To think it's perfectly fine to also blame the OW

[Kingofx]

I see so many infidelity posts on here with replies saying "don't blame the OW, blame your spouse"

I agree, the spouse is the one who broke their contract and their choices are to blame, but if the OW knew the man was married and persued the situation - even going as far as to battle for someone else's spouse- then I think they are a shit person.

I've been a member of an infidelity support group and while full of stories of weal, deceitful, pathetic excuses for husbands - the stories are also full of quite cruel OW.

People with no empathy, who will often harass the wife, refuse to accept NC and generally act with malice.

I can't picture taking someone else's wallet much less their husband. I think the OW is an adult in these situations and completely deserves contempt.

AIBU to think we give the OW too easy a ride?

Both are to blame if the OW knows he was married. What I don’t understand is how stupid it is of the OW to have a relationship with a cheater, where’s the trust.

Six of one and half dozen of the other as far as I’m concerned. No affair happens without two willing partners.

Totally agree with OP if the OW knows they are married. I know of somebody who took her (older, wealthier) bloke away from a much older woman who had 4 kids, one whom was critically ill at the time, so fully knowing what the wife was going through while pursuing the affair. I thought that made her pretty snake like and selfish. But I also know of people who genuinely believed the unfaithful husband’s lies about having an open marriage, living in separate parts of the house and amicably separated etc… I guess unless you know the entire situation it’s hard to judge and I try to not get involved with other people’s relationships…

I think it helps to realise there is no sisterhood. I have watched people's behaviours over many many years and seen that when younger, a lot of people have overlapping or simultaneous relationships or snog some person on a night out. I mean a lot. It was often a secret and often they told only one or two others unless their partner found out. As we all aged, most of us can't be arsed with this type of behaviour (I never did it, I have no interest in men who are with other women, and I never stay in a relationship I don't like so no need to overlap). But, there's not some magic sisterhood to save you, some girl code. Lots of women and men will put their own needs, desires, self-esteem whatever first.

I have had lots of opportunities to have affairs (conferences for starters) and so has my husband. He just told me if some woman was starting to get overfriendly or finding convenient times to go out just the two of them to some event, and would back out of the situation, as did I. Happened when he was a stay-at-home dad as well. Not often, just occasionally, people over-step the mark and those not wanting an affair step back as they step forward.

Drink also allows people to do stupid things.

I just don't think you can depend on some sisterhood to save you. Assume people are self-motivated because they are.

Both are to blame. Him more so for saying yes in the first place. No one forces you to do anything. Her too partly for helping enable it.

Exactly.

People who knowingly engage in deliberately hurting another person, whether they know that person directly or not, all share the blame for what happens to the victim.

1000%

I hate my ex for what he did to me, but I will always have love for him because he's my son's dad

I hate the OW for playing her part in the affair BUT i appreciate that she cares for my son and have no problem with that.

They're both serial cheats and I will be here waiting for the next episode 😂

I agree with this statement entirely. It definitely depends on the circumstances.

To always blame OW takes away from the fact that the man had his head turned by someone else and that he also participated and could have said "no". Also, men can be really deceptive when they want to.

I notice OW who post on here often say "I love him", "he's my soul mate" and other such drivel. They're not living with the day to day reality of that person so it's definitely not love. I think the psychology of why it happens is more complicated than we give it credit for. During my break-up with my ex-husband I was so vulnerable and it was the only time in my life where I made that mistake of getting involved with a married man - although we never had sex it was a full on EA. It was like he could tell what I needed to hear and repeated it until I believed the bullshit. It was only when his wife found out that his hold on me was broken and I realised what he was - a sex pest. I believe he took advantage of my vulnerability and knew exactly what he was doing. I'm not a believer in soul mates and that sort of bullshit but during this time, I know I would have said this about a man I hardly knew.

I'm sure some women are manipulative too but out of my friends I don't know any that would have an affair. I think sometimes you have to look deeper at the why, without being judgemental.

