The relentlessness of children

[aaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh]

They're constantly in my face. Wanting to climb on me and sit on me. Patting me/ pulling on my clothes/ hair. Jumping on the sofa, climbing on tables.

They constant crying and constant tantrums when they can't have their way.

I just can't ! Taking them out is a nightmare, so is staying in. It's just a nightmare. Everything is difficult. I hate every day.

I'm not even a stay at home parent. I work and they go to nursery. But they're still breaking me at night / in the morning and in the evenings/ weekends.

Nappy changes are a nightmare. My 1 year old acts like he's being murdered. Constant tantrums. Taking my 3 year old to any activity / soft play often results in arguments as she just doesn't get sharing ( I know that's normal but it's still difficult ). When I discipline her she just gets worse and starts throwing stuff at me. Nothing gets through at all, ever.

But most of all, the constant demands are killing me. Not even a cup of coffee in peace without one of them trying to grab it or cry about something it demand something. I just can't. I don't even have night time to myself as one or the other is crying or wanting something from me.

I do have a partner but he's just never here because he's always working. So it's my problem. Just needed to rant. I sometimes just don't know how I can get through this.

Tired mother of a 3 and 1 year old.

I second this.
He has checked out

Mine are older 7 and 9 and while there are less tantrums and screaming the relentlessness is still there. They are CONSTANTLY mithering about something. I can’t sit and focus on anything when they are around. The fight all the time too and bicker and argue which drives me up the wall.
I work which is a break and they are in school but even just evenings and weekends are exhausting. I hear you

I think when your 3 year old is upset and screaming you are maybe doing too much explaining/talking through. A quick no that's not how we behave here and then leave without any back and forth, if you do this blah blah, we're going to leave if you blah blah. It's a really difficult age though so I do sympathise.

My children are 11 and 9 and I can't tell you how wonderful it is to go upstairs and sit on the loo without someone yelling through the baby gate at the bottom of the stairs.

Honestly I'm all ears. I don't think I'm getting through to her. I ask parents / look at how they do it and listen to advice / read books on it all the time and I'm still no closed to getting through.

For a while we had a bit of peace where I stopped directly challenging her on what she was doing wrong, so taking a much softer approach. For example in the soft play scenario where she was snatching the toy, I may have just gone over and spoken to her and not made any threats of leaving. I may have done something to distract her if she continued, rather than face her head on. When I face her head on, by saying ' no, this is not what we do ' or ' don't snatch, it's unkind ', I guarantee that it makes her repeat the behaviour. If I ignore her/ distract her, then the behaviour doesn't continue. But that's not a solution because you can't ignore it and you just can't always distract her either.

Then I've tried being more confrontational of her behaviour and doing more ' telling off ' and consequences and it just makes her behaviour worse.

OP I feel you. Been in charge of DCs aged 2 and 5 for 5 days while DH was away. It's been brutal, I am so tired. I take my hat off to people doing this alone day in day out, you guys are incredible.

It does get easier, I get glimpses now of an easier time, but it is mentally exhausting. You have my solitude, but no answers!

Small children are like dogs and even now at the age of 11, my daughter is like this when she needs some good old fresh air and exercise. As soon as she starts annoying me, l try and get her out of the house to burn off some energy.
Sometimes you just want to sit in a dark silent room!

Hey OP. I’ve got a 22 month age gap, currently aged 1 and 3 and I know this visceral hell.

