Did this really happen?! Why didn't I react?

[NCforthis23]

So today I was out shopping with DD who is a toddler and was in her pram.

We went to a large department store and got in the lift, an elderly couple got in. The lady took an immediate shine to DD and was trying to make her laugh.

The man positioned himself behind me and started rubbing my bum! I shifted forward away from him but said nothing and got out at the next floor.

I'm wracking my brains wondering why I did nothing. I feel ridiculous, I'm always so confident but I literally did nothing 😓

It’s the cognitive dissonance of the situation, OP. A sweet old couple, the presence of your baby and his own fucking wife. It’s not as obvious or brazen an assault as a young bloke on the street when you’re with your mates.

One of the worst I experienced was on a London tube train - it was a crush and he was a professional man older than my dad, wearing an expensive suit and carrying a briefcase. He put his whole hand up my skirt and his fingers inside me. It happened in a fraction of a second, and when I called out in shock and actually said something to him, he literally acted like I didn’t exist. Stared over my head, looked at his watch and got off at the next stop. Not a single person did or said anything - in fact I remember the woman squeezed in next to me actually gave me a filthy look; it was clear that nobody believed a word I said because it just didn’t compute that a man like that would do a thing like that - and if he did, how could nobody have seen? I was 17. Still makes me almost cry thinking about it. Just glad the cunt’s probably dead now.

"Yes we did care. It’s sexual assault. When it happened to me in the 90’s I did care a lot. I was getting off a train and as we shuffled down the aisle a creep grabbed my arse. I grabbed his hand and held it in the air and shouted ‘has anyone lost this, I just found it stuck to my arse!’ Hope it put him off doing it again!"

@BashfulClam I think I love you.

@EnjoythemoneyJane That's horrific, so sorry that happened to you. Bet he did it to loads of women.

That is truly awful. I'm so sorry that happened to you.

I’m very thankful that you were u affected by being felt up by a pervert in front of your dc. That doesn’t make it any more acceptable and the time period is irrelevant.

Op if you feel up to it please report him, there will likely be cctv to support your account. You did nothing wrong. You’re froze and I suspect that your instincts kicked in so that your dc and his lovely wife weren’t affected by his appalling actions. It’s a very different ball game when your dc are around. I hope you’re ok.

Mistake or not I’m sorry but this would also have been highly inappropriate.

@EnjoythemoneyJane I’m so sorry this happened and no one stood up for you. I can’t imagine witnessing a young woman saying something like this and not stepping in, even if it was just get her away from the abuser. We need to stand up to this sort of thing and believe woman. You deserved so much more.

Please report it to the store. It may have happened before and will probably happen again.

These fuckers disempower us when they do this crap. You find yourself asking yourself if it really happened, did you do something to make it happen etc. it is shocking.

Reporting it will make you feel better and give you back control.

Yes, we were more idiotic in the 1990s.

(I don’t believe that of course. I would report this today and I would have reported it in the 1990s)

This comment is to the person who suggested that in the 1990s we just accepted this behaviour or even enjoyed it.

"This comment is to the person who suggested that in the 1990s we just accepted this behaviour or even enjoyed it."

Women did not "just accept it" in the 90s
But they were subject to a far louder message that anything which happened to them must in some way be their own fault.
I don't think that has entirely gone away but at least people speak up about stuff now.

Just to say, as they were an elderly couple, that the man may have the onset of dementia. In which case reporting what happened may also help him and his wife, if the store/police are able to help track them. They may need support.

I’m sorry this happened to you.

I had this happen in a fully lacked tube train and when I finally managed to move away my friend told me afterwards that he then did it to her. Scum who depend on yoj being too shocked to act.
I also had this happen on a packed tube and although I didn't have the courage then to speak up, (I was 19) I did grab the offending hand and pinched as hard as I could. He silently stopped.

OP I hope you are OK today. It's totally natural to freeze; I've done it myself on all but one occasion. Sometimes due to embarrassment, sometimes fear, sometimes disbelief.

I am beyond furious at the shit women have dealt out to them by men.

The time I most regret not reacting was at a friend's 30th birthday meal. This guy (one of her other friend's husbands) knelt down beside our table, supposedly to chat, and during the conversation his hand was creeping further and further up my legs under my dress. I'm sure, thinking about it, the fact that my husband was also at the table was an extra turn-on for him.

