In love with friend’s DH

[kerrypacker]

Not really an AIBU (as I am BU, obviously - but not intentionally so!) Just wondering whether anyone else has experienced this, and if so how on earth did you handle it?! Good friend (from uni, now live in different cities but see each other every so often) has gradually got more serious with their now recently-married DH, which means I have over time got to know friend’s DH (FDH) better. To my horror as I get to know him better I’ve started to feel like this is someone I could really deeply fall for - everything I’ve ever looked for. Not something I would ever act on, and friend and FDH are very happy so it would make no difference if I did.

I’m trying to keep this brief, but it’s horribly upsetting. It’s not a situation I’ve looked for at all, and I’m not someone who typically falls for or goes after people in relationships. I’m also not talking about shallow feelings - they are powerful and I’m really struggling to get over this man.

There isn’t any solution really, but if anyone has experienced the same, that would (weirdly) be some comfort… not that I would wish this on anybody.

I have name changed for this just to say OP i hear you. I'm in a similar position where i have been completely blindsided by my intense and all-consuming feelings for a colleague. Its a nightmare. However, I have zero intention of revealing any feelings towards him. We are both married and in senior positions. I could lose my job and it would undermine my professional integrity, never mind blowing my family apart. I have to repeat this to myself daily as the rampant feelings still dominate. I have also mentally prepared myself for how i should react if he was ever to make a move - you should do same and be prepared to turn your friends DH down were that scenario ever to arise. My own marriage is in trouble (has been for longer than I've known colleague), but i'm very conscious of not revealing this or using it as a excuse to act on my feelings. Im patiently waiting for this to pass, noting his flaws and balancing out any fantasies i drift off into with imagining the utterly awful fallout scenarios that would evolve were i to do anything about the feelings. I cant stop coming to work but I am capable of managing my own feelings and exercising restraint. Its very fucking hard and emotionally draining but i know its better then the alternative of falling into the game of flirting and exploring his feelings. Even writing this down is mortifying me.

My advice is to throw yourself into hobbies, other friends, dating, family and avoid this couple as much as you can. Be strict with yourself about balancing out fantasy with reality. And remind yourself, there is someone out there for whom you will be Number 1. Never settle for being anything else.

You aren't in love.

It's a crush.

You can't love someone you hardly know (except as the H of another woman), you don't have time with him alone to get to know him, and all you have done is build a fantasy in your head.

If you can't deal with it, you will have to see your friend by herself.

I wouldn’t wish limerence on my worst enemy. For 3 years I was a zombie, after just knowing a man for 6 months.

Every day was a misery, I cried for hours every day and my friends would say I was never present even when I was physically with them.

I went to see a counsellor which helped. She told me I had acted with a lot of dignity.

It wasn’t a crush, I’ve had crushes, they are much more harmless.

Now I can look back with the benefit of hindsight and realise it wasn’t love.

I do wish we could give 'limerence' a miss and just use plain old fashioned 'crush' as they are effectively the same thing.

Crushes come from having the hots for someone who is usually unattainable.
Pop stars, when we're teenagers, maybe teachers, bosses, sports idols, etc.

The feelings aren't based on reality of that object of our desire. We don't see their bad moods, their nose-picking, their farting, their untidiness and the crap that comes with living with someone.

@kerrypacker He's not available.

Say that to yourself 20 times a day.
Fill your life with other things and every time he comes into your head, do something to distract yourself.

@nochangeever It was a crush. There are degrees of 'crush' and yours was becoming an obsession but it was still a crush/fantasy/holding out for someone unavailable.

Please don’t tell me about my own feelings.

Why are you so dismissive?

All I can say was that my feelings were beyond a crush and not remotely similar to fancying a pop star! I knew the object of my limerance very well and spent time with them, so it wasn't based on some unknowing fantasy at all. Nevertheless, it's not ok to make others feel uncomfortable by your feelings and I knew this person didn't want a relationship, so it was up to me to finish this silliness in my own head. Which I've done. I still see the person, but it doesn't have a hold over me like when I was immersed in them as the 'solution' to my life. I feel a lot better for letting the light in and seeing it for what it was.

This is icky, I cannot imagine feeling romantic feelings towards the partner, let alone HUSBAND of a friend - it would be like fancying a sibling. Do you spend time with them together, watching them be affectionate with each other, and still entertain these thoughts?

