I understand why they are so set on destroying Hamas

[FebruaryOnMyMind]

Having seen the stories of the women and girls raped at the festival (reportedly over their dead friends bodies) and the people taken off as hostage; I understand why Israel want to destroy Hamas. They have said that Hamas militants are dead men. They have said that they will go after them. The worst killing of Jewish people since the Holocaust and their 9/11 with death toll of over 1300 people.

The story of the women at the Music and Peace festival is here -

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12623023/Israeli-girls-raped-friends-bodies-Hamas-terrorists-carried-second-Holocaust-British-relatives-reveal-condemn-celebrated-atrocities-Gaza-Iran-London.html

Yet some people celebrated when the killings of Jewish people (they were from many different countries) at the festival was announced.

I feel sadness for everything going on in the middle east and for all the people who are innocent are are dying. Terrorists need to be stopped.

'Siding with Jews' - oh my.

As I said before, on purely human level, I always felt for Palestinians (while also worrying about my Israeli fiends because of never ending terrorist attacks). I still think Palestinians deserve their own country and equal rights to Israelis. However, my understanding is its not what Palestinians/ Hamas want. They don't want 2 state solution - they always rejected that. Instead, they want Israel to disappear. And after this atrocity I can see that, sadly, current situation is not going to improve. I don't know what the answer is, but I can imagine that Israel will not sit and wait for it to be eliminated. Also, may I add - If Hamas wants peace, they can start by returning hostages.

Because people dancing and cheering the rape and murder of women and children are scum?

Fuck me.

Because people who openly celebrate rape and murder, whilst chanting ‘gas the Jews’ are fucking scum.

Clear enough?

Why now?

Thats the real question - Hamas have chosen to take this action knowing full well the Israeli retaliation would be enormous.

So why do it?
Who does it benefit and why?

I think it was to scupper the peace deal that Israel and Saudi Arabia were very close to finalising.

It didn't suit Hamas.

A Palestinian explains Hamas (2 years old)

I should think it's because of the US, Saudi and Israel peace deal that was being negotiated. Hamas does not want that to happen, so it escalated things.

It is well worth reading these sources to hopefully help people to understand Hamas's brutal terroristic strategy that puts both the lives of Israeli's and Palestinians lives at risk.

1. https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf document from NATO explaining how Hamas using innocent citizens from Gaza as human shields.
2. https://www.un.org/unispal/document/auto-insert-181056/ document from the UN showing how Hamas " deliberately place children at risk from Israeli counter-terror measures by co-locating weapons and terror infrastructure inside schools, hospitals, and mosques."
3. https://www.newsweek.com/gaza-could-have-been-singapore-hamas-turned-it-isis-opinion-1833145 article showing how Hamas have created an ISIS like state in Gaza.
4. https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/polls-show-majority-gazans-were-against-breaking-ceasefire-hamas-and-hezbollah#:~:text=Overall%2C%2057%25%20of%20Gazans%20express,who%20support%20Fatah%20(64%25) analysis that shows that allegedly " 57% of Gazans express at least a somewhat positive opinion of Hamas"
5. https://palestine.unwomen.org/en/what-we-do/ending-violence-against-women/facts-and-figures-1 document showing how endemic abuse towards women is in Gaza.
6. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamism_in_the_Gaza_Strip this shows how Palestinians in Gaza live under Hamas.
7. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12613241/hamas-commander-israel-just-beginning-gaza-strikes.html apologies for being the Daily Mail, but it shows the mindset of the Hamas leader who claims "The dominion of my nation would reach those ends that have been drawn near me."Al-Zahar said he believes ultimately the whole world will fall into line with their views. The entire 510 million square kilometers of Planet Earth will come under [a system] where there is no injustice, no oppression, no Zionism, no treacherous Christianity..."

Yeah - that was kind of my point. It would be one way of getting rid of him. 😂 I'm joking, of course. I wouldn't wish hamas on anyone.

There has not been an election in Gaza for 17 years.
Hamas is not an elected government.

To coincide with the Sabbath, Simchat Torah and the anniversary of the Yom Kippur war. And because that's how long it took to arrange it with Iran.

So let me think - who would benefit from the American war chest being diverted elsewhere?

Nothing happens in a vacuum.
Hamas didn’t just wake one day and sign a death wish for their whole nation by committing such a bold and barbaric atrocity that they knew would trigger open war and a ground invasion.

