To think British maternity care must be among the worst in the developed world?

[ForestGoblin]

Nurses refusing to watch newborns when a mum needs to poo??? Nurses have got a professional and legal obligation to support patients to receive adequate personal care (not being compelled to poo yourself has got to be rung one of meeting that obligation).

Friends who have given birth in Ireland, france, south Korea, Switzerland were all given support to sleep, recover, be recognised as an injured person in need of recovery time.

British nurses trick new mothers into thinking they can't leave their babies for a minute on a bloody hospital ward (even when they've got numb legs).

Rise up, damnit!

When I had my first baby I was young and had a traumatic birth. In the night my husband wasn't allowed to stay, I hadn't slept for a few days and baby was crying constantly. I started to cry and asked a midwife to help and she just said "well what on earth did you think it was going to be like?" and walked away. I think how ashamed and vulnerable I felt from her unkindness will stick with me forever.

@MariaVT65

I can see why that’s the number one complaint. I think a lot of midwives become bitter and some even enjoy having vulnerable people to abuse (yes, abuse).

They also cover each others arses, for everything. And love to make you feel mad, gaslight as you say.

I'm not a midwife, but I am a (non maternity) Healthcare professional.

To all of the mums who did not get even basic, adequate care, I am so sorry.

And when many people's complaints are because of the attitude of the staff, we don't get to blame understaffing. It doesn't take any longer to be nice, caring and professional. It's literally our job.

Some posts on here are due to understaffing though and for that I just recommend researching which political parties near you are pro NHS. Ultimately however they're all incredibly misogynistic and 'women's issues' will be given less money and less respect than anything that might harm men.

OP however is just a troll.

You are beyond ridiculous.

The staff on my post natal ward were truly awful, sitting behind their desk and refusing to move. Treated us like naughty school girls who had had sex and should now bear the consequences. But were very helpful to a lady who needed to go and have a fag.

You can go anywhere you want, assuming you're happy to pay for it. £15k or so for a delivery and aftercare, more if complicated.

I was really impressed with my care in both my pregnancies in England (pregnancy/birth/after care). 2 different counties/hospitals. Midwives offering to look after my baby while I slept/went to the toilet etc. Often like everything else it seems to be a postcode lottery. Another local hospital has a terrible reputation but luckily knowing this I could make the informed decision to use another hospital which isn't always possible for some

They kept offering to have my baby so I could shower/sleep ect 🤷‍♀️

Sounds horrific. I'm not sure why women tolerate the situation. I don't like hospitals so used private midwives with a non NHS consultant as backup for my first 3 DCs and an NHS community midwife (who was fighting not to have the service she offered cut) for my 4th. They were superb.

I really feel for you and I can absolutely believe everything you say. Giving birth during the pandemic was horrific.

I had my son (only child) nine years ago and the 'care' I and other women received was appalling frankly.

My labour was very long as he was a big baby (nobody's fault) but the midwives I had weren't very good at all. Two couldn't agree on how dilated I was and both were adamant the head was well engaged. It was only hours later when a doctor came to me that we actually got anywhere. Without even doing an internal, just feeling the abdomen she said it was clear that the baby's head was not far enough down. Despite being in labour 24/25 hours by this point, I was still only 6cm dilated. Baby was becoming distressed so I had an emergency c-section, performed by said doctor. She was absolutely amazing, as was the anaesthetist and I am eternally grateful to them for their care.

Postnatal was no better. I hardly laid eyes on a midwife in all the two days I was there. No support with baby despite being post surgery - one midwife didn't even know I'd had a c-section!

They forgot the blood thinner on the first night post op and managed to lose my blood results.

One lady opposite me had a baby in special care. It was also clear that this lady spoke little, if any, English. The midwives were awful with her - so impatient and some were just nasty. They sent her to special care, alone, walking through hospital corridors!! to feed her baby. She apparently fainted on the corridor en route and it was sheer luck that a porter was in the corridor and helped her ☹ that she was sent alone after a c-section was bad enough, but to then end up with a porter having to look after her was just shocking. Poor lady must have been terrified 😔

I had a debrief some months later but I just felt it was the hospital trying to justify themselves so it didn't help really.

One way around this is to work abroad for a few years - lots of companies offer international transfers/secondments.

Often the job packages come with excellent medical insurance (particularly if it’s the US, as they know they need to offer this to attract Brits and Europeans).

So that’s an option for anyone anxious at thought of giving birth in the UK (as this thread is making me tbh 😬).

I had a terrible 9 months under NHS maternity care - which included refusing to go by my charted conception dates only my LMP even though I explained I had 40 day cycles, telling me there was no chance of me getting a home birth, telling me I had to have extra scans as I had a low BMI despite it being normal for me (and me later giving birth to an over 9lb baby), telling me at the scans that they were so happy to see me as it was really nice that I wasn't really fat like most people that had extra scans, the consultant telling me it was a waste of time being there as there was no reason for me to have the extra scans as I was obviously fine, the midwife later telling me that I couldn't give birth at the unit I was booked into as I was over my dates (due to them going by my LMP) and telling me I'd have to give birth in a hospital well over an hour away from me as that was what the unit had booked me into rather than the one closest to me. The hospital near me refusing to take me even when I begged as I was so stressed and worried about getting to the other hospital, they didn't care. And that was 18 years ago, I dread to think what it's like now.

