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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

DS's school trip was offered on a 'first come first serve' basis and is now being drawn at random from a hat

315 replies

Worriedaandconfused · 03/10/2023 11:50

AIBU to think the school should honour the first come first serve basis they initially stated for allocating places on the school trip?

They have, due to a 'huge response' of requested places, decided to draw names at random on Friday.

After promising my child a place and ensuring I handed the form in promptly to the teacher (in fairness, it sounds like a lot of other parents did, too), I'm now going to have to explain to my 4 year old he's unlikely to have a place.

How do your own DC's schools handle situations like this where there's limited places and lots of interest?

OP posts:
BungleandGeorge · 04/10/2023 11:01

i hate these selective trips at any age. Either it’s part of the curriculum and would be wrong to exclude some kids or it’s a jolly and shouldn’t take place in school time. I don’t know why anyone thinks this type of thing is ok. What’s probably happened is the vast majority of children handed them in on the first morning, too many for the places available so they’ve had to change it.

Fink · 04/10/2023 11:04

Names out of hat is fairer for everyone: working parents, children who live between two households, and poorer families are all penalised by FCFS. And if it's the parents queuing up to hand the forms in then anyone with more than one child to drop off is also penalised.

If they weren't expecting a huge response, then FCFS could have worked. But if 60 children brought in the reply slips on the first day for a 30 person trip, then how to you judge who was first? There are lots of ways they could have done FCFS which wouldn't actually work for a massive oversubscription - what if parents were expected to hand the forms in as they hand over their child at the door, or children to hand it in as their names were called in the register? In both cases that just means that the people who are higher up the alphabetical order get more of a chance (or whatever order the children line up in), not to mention that if there's more than a one form entry you would then have to judge who was called at what time across different classes.

In short, ideally they should have a trip available to everyone. If that's not possible then names out of a hat is the best way. It wasn't ideal to advertise one system and then have to use another, but that's just what happens in real life when things don't turn out according to how the planners expected.

AmazingSnakeHead · 04/10/2023 11:09

Everyone should be allowed to go at 4, that's really bad of the school.

OhwhyOY · 04/10/2023 11:10

I'd be annoyed by this too. When I was 8 my school did a week-long seaside trip and only ever had enough spaces for two thirds if the class to go. The names were selected 'at random'. Yet all of the teacher's pets were selected and all of the more behaviourally challenging (and for the most part poorer) children were not selected, including my best friend. The excluded kids were devastated. My mum and others complained about it as the school chose the accommodation, trips etc so could easily have chosen somewhere the whole class could go. The trip went ahead that year but from the following year they changed the trip so that it was to a different place and the whole class could go. I would definitely complain, even if it is in a gentle 'in future it would be great to do X as this doesn't feel fair '.

enchantedsquirrelwood · 04/10/2023 11:11

BungleandGeorge · 04/10/2023 11:01

i hate these selective trips at any age. Either it’s part of the curriculum and would be wrong to exclude some kids or it’s a jolly and shouldn’t take place in school time. I don’t know why anyone thinks this type of thing is ok. What’s probably happened is the vast majority of children handed them in on the first morning, too many for the places available so they’ve had to change it.

I agree.

My ds still moans about the fact he missed out on a history trip in Y8 to people who didn't do it for GCSE or A level Grin

I also think that teachers can choose who they want "randomly". That said, they can "accidentally" lose a first come first served slip too.

Mothership4two · 04/10/2023 11:13

@Anyotherdude

I don’t think that OP was wrong to promise her 4-year old that she would get the form in as quickly as possible to make sure they would get on the activity!

She didn't though, she said she promised him a place. And now has to explain to him he might not get one.

BadgerBeedon · 04/10/2023 11:30

Ever so slightly tangental, but I’m reminded of the time a school mum complained when her child missed out on an oversubscribed school activity. Her reasoning was that because her child didn’t go to wraparound care, her kid should be a priority. (Regardless of the school’s ‘names out of a hat’ approach.) Cos free childcare innit?
That was in reception year, and she’s been ‘that’ parent ever since.

stayathomer · 04/10/2023 11:32

NameChange30

They're doing a school trip for 4yos and can't accommodate everyone? That's shit. It should be for all of none. They're 4 FFS.

Absolutely this!! So ridiculous-if they didn’t have places for everyone they shouldn’t have organised it

Anyotherdude · 04/10/2023 11:41

@Mothership4two IME, splitting hairs doesn’t help. OP told her DC something based on what the school originally said. It’s the school that has changed the rules, so whatever she said, or didn’t, is moot, and the OP is not necessarily at fault for believing the terms as they were presented…

babyproblems · 04/10/2023 11:41

NameChange30 · 03/10/2023 11:55

They're doing a school trip for 4yos and can't accommodate everyone? That's shit. It should be for all of none. They're 4 FFS.

