I understand why they are so set on destroying Hamas

[FebruaryOnMyMind]

Having seen the stories of the women and girls raped at the festival (reportedly over their dead friends bodies) and the people taken off as hostage; I understand why Israel want to destroy Hamas. They have said that Hamas militants are dead men. They have said that they will go after them. The worst killing of Jewish people since the Holocaust and their 9/11 with death toll of over 1300 people.

The story of the women at the Music and Peace festival is here -

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12623023/Israeli-girls-raped-friends-bodies-Hamas-terrorists-carried-second-Holocaust-British-relatives-reveal-condemn-celebrated-atrocities-Gaza-Iran-London.html

Yet some people celebrated when the killings of Jewish people (they were from many different countries) at the festival was announced.

I feel sadness for everything going on in the middle east and for all the people who are innocent are are dying. Terrorists need to be stopped.

An hour warning of a media tower etc as reported on Al Jazeera. An hour wasn't enough to get the cameras and equipment out and he pleaded for more time to move equipment but the people had time to get out.

“We left the elevator for the elderly and for the children to evacuate,” the Palestinian freelance journalist said. “And we were all running down the stairs and whoever could help children took them down,” she added. “I myself helped two children of the residents there and I took them downstairs – everyone was just running quickly.”
Moments earlier, the Israeli army, which has been bombarding Gaza for six straight days, had given a telephone warning that residents had just an hour to evacuate the building before its fighter jets attacked it.
Al Jazeera’s Safwat al-Kahlout also had to move quickly. He and his colleagues “started to collect as much as they could, from the personal and equipment of the office – especially the cameras”, al-Kahlout said.

447 children and 248 women among 1,417 killed in Israeli strikes in Gaza

Reuters, same again tomorrow?

You're very one sided, ridiculous and ignorant. Hamas and Israel government are both guilty of murdering innocent civilians, both murdering women and children. Israel have actually murdered more innocent Palestinian civilians than Hamas. Hamas are terrorists but although no UK media is not saying it, Israel actions should also be ladled as terrorism not defence. Of course there would be retaliation to the horrific actions of Hamas, but what Israel are doing is just as horrific. I feel for all the victims as a result of these two awful powers.

Last Saturday, when there was electricity and phones worked. How do they give warnings now?

Wow another daily fail article.

Over six million Jewish people were killed in the Holocaust. Those targeted were chosen due to their religious and cultural identity not their nationality.

No that's not true, some of the victims of the atrocity were not from Israel they were from Germany, USA, UK etc. They were targeted because they were Jewish.

Hamas has undoubtedly perpetrated an atrocity, with horrendous acts made even worse by being funded by international aid. But it is cynical and incorrect to liken it to the Holocaust.

I saw it reported as that it was the largest loss of life since the Holocaust, not that it was the same as the Holocaust.
The outpouring of support that Hamas received worldwide subsequently has felt like the rise of hatred for Jews across the West including in Sydney chanting 'Gas the Jews' and the many protests around London and other major cities.

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I wish the people of Gaza could move out

This ridiculous and incredibly biased.

@DottieMoon I said I understand why they are going after a terrorist organisation. I understand why they are hitting back and attempting to wipe out a terrorist organisation intent on wiping Jewish people from the face of the earth (Hamas stated intent). I didn't say some killing was ok. There are plenty of people who will stand up for Hamas. The vast majority of people don't want any killing of innocents.

There are lots of people in countries who appear to support a terrorist organisation.

With all the killing of innocents is that really all you have to say. The paper isn't one that meets with your approval. How sad.

You will find similar stories behind paywalls of the papers that meet your approval.

Israel are not retaliating.

Of course they are. This is insane. To a certain degree it’s understandable of course, however it’s not effective and it’s not humane either.

Hamas were retaliating for the treatment of Palestinians previously, Palestinians support it as their only option. Once again to a certain degree it’s understandable in theory but it’s not effective and again it’s not humane.

Escalation or violence does nothing to actually end a conflict, all it does is destroy the future of more people.

I hate the whataboutery

I side with Israel 100%. Hamas must be destroyed. Perhaps Egypt could help get the women and children out to safety.