If you do, how much of a ‘friend’ is this woman to you really? You aren’t much of a friend to her to entertain these thoughts, that’s for sure. So it shouldn’t be that difficult to go non contact with her. This is real people’s lives, not a romantic novel.

I used to work with someone who was married and I had a mega crush on him, but never told him. I tried to avoid him at work, but when he was unavoidable I’d just think, ‘wow. You’re so clever, funny, charismatic and the way you speak about your wife is so heart-warming. You do everything for her. She’s so lucky to have you.’

I left for another job and started to get over this crush, but months later, he messaged me on fb (never did this before so I think he must have known I had a thing for him). He said his wife has left him for another man (which she did). We saw each other, then dated and now married with kids. You might say at this point, I got what I wanted and this post is encouraging the OP to give into her feelings? Nope!!!

What I didn’t know, was about all the debt he had, the CCJ which meant we couldn’t even rent a house together at first. I didn’t know how lazy he was around the house, how he always has to be right and doesn’t see anyone else’s viewpoint, about his lack of sex drive, lack of ambition, how miserable he is, how he never wants to go out of the house even for dinner or to the pub, never wants to go on holiday so none of us have been abroad, the fact he lies a lot and that he’s drained me of all my money so we are all just existing rather than living.

So, what I’m saying is, he might not be as great as you think he is. You only know the version of himself he wants to show you, you don’t know who he really is. You’ve got a crush on the idea of him…. Go NC and leave well alone. I wish I did.

I really feel for you, I can totally understand and imagine this situation. The people I’ve been in love with has felt the same and the fact that they weren’t married and I was able to go on and have relationships doesn’t mean that it was real love and what you are feeling is not. I don’t know why people are insisting on minimising your feelings.

Anyway, I suspect the best thing to do is avoid him as much as possible. Totally if you can. Time will sort it out.

Namechanged. Couldn't read and run. I haven't read all the responses here but the majority I had seem pretty unsympathetic to the OP. Just to say, I went through something similar and it was pretty horrific. Limerence is nothing like a crush or just fancying someone one shouldn't...it's more about brain chemistry and levels of dopamine and serotonin and the impact this can have on our moods and behaviour. There's a highly qualified psychologist who has explored this after experiencing limerence in his own life - he's got a whole website on it called 'livingwithlimerence' which you may find helpful, OP.

Some of us are more vulnerable to it, and it's often tied in with childhood trauma and less than ideal attachment styles. For me, an attraction developed between myself and a male friend. He is married, as am I - and we are friends with each others' spouses in a group of four. He made it clear on a couple of occasions that he found me attractive - this wasn't really appropriate tbh, but probably seemed like harmless flirtation to him. On the back of this, my feelings spun massively out of control. I thought about him constantly. I would feel high when I saw him and like I was on a comedown afterwards - I can only liken it what it feels like taking recreational drugs (which I dabbled with back in the day😏) - interesting as drugs also mess up levels of the same chemicals in one's brain.

Thank god neither my DH nor my female friend ever suspected anything, and thank god we didn't spiral into a full blown affair. My advice would be to limit contact as far as possible and just try to keep yourself occupied with the other positive things in your life. Also, trying to understand WHY you are feeling like this is key. For me, I had to unpick some pretty complex and upsetting personal background to truly understand why I had a tendency to become obsessed with this one particular person.

It will pass, eventually, painful as it is. Good luck, OP.

And for those that are saying limerence is exactly the same as a crush - trust me, it's not. I've experienced both and they are very different beasts.

Well no, it's a concept that has its roots in the 1970s. Do you think it kicked around for 30 years just waiting for mumsnetters to run with it? And part of the definition of limerence is that it's one-sided. There are differences between limerence and love, which are explained here https://www.attachmentproject.com/love/limerence/

Like a pp mentioned above, he’s probably one of those men that loads of women fancy. I’m sure they’re not all at home acting like dying swans!

Perhaps he’s kind, respectful, fun to be around, charismatic, he makes you feel valued and shows an interest in you.

So what if you fancy him? It’s normal to feel a connection with other men. No need to feel “horrified” in yourself.