At that point I got a private midwife and the care was completely different, like chalk and cheese. She listened to me, believed what I said and did what I asked - it was like a miracle! World's away from the NHS experience. She spoke to the nearest hospital and got me in there if I needed to go. I was at home for almost all the labour, but got to the point where I felt like I wasn't progressing and decided I wanted to go into hospital just in case. I was so glad she was there with me as I was just left most of the time and I wished I'd stayed at home. Later after giving birth when I went to have a bath there was a dirty scum line all round it. I left as soon as I could a few hours later.

The countries you’ve described don’t receive free healthcare. They pay and when you pay it’s always going to be better.

the nhs is crumbling I get pressure. Mass immigration, healthcare tourists who come here get free healthcare then bugger off without paying.

It’s only gonna get worse, the nhs started out for a much smaller population. Our population has grown and the nhs can no longer afford to sustain.

nurses work long hours with only the little resources available to them, they haven’t time to babysit your baby.

I requested a C-section, apparently this was a very very bad thing to do and I was punished severely.

My mistake was discussing NICE guidelines with a stressed angry midwife and her student. She found every single thing she could get me on (including missing appointments because they were sending my post to my neighbour) and referred to social services.

The midwife is now one of the heads of UCLH. If she is reading this, I hope the pain you caused comes back to you, you sociopath. She is now doing this to other women but I was too scared to submit my complaint officially (it stayed internal)

My GP was shocked by her letter and referral. It was resolved when they knew they had massively messed up with their lies and smear campaign and the head midwife treated me like a person (she was fantastic, what a midwife should be)

You say that, but many of us on this thread have experienced the opposite. The issue seems to be that the hospital wants it both ways - no partners to help with basic needs, but also no staff or lots of shit staff.

I ended up with PTSD after my sons birth because of the actions of nursing and midwife staff. It was a bad birth but their behavior was abusive and neglectful. Shouted at. Abandoned. Told I was disgusting. Told I was lazy because I physically couldnt stand up. Told i had to have a psych assessment as they wernt sure i was safe with my baby because I was constantly crying due to laxk of care and support and exhaustion. (psych came and had no idea why they had called them). My daughters birth was on a paper a significantly worse birth and i didnt have any lasting trauma because the staff were very supportive. Care makes a huge huge difference to outcomes. Its disgusting.

Same, it’s one of the reasons I never had a second child.

These experiences are inexcusable. No better, or sometimes worse, than the experience I had 20 years ago.
Yes there are staff shortages and underfunding but that frankly doesn't excuse basic lack of care at an individual level. There has to be accountability at all levels including these individual behaviours which need to be addressed.

I've spent time in hospital recently and post pandemic, where to start. There are excellent staff, but the bad ones are buoyed by the attitude that everything is someone else's fault. Believe me, I'd support better pay, more investment but much more accountability.

Beware of small people with authority, as they say.

Having given birth once in England and once abroad, I 100% agree.

First of all, over here we rush to induce women for the silliest of reasons. It's like the second you pass your due date you're on a clock and everyone treats you like you're being super irresponsible by going even just one week over. Interestingly in France, you're not even classed as overdue until after 41 weeks, not 40.

My labour experience was also atrocious. Similar to posters above, my midwives couldn't agree on how dilated I was and kept telling me NOT to push when I had a desperate urge to. They also screamed at me to push when I felt no urge to, simply because I fully dilated and therefore it was "time", which ruined my pelvic floor. I said I wanted to give birth on my knees and they put my legs in stirrups and said no, on your back would be best. They inserted my catheter incorrectly which tore my urethra and now I have a bulbous lump of scar tissue. They cut the cord without asking. I kept ringing the buzzer for water in the hours after labour (when my husband wasn't allowed on the ward and I was going in and out of consciousness) and no one came for hours. Oh yeah, and I was left alone with a baby while going in and out of consciousness...

Maybe the private UK experience is a lot better, but it's put me off giving birth here again.

Re this : No and no. It’s not childish. Medical staff need to understand that they are committing a criminal offence - they are guilty of assault - if they act without informed patient consent. Doing something like this is extremely damaging to a patient’s well being and future ability to trust medical professionals even leaving aside the law. Complaints need to be made and acted upon.

This is awful OP. Yet women keep having multiple babies under bad conditions so what incentive is there to change anything? I’d love to see our birth rate plummet further so we get the great care that South Korea has.

Friend is Norweigan - they have 'hotels' attached to the hospital, where you go with your own room for a few nights after giving birth (no other family members or children allowed to stay). Gives you a chance to bond, sleep and recover, but also be close by if anything goes wrong.

As for me? With one birth I had to share a bed with my newborn after she was born in the early hours - well, I say bed but it was actually the delivery table - as they didn't have any proper beds or cots free. And with my last birth they missed the fact I'd had a brain bleed , despite me being in so much head pain I couldn't stand up without screaming.

I think part of the problem is that it is a complete postcode lottery.
My first DC - straightforward NHS hospital birth and I was transferred to a local village hospital for aftercare for 3 nights. 3:1 ratio of carers to mother's, I was taught how to feed baby in various positions, bathe baby, change nappies, fed 3 meals a day in the sunroom with the other mums whilst the babies were looked after. Babies were settled at night by the nursing staff so Mum's could sleep. We chatted, compared stories, supported each other and became friends.

Second DC - I wasn't allowed to come into hospital as I couldn't possibly be that 'far gone'. I almost gave birth in the lift and was discharged home 3 hours after I stepped foot in the hospital, sore, confused and exhausted.