This. I’d consider taking my child wherever they’re going myself or asking if I volunteered for the day could my child come or could we organise a private trip for whatever it is for anyone that wasn’t included. They should include all of course it’s ridiculous

Redlarge · 04/10/2023 11:48

First come first served is grossly unfair and literally prejudices certain children from a chance.
My youngests school used to do this... first to pay on app all get to go.
Great if you arent working and can make yourself instantly available to sign up. Also great if you have the money there and then. I had to wait to pay until payday and was basically told, sorry but the parents who paid got the trip/music lessons/afterschool clubs. Needless to say it was the same fecking kids getting everything. All of the time.
They have scrapped it now.

Sunandsea26 · 04/10/2023 11:52

Agree they shouldn’t have changed it, that’s not fair. I think I’d have done the same as you with my 4 year old but then again you didn’t 100% know he had a space I guess.

Mothership4two · 04/10/2023 11:59

Anyotherdude · 04/10/2023 11:41

@Mothership4two IME, splitting hairs doesn’t help. OP told her DC something based on what the school originally said. It’s the school that has changed the rules, so whatever she said, or didn’t, is moot, and the OP is not necessarily at fault for believing the terms as they were presented…

Yes I know I have RTWT. Was just clarifying what you said. Personally wouldn't have promised something that was a possibility but not definitely happening. Not that this helps the OP now.

Sunandsea26 · 04/10/2023 12:20

Redlarge · 04/10/2023 11:48

First come first served is grossly unfair and literally prejudices certain children from a chance.
My youngests school used to do this... first to pay on app all get to go.
Great if you arent working and can make yourself instantly available to sign up. Also great if you have the money there and then. I had to wait to pay until payday and was basically told, sorry but the parents who paid got the trip/music lessons/afterschool clubs. Needless to say it was the same fecking kids getting everything. All of the time.
They have scrapped it now.

That is so so horrible 😢 not surprised they scrapped it!!!

TrustyRusty68 · 04/10/2023 13:05

Seems pretty bad planning from the school to have insufficient places for all! But your child is 4! Pretty sure you can just say sorry, you can’t go this time. It’ll be your turn next time. Or do something else with them instead. Guess next time don’t promise something that’s out of your control. Schools pull stuff like this all the time!

paddlinglikecrazy · 04/10/2023 13:12

Different situation as it’s high school, but any pupils that miss out on a trip are offered the place first on the next trip at my dc school, Which seems fair.

I’d be cheesed off at the goal posts being moved too in your situation op.
also infant & junior school seems rubbish that not enough places are available. Never cropped up for us & my kids attended a large primary school.

EnoughNow2023 · 04/10/2023 17:10

Never experienced this. Usually they split a trip and do 2 days to ensure all can go at our school.
Have they said why places are limited. Is it venue size or adult to child ratio issues?

LunaandLily · 04/10/2023 17:50

I think at 4 he might just recover.

JuniperKeats · 04/10/2023 18:21

Sometimes more than one “hat”. Can be used to exclude pupils likely to cause a nuisance…….

Sennelier1 · 04/10/2023 18:22

Maybe it's different where I live (Belgium) but here excursions álways are for the whole class. Why would you organise something if not all the children can join? Unless the class is split in two and each group gets to go separately?

vicky46 · 04/10/2023 18:41

I’m just shocked that they have planned any trip that doesn’t accommodate them all at that age.

Toomuchtrouble4me · 04/10/2023 18:51

He won’t care, he’s only 4. If he doesn’t get a place they will make it a fun day for the rest

Zeezee82 · 04/10/2023 18:55

I’d guess that the first back we’re children they don’t want to take and “random draw” will be the nice kids

angela99999 · 04/10/2023 18:59

NameChange30 · 03/10/2023 11:55

They're doing a school trip for 4yos and can't accommodate everyone? That's shit. It should be for all of none. They're 4 FFS.

Yes, this. It's just plain lazy not to sort a trip out that everybody can go on.

angela99999 · 04/10/2023 19:02

Worriedaandconfused · 03/10/2023 13:34

@Bouncyball23, I suspect the reason that they do the trip in key stages rather than just one class, is because, in the past, turn out hasn't been this high. They offered the KS2 theatre trip to 4 year groups and I haven't heard that this has changed from first come so can only assume it's not in demand and the children that want a place have all go one.

Why can't they organise a trip that everybody wants to go on? If the theatre trip isn't usually appealing to everyone they should do something else.