Seeing the wider context is not supporting a terrorist organisation. Behind that organisation are people who are oppressed and struggling.

It’s not a parallel but for example it was perfectly possibly to support the civil rights movement for NI catholics and not support the actions of the IRA.

It is possible to sympathise with the Palestinian people and not support hamas, it’s possible to sympathise with the Israeli people and not support the actions of their government.

I saw this on You Tube.

People actually celebrating what Hamas did. This disgraceful display from these barbaric people was NOT a protest, it was a celebration of murder brutality, terror and evil. It's a strange world where people are celebrating terrorists. Awful.

I wish the people of Gaza could move out

To where? How?
@FebruaryOnMyMind

You can say the same for Palestine though can't you. How many children are in Israeli prisons being beaten and abused. How many Palestinian children were murdered in the past year? There are many. So this argument does not make sense. It goes both ways.

@Coffeerum I was referring to people who support as in cheer on the terrorists and per the Australia celebration on the You Tube link. There are people in many countries including the UK who celebrate the work of terrorists

If you were to apply some critical thinking to this scenario you would see that Israel won't win this war by telling children to go to a UN school and then killing said children. From a military point, children aren't a threat and there really isn't any point in killing them. I think what most likely happened here was that Hamas heard that Israel told the civilians that the UN school was safe and then Hamas, instead of letting the civilians go there alone and be safe - went and hid out there themselves. Thereby putting innocent lives in danger.

There is a lot of history to these incidents. It is not so simple.

If we look at fatalities in the fighting between Israel and Palestine (between 2008 and Aug 2023) there were 6,407 Palestinian deaths and 308 Israeli deaths.

Take those figures as a percentage of the relevant populations and apply them to the UK population, just to let us get it into perspective.
Israeli deaths would translate into 190,000 deaths - the population of Milton Keynes
Palestinian deaths would translate into 8,100,000 deaths - the entire populations of Wales and Scotland combined.

Both numbers are horrendous.

The problems are not simple, the solutions will not be simple.

Also in what world does an hours warning make something okay or not that bad to you? Ignoring the fact that most areas didn’t have electricity which is obviously a pretty large consideration, but how far do you think you can get on foot within an hour of warning?
I have a baby and a toddler, I can’t just run out the door without any consideration for how I’m going to feed them after our home is blown up. And then when I do make a run for it do you think I can get away from air strikes in any meaningful way? Of course not. It’s a ridiculous justification.

Hamas are cowards, hiding behind civilian populations. Hamas are wholly responsible for the terrible cost paid by palestinian citizens. Israel is 100% right to defend herself with maximum force and anyone who supports or defends Hamas is a Nazi. Or, if you prefer, scum.

I couldn't agree more.

Why aren't Egypt helping more

You are being naive thinking that this is a good and evil situation.

Where is your anger at how Palestinian civilians are treated by Israel? Just because you haven't seen the pictures, it doesn't mean that Palestinian civilians haven't been murdered by Israel. Ten times as many Palestinians have died than Israelis.

Think about the fact that you can't warn people with no electricity that you are going to bomb their homes and that starving them and murdering them is how they can recruited by terrorism organisation.

Do you live in a place where you know people who deal drugs or are in a gang? Then it's obvious why people don't rat out the terrorists. Without money where do you go and hide? How do you trust the police to arrest troublemakers rather than accept bribes funded by the proceeds of crime? In the UK we live in a situation where certain crimes are being overlooked because of resources. If you were in Gaza, there's no phone lines never mind physical police stations probably still standing.

I'm not saying that what happened to innocent Israelis is acceptable or that retaliation wasn't to be expected but there is definite wrong on both sides and just because you're not seeing murdered Palestinians, you shouldn't forget that they are dying too.

The story isn't being hidden imo but I'm seeing a lot of bias when both sides behave despicably and it's civilians paying with their lives.

In the world of MN where people are comparing then an hours warning of an attack so that you can get out and survive is better than no warning and being shot at a festival or raped and then beheaded. There are no winners in this but an hours warning means you can at least leave the building as the Palestine reported did and helped others to do so.

There are no winners. A UN brokered peace agreement is needed.