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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think there should be much more awareness among cyclists that black and flouro yellow is absolutely rubbish for visibility in some areas?

143 replies

HauntedGusset · 07/10/2023 08:31

Let me start by saying I have no problem with cyclists using roads. I give them space, I hang back, I only ever overtake when it is definitely safe to do so despite this often enraging the driver behind me.

BUT.

I live really rurally. The main road through my village is a very popular one with cyclists as it is a 20 mile trip through a beautiful river valley. It's twisty, its turny, it's uppy downy. It also passes in and out of thick woodland along the whole route. So visibility is crap full stop.

A worrying majority of the cyclists I see on this road are wearing black and flouro yellow. This means they show up beautifully on the few open sections of road where it passes through villages and would therefore be great in urban areas, but makes them almost completely invisible when going in and out of tree shade or along tree lined roads. The black and yellow just blend in perfectly with the dappled shade through leaves on tarmac. You just can't see them until you're almost on top of them because the hi vis they've chosen isn't hi vis at all in the conditions they're actually riding in! It's practically camouflage.

Sometimes they have lights on, but all too often if it's daylight they don't. One I only just saw last week was in black and yellow with a black rucksack, nothing reflective, but a red flashing light on a rucksack strap that had fallen to the side so wasn't visible until you were to the side of him! Reflective strips are more common but they're not that much use when it's light as cars often don't have headlights on in the daytime (my current car does because it's got running lights, but that's not standard).

Every now and then I see a cyclist using bright pink, orange, or blue, and they stand out so well! You can spot them even in the mix of sun and shade that makes the black and yellow ones almost invisible.

It's so common for the "hi vis" they wear to be black with yellow bits that I assume it just isn't known about? Can any cyclists tell me if they know this?

OP posts:
Dreemhouse · 08/10/2023 08:35

As a cyclist myself this has been a really interesting read, and a nice change from the usual cyclist bashing that we sometimes see on here. I wear a lot of bright pink but I do tend to team it with black shorts. My helmet is black as well. This has really made me think about what colours I should be wearing. So thank you OP. I did an event recently where it was compulsory to wear a high viz vest and it was really no bother, so there’s no reason to not wear it all the time.

JesusMaryAndJosephAndTheWeeDon · 08/10/2023 10:11

The other thing to flag is the grey reflective "mercury" clothing. This is brilliant in the dark as it is highly reflective but if you put it on for your morning commute you really need some yellow/pink/orange hi-viz too for when it gets light as once the car headlights are off the reflective fabric is just grey and dull.

It has been well marketed recently but as with most clothing aimed at increasing visibility the manufacturers don't flag the limitations.

You need neons in daylight and reflectives in the dark so good safety clothing should combine both.

LuckOfTheDrawer · 08/10/2023 11:55

Helenahandkart · 07/10/2023 12:38

I’m a motorist and a cyclist. With an up to date eye test.
If you cycle but don’t drive I think it’s really easy to assume that a motorist can easily see you as easily as you can see them, but being in a vehicle behind a windscreen does compromise your ability to see, particularly in wet/dark conditions, regardless of how good your eyesight is.
I regularly see cyclists without lights, wearing black, and they are invisible until you’re almost too close to them. Factor in a lapse of concentration or another distraction, and you could easily hit one.
As road users we should all be doing what we can to make ourselves as safe as possible, and that includes making ourselves visible on our bikes.

100% agree with this.

LuckOfTheDrawer · 08/10/2023 12:03

MintJulia · 08/10/2023 08:33

I'm puzzled by @Rainbox99

Here we are, discussing the fact that a specific colour range makes cyclists almost impossible to see in rural environments, and suggesting a way to better protect those cyclists from harm.

And yet we are somehow wrong. Surely the fact that multiple people are saying the same thing, would make anyone with any common sense WANT to adapt to those conditions?

Some people are very strange !

I share the concerns voiced by several people on this thread (I'm both a driver and a cyclist). When I've talked about this online previously, I've been told - aggressively - that my eyes clearly aren't fit for driving (they are).

Why can't all road users just listen to each other respectfully?

