Really stressed on holiday

[holidays23]

Hi everyone

Don't know how to navigate this so appreciate any advice.

We are away with 3 couples, we've been friends for over 12 years. We've all got our children with us and we are staying in a villa.

One of them, my DH is super close to, think plays sport together, we're regularly at each others houses, they work together sometimes etc.

Friend has a bit of a control issue/jealous/doesn't trust anyone. We will call him Adam and his wife Jane.

I was by the pool with our baby, other friends and their kids and my Husband was upstairs using the toilet and Jane went inside. Adam immediately came out from the kitchen asking where my Husband and his wife were, I turned to say my Husband was in the toilet. He kept saying "where are they?" I said I don't know where Jane is but DH is using the toilet. He rushed indoors and came back outside with Jane.

I said to Jane when we were together in the kitchen "Adam had a bit of a panic about you and DH being in the villa together without anyone else?" and Jane said "He doesn't trust anyone, he's an idiot" and shrugged it off. She also said that he commented to her that I was "allowed" to walk around the villa in a bikini (only when popping in to grab one of the kids bits or drinks etc) and unless she is laid down on the sun bed or in the pool, she has to wear her cover up because he gets jealous.

Today, we went out and the kids ran through some sprinklers, Jane did too whilst laughing and Adam made a comment about he hopes her white T-shirt dries soon as it was now see through and inappropriate (she had a bikini top on under a T-shirt).

It's making me really anxious and unhappy to be around, he's also constantly on at their kids, smothering them in suncream every 5 minutes (literally), shouting at them to stop going underwater in case they get water in their lungs? Shouting because their 12 year old walked ahead of us today and got on an escalator without an adult.

He also keeps making comments about me not watching our baby in the sun and fussing that she's hot (she was laying on the sunbed next to me asleep with a hat on, a UV protection full swim suit including legs and arms plus factor 50 suncream and the big umbrella up, completely in the shade). I regularly go and sit indoors with her in the air con or my DH does but she's not showing any signs of being hot. She's drinking her usual amount of milk plus cool boiled water (about 3oz throughout the day) and it's making me paranoid.

I've always known that he has anxiety and can be jealous but I didn't realise it was to this extent.

He also makes multiple "jokey" comments about the women in our friendship group like joking that our baby is really his and not DH's, if one of us bends over he'll make a sexual "joke", that kind of thing but because he's the "big joker" of the group, nobody bats an eyelid where as it makes me uncomfortable.

I told DH when we were in bed about him asking where him and Jane were and DH laughed and said "of course he did, this is Adam remember" and shrugged it off. I'd be devastated if one of my best friends questioned why I was indoors with her Husband but DH is so used to him being like this, it doesn't phase him.

Any ideas on how to navigate this for the next week because it's really getting on my nerves.

Adam sounds abusive towards Jane - he’s controlling and jealous plus he makes disgusting comments to you all. I would ask your husband why he finds this behaviour acceptable enough to stay friends with Adam

“… because he's the "big joker" of the group, nobody bats an eyelid where as it makes me uncomfortable”.

”Big joker” in this context means “arsehole”.

I agree with telling DH to have a word or you'll blow up. Adam sounds awful.

Adam is the missing stair of the group - you all know it’s there so you hop over it

https://captainawkward.com/2012/08/07/322-323-my-friend-group-has-a-case-of-the-creepy-dude-how-do-we-clear-that-up/

All these people saying call him out/say something, would you REALLY wreck the atomsphere for the whole group and make everything awkward for the rest of the holiday? Because I know damn fine that OP would be the villain in this scenario. Everyone is thinking it, but 'she' would be the one making things awkward.

There's a time and a place for this stuff, and trapped in a villa abroad is not it.

The only way it would work would be for the OP and her family to book an early flight home, and tell everyone exactly why, with a huge list of examples, and saying how uncomfortable HE made you, that you couldn't stay a minute longer but why should you?