@Kingofx
I don't think that an OW or OM can take that which is firmly rooted. All too often, I think that it is easier to say that they should not have been willing to try rather than to say that the marriage was just not working to the satisfaction of both parties ( and both parties do have the right to expect some level of satisfaction within the marriage)

I think that decent and responsible people leave the marriage before becoming involved with someone else.However, I doubt that the spouse or partner feels better whatever the reason.

I think that honest and insightful people realize that a marriage ends because of the actions and omissions of both parties. I have never heard of a perfectly happy partner or spouse ending a marriage or relationship.

It is sad that in so many endings that the default response is blame . I think that people who go directly to blame necessarily transmit a message of" your mom or dad left us rather than your mom or dad left me. " That message colours the future relationships between the ex's and the children's relationship with both parents, and they all lose on some level.

Cheating spouse is obviously an utter arse, however to me any woman who knowingly gets involved with a married man has either no moral compass or standards. Hand on heart I value myself far too much to be someone’s dirty secret.

Absolutely the one doing the cheating is to blame.
BUT, there are women who actively seek out married men. When I was a mere teen of 18 I had a couple of friends who used to enthusiastically go on about their ambition to have an affair with 'a much older, married man'. One even said it was top of her bucket list. My parents had recently gone through a messy divorce due to an affair, so I was feeling pretty sensitive about the subject, but when I tried to reason with them, citing the hurt they'd be helping to cause, they laughed and told me I was 'boring'.

People who knowingly engage in deliberately hurting another person, whether they know that person directly or not, all share the blame for what happens to the victim

I remember after being divorced I started dating someone on Tinder. As was "customary" in modern dating we were not yet exclusive.

We had very hot, very compatible sex a few times and really enjoyed each others company. He was incredibly kind and flattering to me and gave me a lot of emotional support.

I was a bit older than him at 35, had DC already. He was 32 and wanted kids etc so I remember agreeing very easily that it was best he persued commitment with the other girl he'd been seeing and we thus stopped seeing each other.

He married the girl a few years later, and seemingly was happy, but a little while later contacted me when drunk to tell me he'd never stopped thinking about me.

Of course, he was being a complete bastard, but said these things in a way that would make anyone feel special. How hot I was. How the sex never left his mind. How incredible I am.

I was very lonely at the time, a bit battered from the affair still and felt pretty low. So guess what I did?

I told him he was married and not to speak to me again in future. I did this because any kicks I might get out of it were definitely not worth ruining someone's life.

I pictured the wife finding his phone and seeing thise messages and felt dreadful for her. I never met her, but I owed her respect and empathy.

Sure, her hubby might well go on to cheat. But I wasn't going to be the cause of that pain for another human being - even if it made me feel nice at a time I felt completely lost.

I once got into something with a married man, who was very ambiguous about his personal life - we were both working away from home on a project and all his anecdotes were that of a single man. Luckily, a mutual friend noticed and warned me that he was married with children and had form for this- I felt an utter fool and slammed the brakes on very quickly. He made all kinds of excuses, saying he was going to tell me, he married too young, his marriage was only held together by the kids, we had a real connection, we could still see each other when we got back to London ……..Nope, never : what an insult to me to suggest I would go along with this.

Later in life, I got invited to a newish book group. After the book discussions ended and the wine flowed, 4 of the group discovered they were all second wives ( older wealthy husbands) Nothing wrong with that, obviously, but then it transpired that they had all knowingly been the OW and started telling ever more outrageous funny stories about sneaking around, daytime hotel assignations, secret phone calls, going on work trips with them, ‘accidental ‘ pregnancies to force the issue, anonymous messages to the wife to do the same.

All very happy with their current situation and oblivious to the expressions on the faces of everyone else in the group who had found the stories seedy, not glamorous adventures.

I actually refute the claims that ow are blamed concerning affairs.

Appart from the actual deception of two people against one, when the affair is discovered there comes the next layer of betrayal.

Many times others are enlisted to back up the bullying of the wife, be it in- laws, friends of the betrayer, colleauges and even health profesionals, all to agree the wife deserved it. The bullying of the innocent never ends, even on here the ow in force stating they were not in any way involved in bullying, forget the word affair, it is a sustained attack on an innocentt party.

