To expect my 11 year old to be able to use the toilet during the school day?

[bendy75]

Is this the norm? My 11 year old started in at secondary school last month and has had two warnings (or stage 2 - Low level disruptions) for asking to use the toilet.

I told him to try and go at break times but he tells me they are locked, confirmed today by staff when I asked, children who have a medical need can apply for a toilet pass but he does not, so has to try and go from 8.00 am until returning home around 3.00pm without using the toilet.

AIBU to be shocked by this?

IF that's the case - toilets locked during lessons "only" - then why are staff clear not in responding to a parental enquiry?
Teachers, by any definition, need to have achieved a good standard of professional communication.

This can't be real

Not to that extent but my '80s secondary had a set of toilets accessed from the playground known as the smokers toilets.

At least it meant the rest of the toilets stayed clean and smoke free. The head must have known. And taken the logic it meant the mess / smell etc was contained

Unfortunately it is true.

The strawman raises their head.

Although if a teacher was breaking the rules in the toilets they would be getting formal warnings and fired for breaking the rules and possibly the law.

Indeed 😊! Schools have changed a lot!

That’s ridiculous. I’m a teacher in a secondary school and I’d ask the pupil to wait until the change of lesson if they could. If they asked again, then I’d let them go with a note in case a member of staff challenged them when they were in the corridor.

In large schools, there will not be time for every pupil to go to the toilet at break and lunch so the school really need to allow pupils to go when they need to. I’d request a call from someone in a senior management.

The telling thing here is the fact that the child has to take a note to the toilet with them in case they meet another staff member on their way! Jeez! 😩

I would be writing a formal written complaint. This is not acceptable.

If the rule is you cant piss all day unless you have a pass for a urinary problem, that is a shit and unsafe rule! Do you see that ‘rule’ in any workplace in the UK? Even kids have human rights. If the school cant manage their toilets then they need to think how to deal with that problem without hurting the kids. If teachers cant use the loo at breaktime and are sacked for using the toilet outside of break times Im sure their union would have a field day. This isnt 1823 ffs!

*Withnailandsigh

@Maireas 1990s.
place was pure anarchy and had terrible attendance rates. New headteacher was determined to fix the culture and did so by meeting the kids in the middle on a lot of stuff he was unusual in his approach. I remember a handful of us got pissed on the school charity walk and him handing us all cans of coke and bags of crisps in his office ‘it’s the last day of term and I really cannot be arsed with the paperwork and the phone calls. Sober up and fuck off home please. Don’t do this again.’ I liked him*

It wasn’t Rudge Park Comprehensive and your HT wasn’t called Mr Gilbert🤣🤣🤣

They mean locked during lesson. Not at all times. That’s standard.

I was at secondary in the 90s. The school that I attended had relatively quiet a few toilets, which were always unlocked. I have an overactive bladder and needed to urinate frequently and sometimes suddenly. I would risk running into the bullies in the toilet at every break and dinner. There was 1 occasion though, when the weather was particularly hot and I had been drinking extra fluid, I really needed to use the toilet during lesson time. There was 20 minutes left, so the teacher denied my request. I sat for 10 minutes, desperately trying not to wee myself. Unable to focus on doing any work. After 10 minutes, my bladder was going to explode, so I ran out of class, quickly went to the loo and returned to finish my work. If I had taken the time to ask the teacher for permission, I would not have made it to the toilet.
Firstly, had the toilet been locked, I definitely would have gone to the stairwell to have a wee on the floor. It was coming out of my bladder regardless and it would have gone on the floor so why allow my clothes to get in the way?
Secondly, that incident, triggered a phone call to my dad because they was going to give me after school detention. I was then informed that I didn't have to do detention and that all of the teachers now knew to let me go during lesson. I was so embarrassed that the teachers must know that it's because I can't control my bladder and that I piss myself.
The toilet door could be seen from the class room so it would have taken 1 minute to nip there and back. We was working independently so no disruption to the rest of the class.

Have you read the thread ? Numerous teachers have posted to say this is the case in their schools amd the OP has been back to confirm the schools policy . It takes a couple of seconds to read the OPs posts before posting yourself

Can't imagine schools getting away with a smoking hut when Ofsted come visiting! I can imagine the risk assessment too! There are so many more hoops schools have to jump through now than they used to.

that's probably on the inofficial ofsted checklist schools go through before inspection.

• unlock all toilets
• clean all toilets
• appropriate toilet supervision on the day.

Well this thread has been horrifically eye-opening for me. God, no wonder kids have so little respect for teachers these days when these are the rules the teachers have to enforce. And to think schools are at a loss why anxiety is at an all time high and attendance becoming worrying low for students.

I've just seen this. Hope they're ready for quite a few calls

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/media_requests/4764572-media-request-from-bbc-newsround-does-your-childs-school-have-strict-toilet-policies

@FluffMagnet if behaviour was better they wouldn't have the problems with locked toilets. Most people on this thread seem more shocked by the locked toilets than the behaviour mentioned giving rise to this action.

That’s from 16th March 2023.

Well yes, because not allowing children to use the toilets is a breach of their human rights.

At my school the bullies got off on the fact that their victims had to come into the toilets. Giving them a place where the good kids never had to go would not have worked.

@Verbena17 Thanks...I didn't see that bit! This flippin website has driven me nuts...I've read so many comments today that I can't even see the date anymore! 😂

This is why i never drank or ate at school. The toilets we're like Battle Royale so most of us never dared enter. The younger/smaller boys used to pee in the fields from what i remember and us girls held it until home time. I remember a friend of mine actually pissed herself on the walk home from school. She was only about 10 minutes away from her house too but just couldnt hold it any longer. Sad times.

There are guidelines about numbers of toilets in buildings. The school I work at doesn’t have enough, even when they are all in good order. The school is so big that a fast walk from end to end takes six minutes. There are five minute breaks between lessons.
I know a number of the kids from babyhood, and of those who have medical conditions that mean they just have to go, I would never know. Naughty kids have bladder problems too: it’s possible to both want out of the lesson and urgently need to pee.
But the damage to loos is terrible and means the loos are not available just as bad as being locked (sometimes worse - mopping blood off the walls is so delightful, not.)
Possibly the difference between now and some years ago is the kids being locked into school. Lots of us used to go home for lunch - not allowed now - or just go home when we felt like it was all too much. These days you have to jump over the fence.