To be sad about tomboy?

[NC4Obvs]

NC obviously

Just wanting an anonymous space as I'd never voice my feelings aloud and won't. But also want to ask the question.

10 year old DD for the last couple of years has wanted hair increasingly shorter and not wanted or worn any feminine clothes.

Bright, funny, healthy, happy child who is fully loved and no resistance met to these requests.

The last couple of months when seeing photos or catching a glance from a distance I realise that there's nothing other than if you heard her name that would make you think she is a girl. Assumption would 100% be boy.

She's not said anything about being mistaken for a boy, again she's chosen this look and so I don't think would be upset if she was, and her happiness is paramount so I'm not going to bring it up. She's popular and loves her sports and friends etc.

But. If you've been in the same boat. Did it make you feel a little sad? I know it's unreasonable. It's only hair and clothes. But it's when I see photos of her when she was little it feels like that child is a totally different person.

Again, her happiness is above others' opinions of her hair/clothes/hobbies and I'm very proud of anyone who has the courage to be their authentic self, I never did.

So I know it's my issue that my preference is girls to be girly.

But would to hear from mums of similar kids to say if they've felt the same.

I was a tomboy, played football and loved wearing trackies and other stereotypically boys clothes. I had long hair but always wore it in a ponytail.

Around 12/13 I started to wear my hair down a bit and got into makeup and stopped wearing 'boys clothes' - although they are much comfier haha.

I still love football and sports. How she is at 10 may not be how she will be moving forwards.

I don't think you're a terrible person OP but you do need to accept your daughter as she is. My friend's DD is 13, has short hair and wears quite masculine clothes and also thinks she's gay but she is fabulous. Bright, funny, feisty, kind and also one of my (very girly) DDs best friends. Her clothes don't define her as a person.

This is slightly odd. What exactly is ‘lost’ at the moment? Why isn’t a non-gender-confirming girl ‘acceptable’?
I too was a tomboy. I have had long hair from time to time and worn dresses (I’m definitely a woman and heterosexual if that matters to you). At 58 I very, very rarely wear a dress, never wear make-up and have hair which is extremely short (no2 clippers at the back and sides). I don’t feel I’ve ‘lost’ anything, or am less of a woman. Fortunately my friends and family don’t see it like that either.

I'm a bit late to the thread here but christ some people really seem unable to grasp the idea that you can feel a feeling without immediately acting on it in the most destructive way possible. The OP says twice in her post that her daughter's happiness is paramount. She's not sat outside the wean's bedroom in the morning crying into a discarded prom dress. She's dealing with her feelings in a healthy way, venting on an anonymous forum. You don’t have to be 100% pleased by your children's choices to be supportive of their right to make them, as the OP is.

I am, I suppose, the grown up equivalent to your daughter. I write code for a living, I like boxing and lift weights, I drink beer by preference, my haircut would not look at all out if place on a man, I almost never wear skirts or dresses. For formal events I'll wear a jumpsuit or trouser suit.

But. None of the above is really particularly significant, other than when I'm actually shopping for clothes. I have no confusion over my gender identity. I'm a woman and perfectly happy to be so. I'm a mother and happily married. The stuff above just means that I enjoy my life and recognise myself when I look in the mirror.

I think it's worth asking yourself why these things matter to you. Why do clothes and hobbies and hair hold significance to you? Why did you want them to be gender-conforming, to the extent of grieving that they aren't?

'I'm very proud of anyone who has the courage to be their authentic self, I never did.'

I think this bit is very telling to be honest.

Did you feel that you had to live up to certain expectations as a kid? It sounds like you are very supportive but having a hard time letting go of what you expected your daughter to be. Is this your own expectations, or expectations of other family members and/or society that you are perhaps worrying about. Are you perhaps worried that she will go through a hard time by being her 'authentic self' instead of taking the easier options of conforming, like you did?

The trouble with a term like "tomboy" is it that it feeds into the narrative that a girl who likes football/short hair/climbing trees etc is somehow "other", and directly contributes to the stereotypes which lead into people then thinking their behaviour doesn't match their sex, therefore they must be something other than their sex.

Personally (having also been described as a tomboy in my time, and now being a gender non-conforming adult), I firmly prefer the term "girl" to describe a female child, regardless of what shes wearing and what her interests are.

I'm very firm with my own girls that climbing trees is for girls, cricket is for girls, trousers are for girls, ballet and dresses and skirts and make up are for girls, and no behaviours/hobbies/clothes/hair styles make them any less "girl". (Obviously they are also taught the same principle in reverse!!)

I get it! My DD12 (nearly 13) is a skinny little thing who has chosen a very short haircut, baggy trousers and large T-shirts / baggy jumpers. She most certainly looks more "boy" than "girl". She prefers to buy certain clothes (shorts for example) from the boys section as the girl ones are a bit pink / short / cute for her. I happily support her, she can wear whatever makes her happy.

We have a family wedding and she wants a suit rather than a dress and I am a little sad that we can't go pretty dress shopping. However I wouldn't say it to her and will happily help her choose a suit that makes her look gorgeous.... but floaty dresses are so lovely 😫😫😂

*The trouble with a term like "tomboy" is it that it feeds into the narrative that a girl who likes football/short hair/climbing trees etc is somehow "other", and directly contributes to the stereotypes which lead into people then thinking their behaviour doesn't match their sex, therefore they must be something other than their sex.