You could probably make some digs like, 'fgs Adam, chill, you know you're supposed to be on holiday? Unclench a little.' But he'll probably get pissy and give you the silent treatment for the rest of the holiday.

If it was just your family and Adam's, I'd say go for it with both barrels. Show him up for the insecure little prick he is. But there's two other couples, and it's not fair on them. You risk fracturing your whole friendship group just on principle.

How much longer to do you have to endure?

Jane has to fight her own battles but you can say something when it’s directed at you.

I think I would be tempted to go with "I'm sorry, I don't understand?" or "That was a strange thing to say, I'm not clear what you meant?" every time he makes some sort of derogatory comment. And then really push my 'not understanding' and make him actually spell it out and not just be able to rely on innuendo to be 'funny'. It would be awkward as hell, but the awkwardness would be all his and he fully deserves it. And I've not actually outright called him an arsehole in that scenario, I've just let him really feel how much he's being one, in front of a number of other people, while I assume an expression of interested puzzlement and keep pushing. He'd learn pretty fast, if he's capable of learning.

But then, I am at best chaotic neutral...

I think you should challenge it but saying "Adam that's abusive" is hardly condusive for a nice atmosphere.

Personally I would struggle to
a. Take it seriously
B. Not mercilessly piss take his idiocy

He sounds like a dolt... I'd have so much fun with it.

Adam: " your DD will die in the sun"
" thanks for your unsolicited opinion Adam. I've filed it in the bins with the others.(big smile) If you are going inside can you grab me a coke please?"

If he jokes about your child's paternity say "ahhh see it's funny because I always thought your son looked just like your brother..." when he makes a face say "see...? It's offensive when people question your child's paternity isn't it?! Don't do it again. God Adam is so rude hahaha. Anyone want a drink? I'm just popping inside...."

When you /someone else.bends over make an OTT lude Bernard manning type comment comment followed by a ba-dum-chah! and say "there you go Adam... I've saved you a jobband made an obligatory pervyvy comment so you don't have to!!
I'd also start doing it to the men in the group (builder cat calling type stuff) and declare myself the house mysogynist for the day.

loudly accuse him of being "chief of the Saudi Modesty Police" when he makes comments on wets tshrits and laugh. Then keep calling him chief all day and ask him annoying questions throughout the day like "how many lashes for reading a book Adam?" If he gets annoyed say yes it is annoying isn't it. You find his running commentary on womens attire annoying too... shall we both just drop it and have a nice time.

or just a simple "hey Adam that's not okay. George do you think that's okay?"
"Adam you are overreacting. Calm down.

Separately I'd try and get some space maybe a day out.

I'd also arrange a ladies lunch in town and leave the guys with the kids but I like winding people like this up 😁😁😁

Pull him up on it, every time. He keeps doing it because everyone allows him to.
Tell him to fuck off, or words to that effect, every single time.

The reason the "Adams" of the group continue this behaviour is exactly because everyone says "oh that's just Adam" rather than tell them it's inappropriate.

You do t need to go all gung ho and say something. I've found not responding or walking away is just as effective. So if your outside with the baby and he starts saying something pick up your book and start reading.

When asked where DH and his dw are just shrug and say "inside".

If he makes a crude comment about babies being his or you bending over ask the group a question to open up another conversation - even if it's just about dinner plans.

If he gets no airtime then he'll just start to look like the twat he is and hopefully it will stop being worth it for him.

Then never go away with him again after you've survived this week!

Absolutely this. There's no way I'd tolerate it.

Next time it's aimed at you, tell him you don't appreciate the comments so he can knock it the fuck off.

To be honest I wouldn't say anything unless it was directed to me because I wouldn't want to ruin other peoples holiday.
All the other behaviour I'd probably just complain to my DH about and not holiday with them again.
He sounds like a right dickhead.

