot of the replies on here.

Oh for godsake doing 70% of the chores and being at home with a 4 month old and a toddler who is in nursery multiple days a week is not wrecking your mental health by trying to do it all!

Of course a coffee out with a friend is an indulgence … would it not be classed as an indulgence if the DH wanted to meet a friend after work for a pint?

Literally no one is saying every second of her day is or should be spent slaving away but the most important factor is equal down time, considering OP has the opportunity for down time during the day it also makes sense that she does more of the home
stuff too.

God you’re making it out like being at home with 1, sometimes 2 children is an impossible task.

spitefulandbadgrammar · 19/10/2023 14:34

@Lovepeaceunderstanding I’m on maternity leave right now. I’m not a SAHP: I’m on leave from my job. Of course the person working needs time off as well as to contribute to chores and to spend time with the family, no one is saying they don’t? But when’s OP’s time off? People are characterising her day as time off unless she’s doing chores, but at all points of the day she’s responsible for a baby, and three days of the week she’s responsible for a baby and a toddler. It doesn’t matter if she goes for a walk or has a coffee or sees a friend: it’s not time off if she’s with the children.

Her job is childcare, his job is job (his job is just beach!); she does some chores as she goes along, around her job, he apparently won’t take the dog to the vet or do laundry around his job. That’s the issue.

anon0007 · 19/10/2023 14:34

@Sayitaintso33 generous for him working? He's always worked. Nothing much changed for dh after I had ds. He continued to work whereas my life was turned upside down looking after ds. It was expected that I do his share of the load that was previously shared tasks because I was at home. So he had to learn quickly that I wasn't doing anymore than I usually did because I now had a baby to look after too.