This seems to me to be just one part of a bigger and wider ambition to overthrow the current world order or at least attempt to test its limits and fragility. Not unlike the situation in Ukraine created but Russia. Who are allies? Iran and Russia. Who openly supports Hamas - Iran. Quite where this leaves the UAE, Saudi, Bahrain, Turkey and others is anyone’s guess. No wonder the war has disappeared from newspapers with limited information.

I just cannot even at this point - to the extent that I have largely stopped (this post being a notable exception) even commenting online on the situation!

There was a brilliant opinion piece by (Jewish, leftist) author Naomi Klein that basically boils down to "we need to start prioritising every child over who precisely is pointing their hun at them" - a.k.a. "take the side od people, not states or ideologies".

I could not agree more!

Hamas militants slaughtering Israeli families sicken me! What the state of Israel does to Palestinians sickens me!

But at least, these are all people somehow deeply personally affected! They might sicken me - but I can accept that I cannot expect people to take a reasonable stance when it is about them!

But the armchair warriors on the internet willing to be turned into mindless drones of "their" side and its propaganda machine whilst sitting in the comfort of their own homes ...

They sicken me most of all! Go find a fucking hobby that does not carry the risk of fanning the flames! Or get creative and propose and advocate for some good, non-genocidal solutions and drum up some support for them!

I’m afraid they’d hurl him off a rooftop before he could even say ‘Hello’.

Every cloud.

Frankly, OP you lost me at "hidden" followed by the hour warning. In the most populated, under-constructed place you could imagine.

There simply is no right in this situation. The unmitigated wrong is Hamas, now a photo finish with Netanyahu.

So this is all about the Jews for you? Not Israel, not Hamas, but the Jews. Awful.

Apologies, there haven’t been elections in Palestine since 2006. That should read:

Hamas are the government of Gaza. Their leaders are, of course, safely ensconced in Qatar and don’t give a damn about how their actions will affect those on the ground. It’s time the people of Gaza woke up.

I don't know how that antisemite is still here. Can people please report en masse?

I am not sure I buy into that theory. The agreement if it were to hold, would eventually have to include everyone. I assume Saudi would have brokered the deal with Hamas.

Hamas would know the distinct possibility of annihilation after this terror attack would render them potentially stateless like IS roaming around causing ad hoc mayhem. I can’t think annihilation will benefit Hamas?

@FebruaryOnMyMind they are set on destroying Palestine and Palestinians as they have always planned doing since day 1.
Bravo for using the DailyFail as a source 🤮
Why not go educate yourself on the topic by reading reliable sources instead of that trash paper. Books written by academics like this one:
Ilan Pappe's The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine

Stop trying to justify the genocide.

Ad nauseam

Everyone knows what Hammas has done and 99.9% of people are disgusted by it. I would imagine anyone supporting such heinous acts have probably lost friends or family members at the hands of Israeli soldiers or the like and are fuelled by vengeful hatred, as is so often the case with terrorism/terrorist sympathisers.

That said, there is a decent amount of support for PALESTINE, not Hammas, in the West and obviously huge sympathy for civilians in Gaza who will pay for Hammas' crimes.

I may be stating the obvious here but the two things are entirely separate.

It depends whether you think what Hamas actually wants is a home for Palestinians, or the complete obliteration of the Jewish race. If you discount the former - bearing in mind the Hamas leaders are not in Gaza themselves, they are in Qatar or Iran - then Gaza being obliterated is neither here nor there as far as they are concerned.

Israel don't want to kill children?

You on glue?

Maybe look up some statistics.

But that’s meaningful - the people have not voted them in, or voiced their view. Hamas have sat in state for seventeen whole years unopposed. That’s not a democracy or anything approaching the stamp of public approval for their policies or atrocities.

It's impossible to destroy Hamas. Israel is bombing Gaza where the majority of people are not members or supporters of Hamas.
Most of our friends in Israel are appalled at what has happened. Every single part of it. They're appalled by the attack by Hamas. They're appalled none of the warning or intelligence systems worked. They're appalled by Netanyahu's response - but most Israelis have been decrying him and his policies for years. It's only certain parts of social media that are pretending Israelis are happy their government is flouting international law.
The majority in Palestine and Israel want to live in peace. They don't want civilians on either side of the border to be raped, kidnapped or murdered.
They also don't want cheap polls on AIBU reducing their national tragedy to goady bullshit. Instead of complaining that MN hid your articles, if you had any decency, you'd be asking for your thread to be deleted.