My 5 year old injured a child

[Soworriedtoday]

Posting for traffic. Name changed. Feeling sick.

My 5 year has injured another child at school. Other child has required urgent hospital treatment and is requiring ongoing treatment.

I don't know who the other child is and I imagine that the last thing the parents want is anything to do with us.

I don't know what to do. What am I supposed to do? My child "lashed out". We are a caring family, lots of opportunities, not exposed to anything like violence or substance, travel around the world.

What do I do? Will anything happen to my child?

*FFS! Gentle parenting but a Dc can whack someone? It’s utter rubbish!

Please teach children to find an adult and walk away. Recognise and leave a boiling up situation if they possibly can. I would say that the op’s child couldn’t do this and certainly isn’t to blame at 5. However if a Dc is upset, find an adult. The school doesn’t have to share which Dc were involved. They should be dealing with them via their bullying snd behaviour policy too. As a parent, I’d leave it there.*

We are known as the weirdo parents in our circles because of the amount of respectful communication we encourage. We don't do time outs, don't shout, have conversations about our feelings and work through them. Allow our children to hold their boundaries and respect their feelings. We are the only people we know who parent this way.
However.
As a child I was bullied from age 6 until about age 13. Talking to teachers did absolutely nothing, they didn't care, I have terrible self esteem issues as an adult because of what went on in the playground. I ALWAYS went to look for a teacher. One time the police were called in to school because of something that occurred on the playground, that in adults would have seen the offending adult arrested for sexual assault. The other child received one on one counselling because of their actions. I got fuck all support at school and this child was not removed from my class or group play sessions as they ABSOLUTELY should have been. What did I do in this situation? Tell a teacher.

Somebody tried to pick on my DH once when he was in primary and wouldn't back off, provoked him, so he hit them. They didn't do it again and in to secondary, it was remembered that he wasn't somebody to target. School didn't care and said he was provoked by the other child.
Guess who is more well rounded as an adult? I've had to reparent myself completely.

I don't encourage violence AT ALL but I do encourage kids standing up for themselves, and if a 5 year old was being surrounded by a group of 9 year olds taunting them (how scary?!) Would I be annoyed for the 5 year old doing what they did? No. It's self defence, and some would argue that self defence is a reasonable time to lash out.

It sounds like the school acknowledges poor supervision in the playground, this shouldn't have even been allowed to happen and that is where the blame lies. Not with the children.

It seemed like it was well deserved then.

I’ve had similar situations with my 3 yo. He’s the biggest in the class, the most developed socially and in terms of communications, and hates unkind behaviour. Latest one - he was hit by older kids (they play with Reception) for protecting his friends & went crazy. Took on 3 boys at once and had to be lifted off them. The PE teacher who intervened has recommended a sport to channel his emotions - they want to put him in year 1 rugby and hockey after he turns 4.

Girls who hit aren’t treated in the same way as boys who do. Teachers would always deliver harsher punishments to me (despite my being provoked) as I’d hit my bullies. Whereas with boys they were told to shake hands and it’d be sorted. There is such an inherent sexism on the playground and it doesn’t get much better in girls schools.

So there were have it, another school allowing behavioural policy failures resulting in a physical escalation.

9 year old has hopefully learned a lesson here because god know what he will do next.

To the poster saying the 5 year old should have walked away and found a teacher, please, the 5 year old was so scared he instinctively defending himself physically. That I’m even having to explain that shows no understanding of bullying.

The 9 year old should be apologising as should the other children crowding round a 5 year in order to deliberately intimidate him.

Feral behaviour and no doubt these children will end up delinquents unless there is early intervention. Whatever that even means at this point.

I’ll wait for the excuses and justifications for this sort of behaviour of course. There are are by some.

OP I’d be concerned this is an ongoing issue, so talk to your son, although he may be reluctant.

Alway are* and I mean always are excuses

It can go either way - I never got into trouble for hitting boys (who were bullying me) partly because I was a goody two shoes aside from that, but the boys were also explicitly shamed by the rest of the class for “crying because a little girl kicked your arse”.

Boys hitting other boys was seen as far more serious (which, in terms of potential injury, it is).

The school has not punished your boy, and don't want you to. That speaks volumes to me about what happened.

I would be concerned for your child, not for the boy he injured, and I'm glad that the school is handling it so sensitively.

This - in both primaries my DC went to reception kids were not with older children anyway - on different playgrounds and there was adult supervision and a crowd would attract attention.

First school has ethos of looking our for each other and being kind which did seem to work and second rougher one even there older kids would look our for younger ones even standing up to few bullies there were when they'd normally avoid.

It doesn't say good things about this school IMO.

Sounds like self defence. Your ds couldn't have got away as he was surrounded. He felt threatened and tried to protect himself poor lad. No need to feel guilty any more.

Please elaborate. What exactly did your DC do, and what exactly are the injuries? You're being quite guarded about the whole thing, which makes it hard to give advice.

@Puffinsandcreeks reading your post has made me so angry for primary school and teenage you.

There is no excuse for teachers to ignore bullying and they do it because they are too scared (yes, there are unparented children everywhere causing sheer chaos and upset), lazy, inept, insert whatever you want, to put in the work. Similarly most of the state services eg CAHMS or social services are in the same predicament.

I’m truly not interested in the excuses for this either I’m really not because so many people involved with children are not fit to be within a 100 mile radius of them. That is the issue, the calibre of person, yes I’ll hear state funding and the Tory’s and the this and the that, but there are people are are currently in these positions right now and they are doing sweet fuck or at best the bare minimum. Teachers turn a blind eye because to actually give a damn and enforce school policy beyond their pay grade.