Personally (having also been described as a tomboy in my time, and now being a gender non-conforming adult), I firmly prefer the term "girl" to describe a female child, regardless of what shes wearing and what her interests are.

I'm very firm with my own girls that climbing trees is for girls, cricket is for girls, trousers are for girls, ballet and dresses and skirts and make up are for girls, and no behaviours/hobbies/clothes/hair styles make them any less "girl". (Obviously they are also taught the same principle in reverse!!)*

@Canyousewcushions absolutely nailed it. I can’t believe we are in 2023 and our idea of what is “girly” hasn’t changed since I was a child 40 years ago. It’s very sad, I thought we would have moved on by now, in some ways it’s worse.

My DD never conformed to gender stereotypes. Wouldn't wear the Disney princess dresses, hated being in anything girly, played rugby, loved beating the boys in martial arts etc. When she was 12 she cut her hair short and started wearing really boyish clothes etc. I'll admit to being a teeny bit disappointed when she'd go to parties and all her friends wore dresses etc but I got over that quickly and I'm immensely proud of her for being strong enough to consistently not conform. She's now 14 and is starting to take care of her hair and wear a little bit of mascara but nowhere near the extent of her friends. We went to a festival and she wore dungarees and Hawaiian shirts while all her mates were in identikit outfits of teeny skorts and bikini tops. She's still the first one to jump in the sea or get on the big scary rides at the fair. She's brave and original and just herself. Embrace it OP.

You are getting a hard time on here OP. It's fine to be honest with yourself. We are learning about our children as they grow up and that can mean realising they are their own person not just who we thought they might be. It's not just appearances where this happens. It's also their personality, their values and choices. I think the image thing for girls is complex now though so hope she can just stay happy with it all and not made to feel confused.

Bizarre.

What makes her a girl are her XX chromosomes. Everything else is societal.

Bright, funny, healthy, happy child

Yet you are sad about her hair and lack of pink fucking bows

You and your child are in a very very fortunate position, get yourself a wee grip.

I’m actually really disturbed by the narrative here that it’s ok because she will become girly later, evidenced in all the personal stories. It’s ok even if she stays gender non-conforming forever.

@cardibach- you can discount my personal anecdote from that category because I genuinely would not have cared or felt sad if my DD had continued to wear her hair short and dress in comfortable sportswear.

I agree. "Don't worry, she'll conform eventually when she discovers boys, lol!" Ugh.

I didn’t mean people who said that, @waterlego but rather posters talking about themselves saying it’s fine (in one case ‘all is not lost’) because she’ll conform sooner or later.

@cardibach, I see what you’re saying. ‘All is not lost’ is a bit of an unfortunate/revealing choice of words.

I was a "tomboy" and guess what? I never grew out of it. Never got "girly", never got interested I what I wore, never wore make up. Work in a male dominated profession. 50+ years of failed feminity. And I'm perfectly happy (and still managed to discover boys, get married, have a family).

You're right OP, this is totally about you and your own limitations.

@NC4Obvs Hi OP
I guess it is ok to feel a bit sad if you used to enjoy doing girly things with her and now you feel like that is gone. Its no worse than feeling a bit sad and not wanting to send them to school on the first day etc. I think you are handling it well by not saying anything to DD and letting it out on here, just a shame about the pile on from some sad miserable people.

Only time will tell if it is a phase or how she is going to be but sounds like she has a lovely mother so I am sure she will be happy

I can understand your feelings. When you are pregnant and have a baby you imagine a future for them. My DD is a tom boy but deffo goes through stages. Right now she's back to dressing in men's clothes and has short hair. She looks amazing but I imagined a girly girl but then when she was 6 my nephew confirmed they were a boy so I think my mind was already open to the fact she would possibly go down the same route so I adjusted. My sister did grieve the loss of a daughter but loves her son very much and is supportive.

Your feelings are valid because they are what you are feeling. You cannot change how you feel initially but in time you will accept them x

100% this!

I get it. I don't have this situation but I think it's important to remember that they are their own person and as long as they are happy and healthy, what does it matter? You can do a lot with short hair, style wise which can look amazing. There's nothing wrong with having a conversation about what she wears/looks like to see why she is happiest like this but not risk losing her by being negative.

You never know, 2 years time she could be the opposite... or not. And both are ok!

Omg some of these responses make me sad! You are a good mum, supporting her in every way you can. Yes it is ok to feel sad. When you have a child finding out the gender and everything that goes with it builds expectations. It is almost a sort of grief that your child is not what you were expecting. To feel sad about this is perfectly reasonable as long as you don't communicate this to her and you support her wishes which you are doing 100%. I know this is not the same thing but my son is gay. He is now 21 in a committed relationship with a lovely partner and I couldn't be happier for him. However, along the way and even now sometimes if i'm honest i feel sad, because this means that life is harder for him. That is ok. We are good mums.

You felt sad because your son is gay?

The term Tom boy is hideous.
It implies she's not a proper girl