I’m only commenting because I’ve not seen it suggested yet, but pls ignore if it’s not helpful. I know you’ve said you’ve read all the books (and I believe you - 2/3 year olds will drive you to try anything) but I wondered if you’d come across Hunt Gather Parent or any other work covering Arctic Circle/Latin American Indigenous parenting strategies? The first principle which could help you is one of ‘family collaboration’, so everything is a job that we are doing together. Cut way back on praise, so that it becomes meaningful when you use it. If you must praise, use ‘you helped me’ or ‘that was so helpful, thank you’. Even if they are crap at doing it, let them try. So cleaning the kitchen - the 3yo gets a brush, the 1yo gets a sponge and they do the floor while you actually clean up. Make it clear that they are helping to do a big job for our family.
The second principle which could be useful is Calm. Extremely hard to re-condition yourself but you’ve seen how the conventional ‘I told you not to do that/we don’t do that’ spiel isn’t working for your child. As soon as I act like that, showing anger/any dysregulation, I know I’ve lost my 3yo and his behaviour dramatically escalates. What’s working for me is total 100% calm. I use fewer words. So if he’s doing something dangerous like climbing on the table I would say ‘if you climb on the table you could fall and hurt yourself’ then give him a chance to make a good choice. If he doesn’t, I would say ‘you will hurt yourself, come down to the floor’. If he still doesn’t, I would use Physicality (another Inuit principle) and pick him up and fly him around the room or some physical movement which somehow distances him from his ‘misbehaving self’ and regulates him. Tickling can also work. Ultimately he knows he doesn’t go on the table. He doesn’t need a lecture. He needs help to make a good choice and get some positive attention from me. As soon as I’ve got him back I direct him into a helpful task (“I’ve got another job for you to do - please can you go into the garden and collect up your tools so that we can dig later?” or something).
Basically it’s a bit like gentle parenting but actually practical and attuned to natural human behaviour. Your kids want to collaborate with you. They just don’t always have the right resources/we haven’t set the right principles/we are too wound up and on edge so they can’t ‘meet us’. Happy to say more but as I say ‘Hunt Gather Parent’ has some genuinely useful ways of working with toddlers (literally working!). All the best to you.

I have a 19mo and we've just really hit the constant grabbing phase so I completely sympathise. Dad is very hands on and present but she just always screams for "mummy!" "Mummy!" "MUMMY!!!!!". And always wants "mummy up!". I thought I'd hacked it by getting the sling out so I could have my hands free while carrying her but she throws a fit as soon as the sling is on, I have to hold her with my hands. When I sit down she immediately needs to be on my lap and then her hands start pulling my hair or investigating up my nose or in my mouth, even just watching tv she's just (accidentally and curiously) causing me to flinch with every move because of all the pinching and sudden accidental slapping. Even just getting onto my lap she just wildly grabs at whatever part of me she can with force and drags herself up, so I always have cuts and bruises from her. I know it's not her fault, just like it's not your kids' fault but I completely second the person who said just doing things with a friend who has kids the same age makes it so much easier, makes you feel less alone. When I'm having a really bad day I have a neighbour with a son the same age and I go round there or she comes to me and honestly, it's saved my sanity.

It will pass but we're in the thick of it right now and it is really something.

She's repeating the behaviour when you tell her not to do it because she's trying to find out what will happen and when, because she's not sure how much she can get away with.

Ok and what should I do? Immediate consequence, right ? So she knows she can't get away with it at all.

Sounds interesting, thanks for the tip. I will check that out.

Yes, I think like someone above said, immediately taking outside is better than the faff and delay of getting organized to go home. And being right beside her to prevent the snatching before it happens is even better if you can manage it. It would be really intensive for a while but once she understands that she's going to get caught every single time she'll get the message.

@aaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh we do calm down breathing so when DS gets really upset but not quite past the point of no return we do deep breaths to calm down - it works about 50% of the time - i have to catch the timing right. and you have to teach them when they are in a good mood

I honestly have found it a totally different world since he dropped his nap and I haven't worked out how to manage it. He was only three last week so we still have ages of this "phase"

Give me a new born literally any day of the week - that was the land of milk and honey 😭

I had the same experience regarding newborns vs toddlers for my first especially. Newborn stage was a breeze compared to the tantrums !

My DD dropped her naps at 2 and a half because she wouldn't go to bed until 10 pm ! So it's been a while for us. She used to fall asleep on the floor at 4 pm back then. So I would put music on and dance around that time to keep her up. Her behaviour was always challenging so I couldn't attribute it to dropping the nap specifically. Hang in there, they're little demons

DS was a "good boy" literally a happy potato baby then talking conversationally at 18mo always got complimented on his behaviour when we were out until 2.5 then he got progressively rougher with the baby so I obviously got crosser. That will teaching me for ever being remotely smug.

Since he has dropped his nap he has become an absolute demon, like your DD he was refusing to go to bed, till gone 10pm but falling asleep on the floor at 4ish. Won't eat half the things he used to, won't go in the buggy or walk only wants to be carried. Won't get dressed, brush his teeth or put his shoes on EVERYTHING is a bloody battle. Doesn't like anyone or anything he used to. Runs away, lays on the floor and refuses to move, hits and kicks when he can't have his own way. LORD it is draining.

I wonder how much of it is upset about siblings arriving.

