To think DS 20 should get his old room back?

[altawalt]

My DS is 20 with mental health issues and is on the autistic spectrum. I've been with DP since he was 4.

At the end of last year he was going to move in with his girlfriend and they found a flat but unfortunately they didn't end up moving in. DS moved in with her and her family instead. He got a full time job (was previously working part time) and things were great. His gf’s mum messaged me back in may and told me he wasn't going to work and was very quiet. We met up and he told me he was struggling. He went to the GP and was put on antidepressants and he's seemed fine since.

He came home and wouldn't say why but then admitted he and his gf had an argument and he decided to come here to give them both some space. This isn't what his girlfriend is saying, she told her mum that they had an argument because she thought he was cheating and he shoved her. DS is denying this, I don't know who to believe but DP believes his girlfriend which had led to them arguing over it and has threatened to shove DS if he does it again, which I think he was wrong to say.

DS and his girlfriend have made up but have agreed for him to stay here for now. DS isn't the easiest to live with he is very messy, he plays his music loud and he struggles with sleeping so doesn't sleep until the early hours and he makes a lot of noise downstairs and makes food etc etc. DP knows this as he was like this previously but now he makes a comment about it everytime DS does it. He says he's old enough to now know better and he's been spoilt by me as I've always allowed it.
Whilst DS was gone he agreed that SS could have his room and since DS has been home he's slept on the sofa but has said he wants his room back. Which DP doesn't think he should be allowed.

An I unreasonable in thinking that DS should get his old room back and DP is being unreasonable?

Both ss and son are older now so they can learn to share with each other

The same way as your dd and ss had to

And nowhere in the OPs post has she said that her son has the developmental capacity of a child.

Again, what do you think autism is? I keep asking posters this and no one is answering. Perhaps you do find it insulting that developmental delays are compared to being ‘child like’, but ultimately ASD means delays in one or many areas of typical human development. A delay means a typical child will mature and develop these expected skills. So it may (and I don’t always.disagree) seem crass to compare these delays to being child like, but it doesn’t mean they are not comparable. Some autistic people will be child like or simply immature (in the medical sense) forever, will not learn to mask into a neurotypical life.

At the moment the op’s son is presenting as an adult who is immature beyond typical expectations even for a 20 year old. It is not just the fact he’s 20, any future plans need to be made with the fact he’s autistic in mind. He’s already evidently suffered burnout attempting a relationship and full time work. He has moved home and his behaviour continues to be immature. The question is, is he actually capable of an adult lifestyle based on this information? Because it does read like his immaturity may be connected to his autism and therefore needs full consideration in these circumstances.

So I don’t agree with you. I think you’re being very dismissive and don’t actually want to accept what delays with autism actually means.

Tricky one. Your son is only 20 and it's hard to afford to move out regardless of the other issues. Yet your daughter is of an age where she needs her own room. I'd be approaching Shelter to see if your son would be able to get any support and housing due to autism making things harder to manage. Your step son is also at an age where he needs his own space for studying.

I'd be trying to help him find new accommodation. Do you have space for something like a caravan that might help relieve pressure on sleeping space in the shorter term?

@SkinnyMalinkyLankyLegs

How much his autism comes into this, no one can tell based off the limited information we have.

The OP’s son has developed mental health problems a short time period after trying to live independently and switching from part time to full time work. He is medicated and has not been able to return to work at all. He has returned home, requesting his old room back (needing the “sameness” of his old room and routines back). Furthermore he is listening to loud music to soothe, has sleep disturbances and difficulties with executive function evident by an inability to organise himself and keep things tidy.

And you don’t think this is evidence of his autism being a problem?!?!!

…This was a statement made based off the fact that she knows he has autism.

No!! This was a statement based off of compiling and integrating the information above from OP’s posts. All of the above typically happens with autism especially in the teens and early twenties because there are deficits in capacity. For goodness sake the whole diagnosis is based on deficits.

The man does not sound developmentally mature enough to respond as a NT young adult would.

I don’t think your SS should have to give up his room now. If it was a few weeks that he had it, fair enough, but it’s been almost a year from what you’ve said. If one of the rooms is large enough to properly divide - ie a partition not just a divider - do that. If not, can you make an area of the lounge into a bedroom for your DS?

I’m with your DP on this

The room is stepson's now. Swap the sofa for a sofa bed.

@SensationalSusie I'm not going to sit here arguing with you all evening, I've better things to be getting on with.

Simple fact is, you made a very disabalist comment which is extremely offensive and quite probably upsetting to many people with autism and/or their loved ones. Imagine being a parent who has a child with autism or is awaiting assessment and all the things that come along with that ie worrying for their future, and hearing that there are people out there with views such as your own, asserting that because someone has autism, they have the mental capacity of a child. When this was pointed out to you, instead of doing the decent thing and acknowledging that you were wrong to have made such a sweeping generalisation, you simply doubled down. Disgraceful.

Enjoy your evening.

Team DP here. The room is SS now.

What’s the longterm plan for his care OP? He can’t live with you forever, and you don’t think he’d cope well in a flatshare.

No, you are being extremely unfair to your SS. I agree with your DP. The room should not have stayed empty, it's your SS's now.

I'm assuming there is rather sad reason your SS moved in with you full-time at the age of 12. He's also gone through a lot. He is entitled to his room.

You won't do your son a favour (my ds has sn's too) by simply giving him everything he wants. Unfortunately the world doesn't work like that, and he needs to understand responsibility and compromise.

OP you still haven't clarified where DSS will be sleeping if DS gets the room back? Do you mean they will share or DSS will share with DD or DSS should be on the sofa??
I sense from what you've written so far that your DS very much is favoured and you don't really care about DSS

You move out you lose your room.