I just froze and did nothing. I think my feeling was how embarrassing it would be to call him out in front of everyone else in the restaurant; also my husband (not a violent man in any way) would have instantly had him by the throat.

I so wish I'd stood up, said "What the fuck do you think you're doing?" and let whatever was going to happen, happen. Because he deserved to be shamed and I did nothing wrong.

I'm still furious 30 years later.

It happened to me in the 90s as a teen, but I was a savage&the pervs got a slap or a headbutt. I'm not condoning violence, but hopefully they'd think twice about doing it to another woman or girl, but I doubt it.

The freeze thing is completely understandable. People talk about Fight or Flight but the third response is Freeze. I Freeze OP. I do it when I am deeply distressed - always have. Can't run/can't argue/fight back - just feel locked in.

Similar happened to me when I was about 16. Older neighbours that my parents were always helping out - sweet couple that still went dancing on a Saturday night, sat in the garden in matching straw hats etc etc.

They popped in for tea one day and I was sat next to the husband who would have been early 70s. I felt his hand on my leg and at first thought he was unaware, then it started to move a bit and I thought maybe he was steadying himself as it was a bit shaky. He then started sliding my dress up my thigh and it was only when I felt him press his fingers against my underwear trying to wriggle his fingers between the tops of my thighs that I was really sure what was happening, but I froze and did nothing. My dad and mum and his wife were having tea and cake and chatting. They were two feet from me and was sat there frozen. I said nothing because I didn't want to 'upset' anyone - particularly his wife. I was also embarrassed at saying something in front of my dad. I finally forced myself to move and got up and went to the bathroom until they'd gone. I never said anything OP and i spent AGES asking myself if it really happened, but it absolutely did.

Be kind to yourself about it - it's horrible. And report if you feel strong enough.

Sorry to hear that @EnjoythemoneyJane what a disgusting individual

In the 80s I had to walk home through Soho and used to see these respectable looking suited and booted middle aged men ducking surreptitiously into sleezy "girlie" bars. Their families and work colleagues would probably have been extremely shocked.

When i was in Malaysia in my twenties, i had a man turn around to be whilst masturbating and saying 'thank you, thank you'.

I said to him automatically 'no problem' rather than kicking him in the balls.

I was groped at the Taj Mahal - and i did the same as you.

I'm still amazed that i did that - it's total shock and disbelief i think.

What happened to you is so awful - and i don't know why, but it's even worse that your baby was there. Hugs x

So sorry this happened to you. We hear about fight and flight, I've also hear in recent years that we also freeze in stressful situations as well. I've been in situations where I've frozen, it's to do with disbelief it's happening.
I was at a family event a few years ago, was talking in a group, felt a hand on my bum. Turned around, it was a distance family member I didn't know. At first I didn't believe it but then realised he was doing and don't think it was an accident. I moved away but didn't say anything. When I told my mother later she just brushed it off. I have brought it up to her whenever she's spoken about him since.

Sorry @SlightlyJaded , I've cross posted with you.

@highlandcoo
I completely get your fury after many years.

About 25 years ago I became Godmother to my friend's little girl.
At the post ceremony house get together we were in the kitchen preparing the Buffet when her Dad squeezed himself behind me, hands on my hips, hard-on pressing up at me 😡
His wife, daughter, Grandchildren, Son-in-law and my own young son were all in the vicinity. His daughter (my best friend) right beside me.

I am so full of rage that he did it with the almost sure knowledge that I wouldn't dare call him out about it.. Ruin a lifelong friendship? Bring shame to a baby's christening?
He was right.

He's now Dead, but I am still incandescent when the mood takes me. 😡

The comment about dementia is something to consider. Not that it makes it alright. Just saying. Nobody on here can possibly know. Tell the store its the only way. There should be CCTV in the lifts.

Very normal reaction. Combination of fear and crushing embarrassment at the prospect of having to call it out. Same thing happened to be when a man on a packed tube tried to wedge his boner between my butt cheeks.

Have you told your parents since?
Is he still alive?

Some men are very brazen aren't they. Prepared to take a risk for a cheap thrill.
No doubt if you said anything he would have denied it anyway.

Oh please. Nobody has ever legitimately steadied themselves by RUBBING a woman’s bum cheeks. Neither do people stand around rubbing their shopping bag that happens to feel like bum cheeks.
The will to find excuses for dirty old men is extraordinary.