Acknowledge it and know nothing will come of it. If you don’t enjoy the escapism fantasising about him brings you then stop fantasising.

What’s painful about this really? Why are you so upset about it? No need to give it so much headspace. You can control your own thoughts.
It’s entirely possible to acknowledge how you feel and move on.

If you’re stalking him online and poring over your friend’s photos etc just STOP.

If you feel consumed and obsessed by your thoughts and this is intruding massively on your state of mind/ well being then there’s no shame in seeking therapy.

Exactly what I was about to say @jeaux90. Time for some creative visualisation @kerrypacker! At the moment you are consumed by your idea of him, not him in the round. I think you should pick five possible realities and think about him in those situations every time he comes to mind:
picking his nose
walking into a room and farting loudly
taking a dump
clipping his toe nails at breakfast time
having halitosis
leaving skid marks for others to deal with

^thats just a few off the top of my head.

I’m only half joking about this. You need to deface the perfect snapshot you have of him and keep doing it every time you think of him and see him. Change your thoughts to change your feelings.

I genuinely don't understand the anti-limerence comments on here. It's weird that people are saying it's not a thing when you and various other pp have experienced it and it's a known mental health issue!

I guess it's the same kind of people who think ADHD is just attention-seeking or something? I don't know. I just know it's weird to dismiss people's mental health issues.

OP, I highly recommend you post on the relationships board where people in general tend to be a lot more savvy, knowledgeable, and experienced in all kinds of issues like this.

The problem with the concept of limerence is that it is helpful to two groups of people:
1 Women whose partners have had affairs. They don't want to confront the messy truth that feelings in an affair can be quite complex and involve more than just sexual attraction, so label every thing else 'limerence'.

2 People who have experienced attractions they have found difficult for whatever reason (and I don't deny how difficult they may have found them) who find the concept of limerence helpful as it helps them to separate it from more healthy attractions and relationships, and to designate certain feelings as a 'mental health issue'. I don't begrudge those people using limerence to better understand themselves fwiw.

To the people on here comparing denying the existence of limerence to denying ADHD, that is ridiculous.

ADHD is a condition of neurodiversity which could potentially have many biological or environmental mechanisms underpinning it. These are currently the focus of much, very real, scientific research.

Limerence is a concept used in attachment theory, which is a concept that helps psychotherapists and their clients to unpick unhealthy relationships in an effort to identify ways of improving them. What people are calling limerence may well be maladaptive, but I don't think many psychologists or psychiatrists worth their salt consider limerence to be a 'mental health issue'.

How on earth are you in love with him?

You fancy him, or you have a crush. You cannot be in love with someone you haven’t ever been on a date with! Are you ever even alone with him? You are not romantically involved with this man. Put space and distance between yourself and your friend. When these feelings pass- and they will- you can rekindle your friendship. In the meantime focus on your own romantic happiness, get dating and find someone you truly can fall in love with.

I’ve only read the first page but agree with those saying that a cohort of Mumsnetters appear to be invested in dismissing any feelings which are not for a single available man.

It is possible to fall in love with someone you are not in a relationship with. It is possible to fall in love with someone who is not available. It is possible to fall in love with someone else’s partner you are in a relationship with.

I feel for you OP and I believe you. Painful as it is, just never seeing him again is the only option. And you’ll need to decide if you can keep being friends with your friend, being as she will talk about him.

this happens OP, but it will fade if you don't fan it.

So when you start thinking about him, stop yourself. Do something else, let it go etc. There are many ways to alter the mind and we aren't a slave to our thoughts - take a google and find something that works for you.

If you are around him, focus on your friend and be detatched from him. It is possible to do this without being rude or obvious.

If your mind goes to him, imagine him doing gross things like picking his toes or nose, or something you personally find really gross - seek the ick. it will come.

As a society we all got caught up for a while that feelings are eveything, but actually feelings are fleeting and you aren't your feelings. Feelings are fickle and feeling change. We should all avoid being ruled by our feelings.

If you actively do this you will find these feelings soon pass, and you will soon be back to normal.

As for why this happens, from my own experience most men (most people even) are at best very average and boring to me, many outright gross, ignorant, sexist, unappealling and I'd much prefer not to be around them. So when I do meet a clever, lovely, attractive man who makes me laugh and gives me attention, who I can spend time with and enjoy their comapny, if they are also physically attractive, well it can be all to easy to get swept up in that - because it is really nice, and it reminds me that I am a hetrosexual woman no matter how unappealling the vast majority of men are to me.