Very unfair on SS to lost his room now.

DS moved out!

I cannot believe some of the comments on this thread. I knew we had a long way to go with autism but I don't know how some of you face yourself in the mirror.

Spiteful, nasty and prejudiced. I am really shocked at the cruelty.

Some of need to sort yourselves out.

The only long term solutions are for all of you to move into a bigger property or for DS to move out. Your DD and SS cannot share at their ages.

Do you own or rent? Do you both work? Is DS's birth father in the picture and able/willing to help? Is there any potential to increase earnings? What is the likelihood DS will get another job & contribute?

If the family moving is absolutely no go due to finances, then look into self contained studios for DS. If he is diagnosed ASD, is there PIP or additional government funding? He would be entitled to some form of housing benefit/UC. You need to be thinking long term and having his room back is out of the question imo.

Imagine being a parent who has a child with autism or is awaiting assessment and all the things that come along with that ie worrying for their future, and hearing that there are people out there with views such as your own, asserting that because someone has autism, they have the mental capacity of a child.

I have two children with an autism diagnosis. One has global developmental delay - the reality is that he is still cognitively (and this is from official assessments) around 24 months old. The reality is he will very likely always be ‘child like’ due to the level of his delays and zero capacity to mask his autism. This is not in any way insulting to recognise. It not only means I can plan his needs now and in the future more effectively, it also
means I can recognise these delays and what they actually mean in my other son. Social, emotional, cognitive, communication delays, they are all part of autism. Just because an autistic person isn’t ‘child like’ in presentation these delays exist and it’s offensive to try and deny them. It’s offensive to children like my own who will never be anything but ‘child/teen like’ for their entire lives.

I think the absolute given her is that DSS and DD need their rooms separate to one another - they are the children of the family and far too old to share with one another. It would be really inappropriate.

Potentially you could put back the room divider for DSS and DS but it would be a bit unfair on DSS and sounds like you don’t think it would work.

Can you as a family do without a living room? That could be made into another room, either for you and your DH or for DS?

I do think living with a gf/ bf when they are so young is a bad idea though.

Do you own the property?

If so, could you build a log cabin/summer house type thing in the garden for him to move into? Make sure it's well insulated!

He should absolutely NOT get his old room back.

The other option is giving him your bedroom and you take the lounge. Is there a dining room or garage or study that can be converted?

So SS started living with you full time when he was 12 and your DS was 16 (why was that?) and invaded his private space causing arguments and distress to your DS. Your DP manipulated your vulnerable disabled DS to leave him home permanently and move in with his girlfriend’s family who had no responsibility to him at all so the problem (DS) was pushed onto them. Now DS is back with mental health issues and it’s clear your DP does not want him back in the house which should be his safe space surrounded by loving family. The poor lad, I feel terrible for him.

I assume your DP was aware you had a DS with ASD when you got with him (or was he diagnosed late?), and you were both aware there would be a big possibility that your DS would not have the capability to be fully independent at the same age as other young people without ASD?

DS probably would be better off in some form supported living actually rather than with a stepdad who doesn’t want him there and a stepbrother who deliberately winds him up exacerbating his MH issues but this will still take some time.

Does he get PIP? Does he have a disability social worker? If not he’d have to have a social care assessment for supported living first I believe, which could take many months so won’t solve the immediate issue.

Can SS temporarily move back in with his mum if she’s around? Benefit would also be that his studying is not disrupted by DS living back home?

SS keeps his room.
DS (as someone who is up and down and doesn't sleep well) stays downstairs where he can watch TV, potter about and not disturb everyone else sleeping.
I would look into what services are available for an autistic adult with regards to housing/supported living. My DS is autistic and can attend college until he is 25 -would this be something that your DS would be interested in? Might give him something new to focus on. It would be worth finding out.

You share with DD; your DP shares with DSS; your DS gets a room.

In the longer term you need a bigger house or your DS needs to live independently.

It would be very unfair to make your SS move out. Would make him feel totally second place in the family.

Why are you blaming the step-son? It's his father's house to. He has a right to be there and no, nowhere did OP say he was 'deliberately winding' anybody up.
If you MUST blame somebody blame the OP's daughter who was last to arrive on the scene and without whom this problem wouldn't exist.
And who is responsible for creating her.. both OP and her DP... so you can stop blaming just the DP it's not like he made the OP give birth against her will.
SS was already alive, so was OP's DS, you can't just blame the former.

This, absolutely.

@SkinnyMalinkyLankyLegs

………

I really do not want to fight with you either.

Again, my assertion about the capacity of OP’s son was based on the exemplars she gave coupled with his medical history. And I think it is accurate that his capacity is more akin to a 16-18yo child than a 20yo adult.

I am very sorry if anything I said was upsetting to you.

But I really do think you need to read the DSM-5 diagnostic criteria that will be used to assess your child. Your child will be diagnosed as autistic if there are marked deficits in their capability by contrast to what you would expect of a NT child the same age.

https://www.autismspeaks.org/autism-diagnosis-criteria-dsm-5#:~:text=Great%20distress%2Fdifficulty%20changing%20focus%20or%20action.&text=Marked%20deficits%20in%20verbal%20and,to%20social%20overtures%20from%20others.

I really don’t know what to say to you. A lot of people with (what was formally known as) low functioning autism DO have the developmental capacity of a child perhaps for their whole lives and high functioning can still expect to see delays in their development to some extent in that you really could not expect most autistic 20yos to be on a par with most NT 20yos.

That is the nature of the disability and to state otherwise is to perpetuate falsehoods about autism.