This sounds incredibly hard. Does he have good days and bad days would you say ? Or is it always a struggle ? My DD is 3 and a half now, but was definitely worse at 3 and at 2 and a half. Especially with getting dressed and that kind of thing. ' shall we use this toothbrush or that toothbrush ? ' ' Do you want to put your trousers or your top on first ? ' this really helped and still helps with the daily stuff. I don't even approach her with an outfit I've chosen. She will immediately say no to whatever I chose, just because she didn't choose. I always go with two outfits and ask her which one she wants to wear. With food, I completely ignore her. I put food in front of her and she very often goes ' yuck I don't like it ' ( without trying and also food she has eaten before and does like ).. I say, ' oh ok. Well that's what we have. Maybe you'll want some later '. She then sits and sometimes has a bit of a tantrum or sulks and I just kind of ignore her or I name her feelings like ' oh no, you're upset or angry ' or whatever.. I continue to eat my food and give it to the baby and more often than not, she'll start eating after a while. I don't let her see it's an issue at all. I know that will just go down hill.

These are little tricks that do help a bit..

If you are planning to go out the next day pack the bag up the day before so you can grab and go.

I found lots of positive attention early in the day helped them stay calmer in the middle of the day. Get them helping with jobs you are doing ie the 3yo can finish the safe bits of the washing up while you start drying. They feel like they are grown up and helping.

Water play and messy play go down well unless you have a child who hates it. Shaving foam is messy but clean fun. If you have outdoor space and staying home put pots, pans,jugs,cups and water out. Even if it's only in a washing up bowl.

I always tried to add nap time/quiet time in after lunch where we read books or watched a film or they played quietly while mummy did her jobs (cuppa and a book/computer time) for an hour.

The more you get the 3yo to help you with - ie dinner prep - the more they tend to want to help.

It isn't magic though. They are often quite contrary at that age even when you do all you can to engage them. I would say though - if they are going to nursery most of the year stick to doing homely things rather than things like soft play. That's what many full time nursery children need most as they get all the stimulation and sharing etc drummed into them when they are there. Home time should be quality time with with a parent pottering at home or a simple trip to park or beach.

I get you . I have a 2 and 4 year old who is starting school soon and I can't wait!! I am a sahm (well I work on weekends) but all week it's just us and it feels suffocating sometimes . I am not a climbing frame 😆

@LabradorFiasco I love the sound of this.

I’ve noticed calmer works. My 3yo HATES when I’m disinterested and will do anything to get me animated again.

Have you got any books/websites you can recommend about the other strategies?

@RockAndRollerskate there is a quick summary of the book here, which is helpful for running through the main concepts. You could then do your own research on the aspects that interest you. https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/moral-landscapes/202106/how-not-be-angry-controlling-parent-0?amp

This is a bit outing but I’m actually an anthropologist myself and have spent considerable periods of time with Indigenous peoples in North America and on the Indian Subcontinent. Although I specialised in sleep, I obviously picked up a lot on parenting in general, and calmness was pretty much universal. Parents had better self-regulation and so, in turn, did the children. I struggle with rage and it helps me to voice my feelings and emotions (so staying calm, but saying “oh I’m feeling very angry, I think it will help
me to go outside for a minute” etc) which I have seen replicated in various Indigenous communities.

I think this is a very interesting area of discussion anyway but I hope this helps you and the OP.

@aaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh it's hit and miss sometimes he is an absolute delight sometimes he is awful.

Just the nature of the phase it is so unpredictable I've read all the books follow all the pages try all the let's do blah, let's race, show me how to bite that sandwich like a dinosaur etc.
Keeping a routine, making sure he has fresh air and walks, limiting screen time, helping with jobs, reading, play groups etc etc

Works some of the time, some of the time it doesn't matter what I do or say either way.

Yes from about 2.5 it's like he woke up in toddler mode and has gotten harder since he dropped his nap 😮‍💨

I think the trickiest thing is that he is a huge child 98th centile for height and weight so he can really hurt when he kicks off and it is really hard to carry him off when he doesn't want to go, especially when I have the little one to consider too.

Thank you, I appreciate that. What you're doing is no easier though, you're just juggling more responsibilities. Hang in there, they've got to develop impulse control and logical comprehension at some point...

By the way, I second PP's advice to buy some ear plugs. I have the loop ones. You're still able to hear and have conversations etc but it takes the edge off the screeches and screams.