LuckOfTheDrawer · 08/10/2023 12:05

I'm also a big advocate of daylight running lights for this reason.

Original poster
HauntedGusset · 08/10/2023 20:03

LuckOfTheDrawer · 08/10/2023 12:05

I'm also a big advocate of daylight running lights for this reason.

Yes they really should be fitted as standard in all cars!

OP posts:
enchantedsquirrelwood · 08/10/2023 21:29

Daylight running lights are a legal requirement these days. But there are a lot of cars without them - one of our cars (2017 reg) has them, the other (reg in 2014) does not.

LuckOfTheDrawer · 08/10/2023 21:31

I meant daylight running lights for bikes actually.

gotomomo · 08/10/2023 21:35

Anything but plain black is an improvement! Honestly the amount of cyclists in all black on our tree lined, bendy, and sometimes trees over the top making a tunnel country lanes is shocking, these are 60 mph too so anything you do to increase visibility helps keep you safe

Original poster
HauntedGusset · 09/10/2023 07:51

LuckOfTheDrawer · 08/10/2023 21:31

I meant daylight running lights for bikes actually.

I didn't even know they were a thing. That would be the absolute best option!!

OP posts:
Original poster
HauntedGusset · 09/10/2023 07:54

gotomomo · 08/10/2023 21:35

Anything but plain black is an improvement! Honestly the amount of cyclists in all black on our tree lined, bendy, and sometimes trees over the top making a tunnel country lanes is shocking, these are 60 mph too so anything you do to increase visibility helps keep you safe

Like this you mean..!

(This is a pic one of my DC took earlier this year, on a national speed limit A road 😬)

To think there should be much more awareness among cyclists that black and flouro yellow is absolutely rubbish for visibility in some areas?
OP posts:
Caerulea · 09/10/2023 08:02

Was saying exactly this yesterday. I live very rurally in the SW & all our 'main roads' (very narrow lanes, lots of blind corners & national speed limit) are hedged or tree lined. The black & yellow is invisible against sunlit leaves & shade. It's horrendous. I drove by someone dressed entirely in black yesterday! Bright pink seems to be the best colour to stand out in all situations, I'm not sure why there isn't legislation around this.

GOODCAT · 09/10/2023 08:06

@HauntedGusset this is interesting. I wear a yellow jacket with a yellow bib over the top with reflective bits on it. I am on my bike early in the morning, so however warm it is, I always have the jacket on, but go through a heavily tree lined road. I always have lights on no matter what the conditions.

Is it the specific combination of yellow and black on top or does this still happen with just yellow on top?

booksandbrooks · 09/10/2023 08:11

YANBU, clearly there should be more awareness raised. I had no idea. I have yellow high vis, but I am an urban cyclist. I'll definitely get some pink in before a country ride now. Thanks for the tip.

Porridgeislife · 09/10/2023 08:11

@GOODCAT It’s either colour really, both blend in well especially around beech. You want to contrast as much as possible with the scenery around you.

Also, reflective strips rely on something to reflect against. Not all cars have running lights so it’s not all that useful in daylight.

NeighbourhoodWatchPotholeDivision · 09/10/2023 08:15

I'm an urban commuter cyclist, usually dressed in yellow hi-vis.

I had no idea that it would blend in to trees under certain conditions. I'll remember this for any out of town trips.

Flickersy · 09/10/2023 08:16

I think this is a very pertinent thread at this time of year when the sun is low during rush hour and can make it much more difficult to spot hazards or can be blinding / dazzling. I had actually noticed this "camouflage" effect with a cyclist the other weekend.

I'm not a cyclist myself but I respect cyclists and I understand they have a right to be on the road whereas my car is only there by permission. I'd love to cycle, I'm just too nervous.

MikeRafone · 09/10/2023 08:18

Cyclists are constantly told to wear hi vis
they are doing what’s requested
you now complain it’s not correct they do this
many cyclists have for years being stating hi vis doesn’t work But people refuse to believe it

even police cars adorned with high vis and flashing lights get smashed into

Caerulea · 09/10/2023 08:18

HauntedGusset · 09/10/2023 07:54

Like this you mean..!