Of course you know that your friend got lucky in love and has made a great match, and this man is 100% not available to you. And lets face it, if he was wanting to betray your good friend and run away with you into an affair or whatever then he would swiftly become very unattractive as you would realise he isn't the man you thought him to be.

The problem I have with 'limerence' is that it is something invented by some psychotherapists/ psychologists to hang certain emotions onto and give it a name.

There are numerous theories about psychology whether that's Freud, Jung, etc etc and differences of opinions within the profession.

If it makes people feel 'better' to give a fancy name to their emotions and behaviour, fair enough. But before limerence was common parlance, (and I'd never heard of it till I saw it on MN) most people would refer to 'unrequited love' (with love being a synonym for 'crush') and if it was powerful enough to become an obsession, it would still be a crush but one that was very powerful.

I think it's very dubious whether strong crushes have anything to do with attachment disorders or childhood trauma and, knowing a bit about psychology, there is no science behind any of these labels.

@User1789 I don't see limerance as a 'mental health issue' myself, nor do I think I had a MH problem. It's just a helpful term to denote a slightly obsessive kind of unrequited love that happens a lot and is more than just having a small crush on someone fanciable. To the person saying it's like fancying a sibling- um, no, not at all. It is not unusual to meet a nice kind captivating man who belongs to someone else and think 'what if'? The trick is to see that it's just that, a trick of the brain, and not treat it as something real that has to be listened to seriously.

As for love needing to be reciprocated to be 'love', I would say no. Plenty of women on here in this section claim to be in love with some fantasy version of their husbands or what they were like 30 years ago, the reality is that they are not in love at all with their current manifestation. Being in love with an ideal as well as the real is part of what sustains a long-term marriage. It just has to be directed towards appropriate people, and away from inappropriate ones.

I don't see that you can continue your friendship, OP. How would it work in reality? At the moment, everything she says and does is going to make you think of parallels with her husband; how it would be if it were you instead of her, how you would feel in x, y, z, scenario with him as your husband.

He's taking all your bandwidth, that's the problem. Your feelings for him are currently very strong. The only way to get rid of them is deprive them of oxygen and that can't happen whilst you see you friend because she is a conduit for him and thoughts of him.

Do you have any other friends that you could spend more time with? Something time consuming that you could find to do?

You could really use this as an opportunity to re-set and that may be a very positive thing indeed, you could end up with more options than you currently have and that is always useful to have in your back-pocket.

Regardless, you'll have to take this secret to the grave; don't utter a word to anybody in real life because I promise you, it would not be a secret for long. As it is, the more time you spend with your friend, the greater the likelihood of discovery, however unwitting - and if that happens, your friendship is done. For good.,

Take the bull by the horns and get yourself out of the situation and into another one - involved and time-consuming, job hunting, even getting a temporary transfer - all of this could be great for you!

It is possible to fall in love with someone you’re not in a relationship with

I completely disagree.

Op might be in love with the idea of him, you can’t love a man and describe them as “everything I’ve ever wanted or needed” when you don’t know them, when you’ve spent no time alone with them and you meet up infrequently.

Thats infatuation/ fantasy.

If a woman spoke like this about an available man she hardly knew and had never dated (he’s everything for me, he’s all I’ve wanted, I’m in love) then most men would run for the hills, with good reason.

It’s intense and deluded- idolising a person in a very unhealthy way.

Op needs to understand this isn’t love (imo)

@Highdaysandholidays1 I think that if you are having to argue that actually many people aren't really in love with their spouses in order to justify the concept of limerence being real, then you are setting the bar so high for 'real love' that the concept has actually become meaningless.

I also don't understand why pro-limerence folk don't understand why going around suggesting that the love people say they feel for other people isn't real, is going to get people's backs up.

It is minimising and dismissive, and takes place in a society in which women are told what they feel is wrong all the time. For many the concept of limerence is just an extension of women being told their feelings aren't 'real'.

And the fact that it is so frequently reserved for women who are in a situation that threatens a heteromonogamous primary couple says an awful lot about the motivation for doing do.