Start with your Dh I know you’ve had one conversation but have another saying yes we’ll that may just be Adam but it’s makes you uncomfortable and he needs to let Adam know or stick up for you or you will stick up for yourself
the next he says something look at your Dh and if he doesn’t say anything then you do doesn’t have to be offensive you can be jokey but say something
it is not right
oh and talk to the others too
good luck

You can’t really do anything about his overall behaviour but the next time he says something about the baby I think you are well within your rights to make it really clear that you do not want any feedback about your baby care. It’s absolutely not his place. Shut him down on that because it’s totally uncalled for.

He’s so all over the place I think you need to prioritise. Everyone has different boundaries - mad comments about parenting I would let slide - but like fuck is anyone making sexual comments about me or any of the people around me without comeback.

You don’t have to go in guns blazing and create a bad atmosphere you simply bat every comment back as “unacceptable”, “inappropriate”, “don’t ever talk to or about me in those terms Adam and we’ll get on ok”. If he doesn’t take the hint that’s when you take him on one side and explain.

Next time he says something directly to you, I would take a deep breath, and look him straight in the eye and say in a very calm and even tone,

“Thanks for your concern but I don’t need advice on how to parent my baby thanks and while you are at it, maybe tone down the offensive jokes and quit trying to control everyone and everything as it’s making this holiday hard work”

… then hold his gaze and stay silent and don’t fill the silence with any words and see what happens. He will either shut up or explode.

I wouldn’t be pussy footing around him though. This is your holiday too op and it’s not good that all of you are normalising his behaviour by not confronting it directly.

I would hate this too @holidays23

I don't really know what to advise apart from do your best to just get through the week without a big argument. And never ever go on holiday with this arsehole ever again.

He sounds awful. I would be struggling with this too - sounds very stressful! Can you not go out for the day with your dh and baby today?
I would definitely not be looking to go away with them again.
Oh and it sounds like your baby is being looked after fine - plenty of shade and breaks from the heat which you are already doing is fine.

Don’t be so tedious FFS. Report the post if you think it’s fake.

Please don’t take your children anywhere hot unless you’ve realised that you can still burn in the shade and should still be covered up and using sun cream 😬

I think that's a good suggestion by @LouLou198

Tell your husband you need a break from the villa. Plan a day trip by yourselves and go out for the day.

Surely Adam is also getting on other people's nerves? The others will probably totally understand why you want some time with just your family.

Sorry, but I think your DH needs to speak up. If they’re “super close” he‘s likely to have more impact than if anyone one else said anything. He can do it by picking up individual comments or by taking him aside and having a gentle conversation about Adam’s anxiety and how it’s affecting his behaviour. What he’s doing at the moment is normalising Adam’s behaviour by ignoring it.

I wouldn’t employ any of the smart Alec comments suggested here, they won’t work if he’s acting the way he is out of anxiety or depression.

Interesting that people are saying keep quiet because calling him out on his behaviour (and his presumed tantrum/sulk in response) would ruin everyone's holiday. Adam is already ruining it for everyone himself, so why wouldn't you say something? Who cares if Adam thinks you're the arsehole?

I would probably have lost my shit with him early on but it wouldn't be the OP causing the atmosphere for reacting to him, it's his fault for being a prize twat.

I would also be supporting Jane to find a way of leaving him, and I certainly wouldn't go on holiday with them again.

I totally agree that his behaviour is appalling, and Jane needs to make major decisions about him & their relationship when they get home. But unless you want to ruin everyone else’s holiday too, I’d leave any full-on comebacks for afterwards, if you possibly can. Instead, just ignore as much as possible or, if not, as a previous PP said, try a few “sorry, what do you mean?” or “what is it you’re worrying about happening?”or even “are you saying that you think they’re having an affair?” Asking people to repeat a ridiculous/ insulting question and getting them to explain and justify it, by feigning not understanding is often the best way of showing them that how out of order they are being.

We had a ‘friend’ like this and he was never pulled up for his behaviour … lots of group bbqs and holidays over the years, all with our children who were similar ages.

When a couple of the girls in the group reached their mid teens we discovered he had been texting them very inappropriate messages.

We look back and wonder why we didn’t call him out on his disgusting comments at the time. I’d be very careful of this man OP.