(This is a pic one of my DC took earlier this year, on a national speed limit A road 😬)

Show quote history

Exactly this photo. Exactly. There's not many ppl who live locally who cycle the main roads cos they are too dangerous. But holidaymakers love it 😬. Lots of sections like this but also very narrow & in the summer a lot of ppl driving on the wrong side of the road, over the lines round sharp bends, wide caravans etc, Lanes narrowing, hedges overgrown, blind junctions...

Seeing a cyclist going 5mph when you're going 50mph very late due to bad coloured clothing is incredibly stressful. I like to keep well back from cyclists till I can safely pass (which can be miles sometimes. Ngl, when you're trying to get to work or school or the hospital isn't funny) cos they are squishy things on metal frames & are vulnerable af on these roads.

This shouldn't be contentious at all. Wear flashing lights, bright pink, I really don't mind. Just anything to make you safe as possible.

MikeRafone · 09/10/2023 08:23

This Dorset police car was crashed into by a motorist from behind

To think there should be much more awareness among cyclists that black and flouro yellow is absolutely rubbish for visibility in some areas?
NeighbourhoodWatchPotholeDivision · 09/10/2023 08:29

MikeRafone · 09/10/2023 08:18

Cyclists are constantly told to wear hi vis
they are doing what’s requested
you now complain it’s not correct they do this
many cyclists have for years being stating hi vis doesn’t work But people refuse to believe it

even police cars adorned with high vis and flashing lights get smashed into

It's not 100% preventative.

But it does help.

As I said above, I am a cyclist. I wear yellow hi-vis and lights, because when cycling, I can't see other cyclists if they're wearing dark clothing and have no lights. Which means the car drivers travelling at far higher speeds can't see us either without hi-vis.

It's October and the nights are drawing in, so let me take this opportunity to say:

make sure your teenage children have lights on their bikes and they are using them.

Toddlerteaplease · 09/10/2023 08:29

DustyLee123 · 07/10/2023 08:32

A lot of cyclists around my area just wear black.

Came on to say this. Scooter riders as well. It terrifies me that I will hit one one day. Because they just can't be seen.

LuckOfTheDrawer · 09/10/2023 09:06

MikeRafone · 09/10/2023 08:23

This Dorset police car was crashed into by a motorist from behind

But it's not all or nothing is it? I mean, one person doesn't just crash or not crash into something with hi viz.

If all cyclists wear hi viz and reflective gear, and use daylight running lights, and all car drivers drive carefully and use daylight running lights, then less accidents will occur. I mean, why wouldn't you do these things?

MikeRafone · 09/10/2023 09:11

As I said above, I am a cyclist. I wear yellow hi-vis and lights, because when cycling, I can't see other cyclists if they're wearing dark clothing and have no lights. Which means the car drivers travelling at far higher speeds can't see us either without hi-vis.

not being funny but if you can't see them, how do you see them? If drivers can't see a cyclists in daylight without flashing lights - then should they be driving at that speed? drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully

drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully that is the message that should be handed out drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully, otherwise they are going to continue to keep killing drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully, if they can't see police cars and crash into them drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully

vulnerable people have taken measures to wear do see and behave

now its drivers turn to drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully

Goodmirror · 09/10/2023 09:21

MikeRafone · 09/10/2023 09:11

As I said above, I am a cyclist. I wear yellow hi-vis and lights, because when cycling, I can't see other cyclists if they're wearing dark clothing and have no lights. Which means the car drivers travelling at far higher speeds can't see us either without hi-vis.

not being funny but if you can't see them, how do you see them? If drivers can't see a cyclists in daylight without flashing lights - then should they be driving at that speed? drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully

drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully that is the message that should be handed out drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully, otherwise they are going to continue to keep killing drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully, if they can't see police cars and crash into them drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully

vulnerable people have taken measures to wear do see and behave

now its drivers turn to drivers need to start slowing down and looking carefully

Yes of course in an ideal world but we don't live in one of those unfortunately

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