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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Climate change and not having kids

169 replies

Appleofmyeye2023 · 21/08/2023 10:34

Not really AIBU, more chat and getting insight

DS up visiting this weekend. Aged 29 , living with partner in London and can’t afford to buy yet. So, really not ready to think about marriage or babies etc

but, we got chatting and it came up that his partner was opposed to having kids , and he was a bit, because it would be cruel and horrendous for them, that by the time those kids got to their 50s and 60s the world would be so effected by climate change that it would be at war for precious resources, thousands of people dying, and mass migration to find a way to survive .

im of the view, that yep, while things will get a lot tougher, humans have a capacity to make changes and adapt - technology will develop to meet those challenges, but all the time there isn’t a literal burning platform in developed countries, there won’t be the pressure and will politically to throw resources to really solve the issue- we’re playing around with the low hanging fruit currently, but things have to get a lot worse before there is a collective and money to really tackle climate change. So, I’m a bit more optimistic on this one. It seems so sad for that generation to be so “we’re doomed” to stop having children?

I am wondering, how common is this amongst the late 20s and early 30s generation? Or is this a bit extreme?

Should say they are both pretty intelligent and DS’s partner works in field of sustainability in developing countries, has lived all over the world, she’s not British by birth, and is not a conspiracy theorist !

OP posts:
KimberleyClark · 21/08/2023 10:37

Is it just climate change for your DS’s partner, or does she not want kids full stop?

ohfook · 21/08/2023 10:37

It's a personal choice and everyone should do what they think is right.

I do personally think though people that desperately want kids but don't because of climate change/overpopulation/nuclear threat etc are making a mistake because who knows what will happen in the future. I'd hate to get to 80 and realise that it would've been fine!

People who aren't that bothered either way though, fair enough.

Lastqueenofscotland2 · 21/08/2023 10:38

I’m early 30s, don’t have children and don’t want them, most of my friends are the same, however not being able to afford them is a far more common reason in my peer group (nearly all of whom are university educated with good/decently paying jobs) than climate change

TyrannosaurusSex · 21/08/2023 10:40

Different for me because I wasn't that bothered about having kids at all but I am often grateful for that because I'd fear their future lives would be so hard, with climate and with the impact I suspect that will have in society.

Original poster
Appleofmyeye2023 · 21/08/2023 10:43

KimberleyClark · 21/08/2023 10:37

Is it just climate change for your DS’s partner, or does she not want kids full stop?

Ds said it was down to just climate change

OP posts:
TheaBrandt · 21/08/2023 10:45

And yet there are threads on here with women merrily planning to ttc their third
or even fourth child. Deluded

Helpfulperson123 · 21/08/2023 10:46

Not having kids. Climate Change is one factor, for sure. But not the only one.

Original poster
Appleofmyeye2023 · 21/08/2023 10:50

Lastqueenofscotland2 · 21/08/2023 10:38

I’m early 30s, don’t have children and don’t want them, most of my friends are the same, however not being able to afford them is a far more common reason in my peer group (nearly all of whom are university educated with good/decently paying jobs) than climate change

Yep, and I’d sort of understand this a bit more tbh.

Both of them have very well paid jobs, partner moved onto a 6 figure salary recently, ds in high 5 figures, so they’re not short of money - just they want to live very centrally in London where 1 bed flats are £750k or more, and they’re still saving for deposit needed and right now they’re not bothered about tying that amount up in property and are happy with renting and lifestyle it gives them. Apart from that buying house situation they have a lot of money to be able to afford children, so I really don’t think it’s that.

OP posts:
40andlovelife · 21/08/2023 10:53

I find this really sad. That people would give up having even just 1 child for this. Either this or the girl is just being silly and righteous

cruffinsmuffin · 21/08/2023 10:57

40andlovelife · 21/08/2023 10:53

I find this really sad. That people would give up having even just 1 child for this. Either this or the girl is just being silly and righteous

🙄 silly and righteous? What a lovely attack on someone, realistically any reason for not having DC is valid, just because you can't fathom people giving up "even 1 child" doesn't mean other people feel the same.

His partner works in a role where she's probably exposed to an awful lot of things that show the impact of a harsher world for children, I can definitely imagine that having a huge impact on her reasoning.

I'm 30, no DC yet (not by choice!) but neither of my siblings want children for similar reasons to your sons partner, several of my friends don't either for that reason or financial reasons.

Utahthecat · 21/08/2023 11:02

My kids are teens and I am not counting on any grandchildren I am already v concerned about whether they will have much quality of life due to climate change. My husband was totally anti more than two for environmental reasons.

