I think an 18 year old is an adult -AIBU?

[Drdoomish]

They can get married
They can live under their own steam away from parents
They can take out loans and get into exceptional debt
They can fight and die for our country
They can become an MP or councillor
They can legally get pissed in a pub
They can get their own tattoo
They can sit on a jury
They can leave education
And do all the things that adults can do...

So why, WHY, do the government use a parents income to decide how much living cost loan they will lend to an 18-24 university student?

YABU - An 18 yr old uni student is still a dependent
YANBU - An 18 yr old uni student is an adult in their own right.

The system might have been around for years but these parents have never been aware.

I have no idea how any parent with a child cannot have been triggered - all it takes is once - by very regular stories in the news, friends/relatives chatting, or even just common sense to think - I wonder how uni is funded nowadays? I better look that up.

If they stuck their heads in the sand, never considered or thought about it, never did a quick google to check over 18 years of parenting then their children will suffer the consequences. It is not the governments responsibility to fix it for those that have the means.

That’s very empathetic of you. consign these poor kids to the viscious circle.

they didn’t think I wonder how Uni is funded these days because 18-20 years ago Uni wasn’t for the likes of them.

This!

And it particularly impacts working class families where nobody has gone to university before. Who has all this spare money to put aside for university when raising a family? Astonished people cannot get their heads around the fact that many families simply don't have the spare cash. It's not the child's fault yet they are penalised.

The system just increases the divide between the WC and wealthy in our society. It is a travesty.

Either fund a proper loan system that covers at least the halls of residence costs or ditch the whole loans system and fund at least the vital courses properly - it is bonkers for example that nurses have to self fund their degrees (or actually need a university degree at all but that's another stupid decision!)

And yes it is bonkers that parents have to contribute because their child is dependent yet universities/departments/staff cannot talk to parents because their child is an adult!

I knew there were loans and they had to pay them back. I didn’t know the loans were not enough.

I could tell some heart rending real life stories of young people from difficult family circumstances where on paper the household income is above the level stipulated for full loan but for various reasons the family can’t or won’t contribute.

i may or may not judge these people for their choices but I sure as hell don’t want to penalise their child.

@NotTerfNorCis I don't agree with most parents will be supporting their kids at uni. Support or help out with a food shop? I think many people can't afford to manage themselves and especially if you had other DC living at home too.

I'm betting all those agreeing with this can quite comfortably afford to pay for their kids to go to Uni.
Many of us can't. Though the Gment will say we can.

It is an absolute disgrace. They are adults, making adult choices and. no parental income should not be taken into account. Including for the very obvious reasons that many kids will have parents who simply won't pay up, leaving the wannabe student in a terrible position.

This is a policy thought up by affluent people, who can well afford it, and who can't imagine, or don't care, that. not everyone has loving or supportive parents who are willing to make this sacrifice.

They are adults and should be treated as such.

They definitely aren't enough. The loan my DD will be getting this year is just about equal to the cost of her rent in halls. Virtually nothing left over to feed herself, meet friends or buy books so she is reliant on what we can give her each month plus a small grant/bursary that her uni might see fit to provide. Decisions on that will not be made until the start of term in October.

She does have a job and is on the books of a certain well known coffee shop, but she cannot work during term time according to rules at her uni. So she is reliant on any shifts they can give her during holidays.

It makes things very difficult.

I know @Topseyt123 i was answering the poster who suggested I had my head in the sand for not being all over the uni funding situation.🙄
We have one DD who graduated last year. Very expensive uni and catered halls then high rents for shit hole houses. Landlords coining £2500 pm for 12 months for a shitty terrace furnished from the charity shop. Many of her friends had either no loans or used it for spends as parents paid for halls . Another world!

@43ontherocksporfavor I agree and wouldn't say you had your head in the sand. I'd call it reality for most people.

When I left home for home for uni at 18, I had to get myself a part time job to fend for myself. So I agree. My parents set me up with a few bits, bedding, kitchen stuff but as soon as I had left I had to budget my student loan. No different to leaving home for a job and a flat at 18.
I believe I had the minimum loan amount too.

That suggests that you think it is OK for children who are still at school when they are starting to set these things up to make decisions about taking out loans. Those decisions and the ensuing debt will follow them around for the rest of their working lives

They are already doing so by agreeing to a student loan

The majority of barely 17 year olds still in sixth form or sixth form college would still not have much concept of the full future implications of that. They just don't have the experience there and their education has been fully funded until now if in the state system

Again, if they go to uni then they are already signing up to years of debt.

Surely steering children into a situation of big debt at that age isn't OK?

Of course it is, but as i stated, i know well off families who have let their kids accrue the student loans when they could afford to pay for all of it. Our DS hopefully won't be one of those kids.

Suspect some of them see a risk it will be written off. Meaning early repayment by parents is wasted.

I will support mine until they can support themselves,all part of being a parent
In Scotland so no tuition fees,we pay rent and living expenses so no loans

How does Scotland manage to do that @Motheranddaughter? and to be fair it’s easy to say you’ll support them when you’re not having to fund it.

I find their rent and expenses
£1100 a month

Do they not get offered loans for rent?

Loans in England cover the tuition fees separately and are not means tested so no parent is having to stump up for that.
Scottish students would leave uni with less debt, but the maintenance loan still expects parents to be funding their children. Day to day it won't be less as it's the same principle as the England (and Wales and NI?) system.

@tiggergoesbounce So you see a system that virtually signs children up to get into debt virtually before they have even left school as OK then? Because that's what going to uni means?

Righto! Good for you.

Going to uni should not mean that and I don't think it is an OK system because as I have already said, those young people still in most cases do not have the life experience to fully grasp the long term implications.

Yes, the debt will be written off eventually but it will still be a millstone round their necks for decades. My DD1 is paying a significant portion of her gross salary towards her loan and it seems to be barely scratching the surface of the capital.

The tuition fees in England are around £9k a year and are not means tested on parental income. SFE pays them directly to the university concerned, but holds the debt against the student. It is a separate loan, though a loan nonetheless.

£28k less debt!

The example on MSE is scary... It's ludicrous that you could put a £10k inheritance towards the debt and it makes so little impact that you still will pay the same amount over the 30 years before the debt is written off. You just lose the £10k. Better to spend it on something else.

When mine were at uni 10 years ago another child at university was taken into account. I can't remember how much difference it made.

@Drdoomish yes isn't it? He has always said it's best to use any money as a house deposit than pay your fees upfront/pay off the loan.

My two eldest went through on the £3k/year fees and with all the interest added they reduce the balance by about £100 a year!

I have told my two youngest once you borrow something you might as well borrow the most you can and just view it as a graduate tax because (currently - unless they move the goalposts yet again) what you pay each month depends on what you earn not what you owe. They may well never pay it all back.

We really have stuffed our young generations and their aspirations - all these smug politicians making them pay for what they got for free. So hypocritical.

I used to work for a multi millionaire. His kids all took the tuition fee loan and the minimum maintenance loan. I worked with another man who was in a very well paid job, whose daughter had to sign an agreement with him that she'd pay back what he was giving her at uni as soon as she could afford it.

They don't get well off by giving money away. I was giving my kids more than either of them and I'm not well off and was working part time as I was my husbands carer.