After school won’t let my teenage daughter pick up my son in an emergency

[Fuknstuck]

I’m sick, running a fever, I’m dizzy and fluid is streaming out both ends. I am also disabled so this has a knock on effect on my mobility. It just came on 2 hours ago, there’s no way I can leave the toilet let alone drive one street safely.

I called after school care to request my 14 almost 15 year old daughter to pick up my 6 year old son and bring him home, one street away and they’re refusing because she’s a minor. I explained there is nobody able to help me - neighbours all at work, only one who isn’t is 93 and dying of cancer, my parents live 300 miles away and my partner is working in intensive care and can’t just up and leave. I dont have friends who use the after care.

They are refusing to allow my daughter to pick him up. They know her, they know she’s mature and responsible but won’t let her bring him the one street from school to our home. I’ve asked what I’m supposed to do. It’s the first time I’ve ever asked them to do this and they know it’s an emergency and they’re refusing. I’ve asked how we resolve this as they can’t keep him overnight and I literally cannot get to the school.

AIBU to expect in an emergency situation where the parent trusts the teenage child and accepts all liability, that they should allow her to pick him up?

Yes they can. The school cannot keep the child, they can only refer to SS. And if they decide it’s fine (which they would) then the school have to abide by it.

and it’s likely to be a school or after care policy rather than a LA one.

In 20+ years working in school settings I’ve seen parents challenge rules like this numerous times and only once has the school actually been backed by SS (and that was one thing in a long running list of concerns).

@caban yet another poster who doesn’t understand that Policy is another word for Guidance and is not legally binding at all.

Guidance is usually a best practice scenario, but should always be considered on a case by case basis. A blanket application of a policy can lead to inappropriate and occasionally the wrong decision being made, as is clearly the case here.

If you actually kept hold of a child against its parents wishes, you would be risking committing an actual criminal offence as you have no legal authority in that situation.

No, a policy isn't guidance - it's an expression of how I run my setting. It's isn't best case scenario, it's what I follow every day.

Only releasing a child to their parent or another authorised adult isn't a criminal offence.

Schools only do this until parents challenge them. How a child gets to and from school is a parental choice. Schools can get involved if they think there is a safeguarding issue, but they mostly rely on parents not challenging their guidance.

Childcare settings have more leeway as they are private businesses so they can simply say “follow this or remove your child”.

They should have a policy to deal with the situation where a child is not collected.

BTW - I don't know if it will help you - but because I got my (second) DS registered as a Young Carer, he was allowed to take my oldest DS off his (DC1's) transport bus from his (DS1's) special needs school, even though DS2 was under 16, and even though Borough Transport initially refused.

I had to send them evidence of DS2's registration, and it went all the way up to someone who had discretion, but then they allowed it.

If you have a disability, could you get your DD registered as a Young Carer - and have that to waive at various people? If she does help with your care, it might be nice for her too. My younger DC didn't do much with them, but they had some lovely activities, and it meant your DD might link up with other DC who have parents with disabilities.

My DC had other support groups (there are all sorts of support groups for siblings of DC with life limiting conditions), and they felt more appropriate for my DC than the Young Carer's ones. But I did need the Young Carer official stamp for precisely this sort of circumstance, when I simply couldn't do it, and I was asking them to trust a 14 (or younger I think) year old to take a highly, highly disabled 16 year old.

@caban

So you would be happy to release a child to an adult who was a stranger if the parent authorised it, or to a parent who was 15, but wouldn't release a child to a sibling who was 15, even if the parent authorised it?

But they’re not refusing to release him though.
They’ve said they’ll release him when someone over 16 comes to collect him, which would have been stated in the contract that OP agreed to.

A court would not accept that they were in the wrong when the child has 2 parents who could go and get him.

I think the club are being very unfair but they are literally just following the rules that OP agreed to, so I don’t think going down the law route is the best solution.

It does seem crazy but I am always struck how many people have absolutely no safety net in these situations. I think you need to try and get some sort of contingency in place eg another parent. I know it’s hard I remember my 2 being in primary only too well but people are generally OK with helping in an emergency. Hope he gets home Ok and you are better soon

Yes. I would release a child to any adult the parents decide is suitable to authorise.

We had this situation once, I was trying to get there but due to a fatal road accident, I was stuck on a bit of road that wasn't going anywhere at all.
Teenage DS1 was at home 5mins walk from school but they asked him if he was 18 and he said he wasn't so wouldn't let him pick him up.
DH was actually operating on someone so no go there.
I ended up calling, messaging everyone I know and managed to ask a huge favour and get another parent to go in to get home for me (WhatsApp group)
If it happened again I've said to DS1 just to say he's 18 - tbf he's huge now so looks like he is.

And if nobody aged 16 or older comes then what can they do?

They will have to call police/social services who will tell them very sternly that they should have handed over to the sibling.

If you take this to its logical conclusion then if a parent cannot send an adult and only sends a teenage sibling they can insist all they like but when it really comes down to it they have no power whatsoever to enforce their policy.

As a private provision they could say the child can’t come back if the parent has breached their policy but they can’t keep the child.

I think a lot of posters on this thread would still expect your DH to leave work regardless!

He’s home.

My partner got him and went back to work. My son is really upset because he saw his sister come and then wasn’t allowed to go with her.

l’m trying to find alternative childcare because this is ridiculous. Policies need to be flexible enough for emergencies. Sure as hell if they had no staff to care for the kids due to emergency they’d be flexible enough to shut down during the staff shortage and parents would have to suck it up.

‘Sounds as though you have Covid’
Impressive diagnostic skills 😂

OP how incredibly stressful for you. I guess you now have the chance to set up a plan for if there is a next time. Other parents can be a godsend. good luck and get well soon.

But the OP has a safety net.

There is no reason at all to refuse to release a 6 YO to a sensible teenage sibling for a short walk home from school when their DM is too ill to leave the house and their DF is tied up at work.

The world has gone mad. When I was a teenager and a club level swimmer and lifeguard I was not allowed to take my 6 YO DB swimming but our DM, who can't even swim could.

Insanity.

I see what you are saying but from their point of view you they have legal obligations they can’t make exceptions for, it’s ridiculous, however why don’t you call a taxi if this happens again

There is no legal restriction on releasing a child to a teenage sibling.

Because many taxi drivers (not to mention the OP and her DC) may not be happy to do this.

@Fuknstuck Was it school after school care or a private provider?

Bloody hell! I’m legally qualified and you’re talking complete nonsense because you clearly have zero understanding about your rights and responsibilities within the law.

You cannot simply make up your own rules in these situations.

You have no legal authority to refuse to hand over that child to someone that the parent has deemed competent and has given their permission.

Echoing PPs who have said that school cannot do this - I was under the impression they cannot detain children. A school I previously worked at wanted to put a rule in place saying no walking home alone until Year 6 but were ultimately told they could not detain a child and stop them walking home unless they believed them to be genuinely at risk (eg if a Year 1 was trying to walk home alone you could keep them and ring SS but if a competent Year 5 wanted to leave you couldn’t do anything)

I wouldn’t make any hasty decisions about a childminder if your son is happy at this club, OP. I think it would be better to focus on getting backups in place in case you need them in an emergency before your daughter turns 16 a year or so from now.

I hope you feel a little better tomorrow. You must be washed out.

Oh the poor thing.

So their "safeguarding" failed to protect the child. Or should I say utter idiocy. They seriously need to review their policy don't they. Sounds like they won't. I mean seriously what was the plan if no adult had been able to collect? Leave him locked in overnight or leave him on the step?

Hope you feel better soon and no one else gets your bug.

Also, get well soon OP