Of course this doesn’t apply to all schools or mental health workers but it does apply to too many.

There have been threads of the decline of the UK, teenage knife crime, you name it and it starts here in the formative years, primary school is supposed to be a joy and cultivate a love of learning. Wtf is going on.

For clarity. I didn’t say Dc in this instance could have walked away. I’ve clearly said 5 year olds and 9 year olds should not be together in the playground. The school need to evaluate their playground policy and keep ks1 separate. It’s really not possible for 5 year olds to “discuss “ issues and feelings with 9 year olds so they need another mechanism to avoid them get help. Recognising a threat is the first thing and staying with your own friends always helps. Another child will then get help. This is a failure of playground policy and supervision.

There is now safeguarding. @Puffinsandcreeks Teachers have legal obligations. I don’t recognise all this dreadful behaviour and schools not dealing with it. In this case the school needs to look at how it keeps ALL Dc safe and separates older Dc from younger ones. It has clear obligations to do this. Younger Dc should not have access to older Dc (and vice versa) and all must stay with their own age group usually via separate play areas. The school must reinforce this. It’s pretty standard playground policy for exactly the reasons we have been discussing.

Still wondering what the 5-yr old did to hospitalise the 9-yr old and warrant their ongoing treatment...

Pushed them away probably and they fell. It’s a case where the school must record and report it.

My earlier comment was to a poster who is a gentle parent but tells Dc to retaliate. I don’t see this as sensible. It means Dc get hurt. It’s best to have antennae and recognise that your own age group is a safer place and to avoid difficult Dc within that cohort.

My son (now an adult) has ADHD and I was forever called into school due to his impulsive behaviour, but I remember the first time he pushed someone, they stumbled, fell and broke their glasses. He was 5. I asked him how it happened, he told me, we spoke to the parents of the other child, replaced the glasses and put steps in place to ensure this wouldn’t happen again. At 5 years old, your child should be able to tell you at least who it was so you can contact the parents. What exactly has happened that they would need ongoing treatment? Does the child have a cut that will need redressing once in a while? Does the child have a head injury that will need to be operated on? Has the child broken a bone? Ongoing treatment can mean anything, it does not necessarily mean the child is seriously injured. At 5 years old it is unlikely that anything will happen to them, maybe miss a week of playtimes but there won’t be any formal punishment through the courts.

@TizerorFizz I have been wondering why something had felt off with your responses because overall you have valid points but there it is…why should any child have to avoid anywhere?

Im fairly realistic - we don’t live in Utopia but this narrative is bullshit I’m afraid, nobody should be afraid to go anywhere. Again I understand what you’re trying to say but it’s not right.

Gentle parenting at home is great, but because there is such subversive behaviour outside the home, of course teaching a child to defend themselves is sensible and seems necessary for that poster. Shame gentle parenting isn’t standard - maybe less violence everywhere.

Ok now that I have read the update, I am so so sorry for your initial judgment. I just wish you made this more clear from the getgo rather than shroud us all in mystery.

Very well deserved for the 9-year-old, and kudos to your son for being a tough little cookie!

Sounds like a well-deserved lesson from the school of "fuck around and find out" to me.

Plenty of schools only have one playground and years 1-6 all play out in the same playground.

Usually playtime is separate even in one form entry schools. But they do a lot of supervised integration in my kids school, so every week when they walk to church the year 6s partner the Yr r's and hold their hands. They go into higher classes to show off a good piece of work, or year 5 and year 6 who are sensible act as play leaders and help supervise on the ks1 playground. I don't think we should send a message that 5 year olds should be scared of or not ever talk to 9 year olds but playtime is not the best medium.
In this case as was clear from the school reaction this was a group of year 5 surrounding and taunting an upset year r which would make me concerned for the general culture of the school. I'd expect most 9 year olds would help an upset 5 year old not bully them!

I have repeatedly asked my child and they simply do not know older child's name. They say they are not friends or anything.

Older child has suffered a very nasty cut and this will need redressing.

We have 2 playgrounds with age appropriate equipment. The smaller kids are allowed to go on big playground on occasion as "a treat." School have reassured me that this will not happen again.

I have apologised through school to the parents but I won't apologise further.

This.

Sounds like a great outcome, Op.

The school will contact you if it's that severe OP. They're 5 years old, I wouldn't worry too much.

My earlier comment was to a poster who is a gentle parent but tells Dc to retaliate. I don’t see this as sensible. It means Dc get hurt. It’s best to have antennae and recognise that your own age group is a safer place and to avoid difficult Dc within that cohort.

To make it clear, I haven't told my child to reliate and hurt anyone. We encourage talking and respectful, empathetic communication. But I would say we are in the minority - shouting, belittling, name calling, and even smacking is VERY common in many households. I hear the way other parents speak to their children at drop off and it is unsurprising the children lack emotional intelligence. The world isn't all roses. I fucking wish it was.
If they ever communicate to me that they feel threatened, I will encourage self defense. We used to do karate as self defence as kids. Would this be frowned upon now?
If a 5 year old is being surrounded and scared by a group of 9 year olds, setting aside, what do you suggest that 9 year old does in that exact moment? Kids aren't always able to get away from the antagonists, hence why bullying is a thing. My school bullies were always older than me.

Also, saying children shouldn't play with older children at all is just idealism and it won't be upheld. My DC has 3 older cousins at school. Of course they end up together on the playground. You can't tell a child "you can play with xxx at home but never at school".