I do think things are going to get a lot worse more quickly than we thought. The fact she works in sustainability is very telling - all the indicators are flashing red right now and every thing is tipping a lot more quickly than even climate scientists thought. She is being very logical - of course having kids is also emotional so people will continue to have kids no matter how horrible the environment is

40andlovelife · 21/08/2023 11:05

'Attack' is a rather hyperbolic choice of words, calm down . I just mean that if someone is willing to give up children not because it's what they genuinely do not want but because of a reason that is actually contested and pretty unpredictable, then yes this is a really sad state of affairs. Some people are righteous on this issue, believing that they will be seen as virtuous and good for making the decision. Hopefully it's not righteousness and if it isn't then this is a genuinely really sad reason this couple . I mean this genuinely,

ComtesseDeSpair · 21/08/2023 11:14

I’m childfree, principally because I don’t like children at all, but always find it curious that people don’t seem to think climate change is a “good enough” reason to remain so. Sure, maybe excellent technology will come about the planet will get sorted out and it’ll all be hunky dory. Or, maybe it won’t and your children will end up literally fighting for water to drink and food to eat. And, if disabled and not able to fight for themselves, on the scrap heap. It sounds like a big chance to take, to put children you supposedly love at risk of potentially having to live like that. Doesn’t sound that loving. If your DS and his wife have a perfectly fulfilling life otherwise, why would they add the worry and hassle?

SunsetsAndSandwiches · 21/08/2023 11:14

As others have said, the decision to have children should be based on your personal desire to do so. I would hate to see anyone feeling like they shouldn't because of environmental reasons, if they desperately wanted a family. Equally, I sometimes think people have kids because they feel they should/society and family expectations etc, and I do think the world would be a better place if only those who truly wanted children (and all the work that comes with raising them) did so.

Either way, I think its probably best to leave DS and his partner to make the decision themselves. I can understand your concerns, but I think you risk imposing your view and making them feel they have to explain themselves to you when really it is a decision for them and them only.

Sparklesocks · 21/08/2023 11:19

It’s their choice. I always think you shouldn’t have DC lightly anyway so whatever reason might be a ‘no go’ for you is valid in the big scheme of things. Childfree people lead just as happy and fulfilling lives as parents do.

onlylovecanhurtlikethis · 21/08/2023 11:21

I think spouting the whole climate change issue is just an excuse TBH because she doesn't want to say she doesn't want them for no other reason than she doesn't actually want them

fitzwilliamdarcy · 21/08/2023 11:25

I’m childfree (and infertile, anyway) for other reasons, but climate change is one of the reasons I’m glad I don’t have kids. I’d be bloody terrified of what their life (and their kids’ lives) would be like.

I don’t know how widespread this view is and it may be that she’s trying to present things this way as she suspects that any other reason put forward would be interrogated (as generally is the case, in my experience). But I don’t think she’s wrong to feel as she does - far from it.

Nw22 · 21/08/2023 11:27

I am early 30s. Most of my friends don’t w at them due to climate change or cost. The ones that do will just have one due to cost.

Parky04 · 21/08/2023 11:28

My two DC are pretty adamant that they will not be having children. There are lots of valid reasons, and I totally agree with them.

RudsyFarmer · 21/08/2023 11:32

I think the internet has certainly exacerbated these feelings of Armageddon. Intensified by the pandemic. I honestly do t blame them and would support them to be honest.

Helpfulperson123 · 21/08/2023 11:35

Bottom line is: it’s their choice.

I don’t go around berating people for having children, and if anyone berates me for not having children…well it hasn’t happened yet, but when it does I’ll tell them where to go.

WhateverMate · 21/08/2023 11:35

I've never truly believed anyone 100% who's said they don't want kids due to climate change, or wars or anything like that.

I mean I get it may be a small part of it, but if one has a burning desire to have children, they'll normally find a way to make peace with whatever's going on in the world.

taxguru · 21/08/2023 11:36

@Appleofmyeye2023

I am wondering, how common is this amongst the late 20s and early 30s generation? Or is this a bit extreme?

It's extreme. Most people are delaying having children (or deciding not to) solely because of financial reasons as they simply can't afford them.

I think people generally are becoming more aware of climate change, but not to the extent of catastrophising about "how bad" it will be for the next generation, because, in reality, most things will be pretty similar for most people. Nothing extreme is going to happen in such a short period of time, whatever the doom-mongers may claim!

My son is home for the Summer after graduating, and we've had a few conversations about this and other topical matters, and he's very clear that it's a minority on the internet/social media with extreme views about climate change, transgenders, politics, and other "topical" matters which seem hot at the moment. He says in real life, people he knows to talk to in person at Uni, are mostly pretty ambivalent about it all - his "tribe" tried to avoid the extremists, the rallies, the more extreme clubs & society events, etc. He said they were mostly obsessed with football matches, formula 1, partying/clubbing etc, and other than being "careful" with recycling etc., they weren't really particularly bothered about climate change and didn't think it would really impact upon them, except for higher costs, higher taxes, etc.

Fizzology · 21/08/2023 11:37

It's sad that they need to think this way, but it's entirely sensible to avoid having children for this reason. I think YABU to suggest this isn't a good enough reason.

We know that at the moment the climate is becoming more difficult to live with. Harsher, more unpredictable. So their pessimistic view makes as much sense as your more optimistic take on things.

I don't think most of us have our heads around the scale of change. It's very hard to know what will happen, and this often causes people to avoid taking risks - like having children.

Utereusbegone · 21/08/2023 11:38

40andlovelife · 21/08/2023 10:53

I find this really sad. That people would give up having even just 1 child for this. Either this or the girl is just being silly and righteous

Or just doesn't think that having kids is something they want to do. Maybe she doesn't like children, maybe she has never wanted one, maybe the idea of growing a baby inside her grosses her out. Maybe she says it's to do with climate change because of narrow minded judgy people like you?