My advice for anyone who is being betrayed is to get away as far as possible from the unsafe envioroment in which you no doubt are in, you cannot win, two aggainst one and then it goes on to be 10,20 or even more berating you for having done nothing.

Nasty people will do nasty things, maybe in years to come some of the standers by who did nothing to protect you or support you may understand if they themselves too are put in that possition but on the whole no, keep away from people with no intergrity or morals.

It's a lesson a lot of us learn, that people will follow the bullies in many areas of life, not much changes from the school yard.

So it is my opinion that ow are not judged after an affair, they are not carted off to councelling or pychiatrists, or judged by family, children, the courts, child services or society. It really is an ongoing thing that never ends.

They get off lightly.

When a man loves his partner it’s easy for him to say no and walk away.

Totally agree op. If OW or OM knew the other person was married, it’s a shitty thing to do and a big old red flag to being a shitty person. There are a few things about it I just don’t understand.
Firstly, when people pipe up and say, just blame the married person, the ow/om made no vows. This has never happened to me (as far as I know) but I do know I have more than enough emotional intelligence to be angry with more than one person at once. Don’t we all? And if my DH did this I would be beyond raging with him, but I have enough emotional capacity to also be mightily pissed off with the woman who did it with him, if she knew about me.
Secondly…..the ow/om made no promises to anyone. Whilst that is, I’m the strictest sense, true, I have posted before that I never promised not to shit on your lounge carpet, but if I did, you would quite rightly be pissed off. People who defend ow/om never seem to have a response to this?
And thirdly….why would you WANT a person who you know for a fact is disloyal, deceitful and a liar? For me, that is about as attractive as venereal disease and I just don’t get it….

I agree the OW needs to take quite a lot of the blame. If they know a man is married they have no business getting involved with him. Same goes for a man getting involved with a married woman. Total lack of moral standards.

This happened to me. It was a short relationship, just 6 weeks. He had two children too. He wanted to carry on, but weirdly enough, I did not want to.

@Dwappy no, she is not to blame in that scenario. How could she be, she didn’t know! She’s another victim of a lying tosspot…..

@Viviennemary what is quite a lot of the blame? Its no wonder these men go whipping their D**k out if you as the wife want to put the majority of the blame on the OW. Your DH is the one to pick up the pieces, he is the one with the kids OW isn't in your household when your breaking down in front of your kids. I don't get that logic one bit. OW will walk away and you could never even of met her

It's easier to shift and deflect the blame to OW isn't I suppose.

Yes. When a man marries his mistress he creates a vacancy.

This

I totally agree that the male partner who cheats is doing so of his own volition and knows full well what he is doing as a sentient adult. What I really struggle with is the OW (and there was one like this who my husband left me for) is then an utter bitch to ex-wife and a cruel spiteful creature to the child of the relationship that was ended so that she and the ex partner could be together. She's got what she wanted, she should be happy so why revel in causing trouble, hurling verbal abuse and in my case (it was a long time ago) sending a letter full of insults and abuse. I did not want him back, what I wanted was some child support but this threw her into a fury as did my ex spending time with our child. She put a stop to him having our child to stay and only "allowed" him to see the child for 2 hours every other weekend once she and he had had their own family. The thing that got me through was the fact that she did me a favour taking that weak willed pathetic man off my hands and also everyone who had dealing with her all found her very disagreeable. My ex brother in law said this to me when his brother left me for the OW " I am not given to bad mouthing people and I will say this only once , she is an utter bitch and my brother is an idiot" . I also knew someone who lived on the same street as her and they told me they hated her so much they used to go out at night and put slugs on OW's window boxes!

I think it depends on the type of relationship. Plenty of women don't really want an actual relationship with the married man. They're happy just having a bit of fun with them. I know people who have had "relationships" with married men. And at least 2 of them ran a mile as soon as the man suggested he leaves his wife.

im sorry but its equal between them get rid of him and her and let them ruin each others life and cheat if u keep taking these men back ur just as bad as she hasnt forced him to cheat he made the choice and because your naive and gullable you side with him..im not being hateful im just putting my opinion acrosss