To be upset that I was not told I was breast fed by my aunt?

[Evieanne]

So in my family’s religion and culture, breast feeding a baby who isn’t yours still forms kinship and re establishes part of who you cannot marry and who you’re allowed alone with from the opposite sex even within family and who can help marry you off.

In my case, as a baby I was Breast fed by my dad’s sister and I became my aunt’s milk daughter and I am the milk sibling to all of her aunt’s children - so my cousins from my aunty, through me being breast fed, became immediate family to me and are just like my biological siblings. so her male children can no longer marry me and can be alone with me and can be my guardian when I marry as they are considered my brothers.

So it is a huge thing in my family’s religion.

It took my parents a while to conceive, and they used a clinic to finally have me. There were concerns as to whether I was biologically both of my parent’s daughter, but they loved me anyway and said they didn’t want to know. My mum breast fed me a couple times just in case I wasn’t biologically hers and kept me bottle fed after that, so I know I am the mahram of her brothers and her dad. My aunt breast fed me when my parents took me to Pakistan as a baby to make sure there was no way I wasn’t blood family to my aunties and uncles on my dad’s side because my parents are related and there was no cheating, they were wanting to protect family ties. I don’t know why they just didn’t do a dna test.

But they kept this from me and I found out because my mum and my aunt had an argument about it and I was told by my mum I couldn’t be alone with any of cousins from my dad’s side unless female and I asked what about the cousins from this aunt who breast fed me, they’re my brothers ffs!!

A PM with a photo of it would be great if you wouldn’t mind, I’m quite interested

That’s a valid question as it is normal for a sister to have a child for a sob,ing who can’t conceive. In fact until recent times it was preferable to IVF. And that’s what’s puzzling me - that the family who are apparently so devout agreed to IVF where one of the parents may not end up biologically there’s. Quite often I’ve seen advice from Islamic scholars in our local press regarding IVF and the opinion is that it’s ok as long as a donor apart from the husband and wife isn’t used.

While other people might have different belief systems and opinions about the freedom of women but I don't think it's helpful to impose your own views onto someone who is not asking for them. This is perhaps not the best forum to ask advice.

I do not share your religion or culture, I can understand how upsetting keeping something like this from you might be, especially if it fundamentally changes the relationship you can have with members of your own family. I would imagine it would be upsetting to know you could have had a freer more sibling like relationship with your cousins. Do you think perhaps your parents didn't want this? If there are questions about who your parents are then perhaps they thought a less formal relationship inappropriate?

Unlike western society, where women were pretty much unequal until WWI, in Islam, men and women have always been equal. It’s written in the Sunnah and Hadith, many times!

When both husband and wife truly are Muslim as intended by God’s Will and not a crackpot Taliban or other extremist, of which only 1% of a Muslims belong, then both the husband and wife explain where they are going and for what purpose - it’s not permission and I feel like @MakeMineAdoubleChocolate maybe couldn’t think of a better word? It’s perhaps better to call it respectful communication as I’m sure you share with your partner (leaping to a conclusion) 💐

Sorry Op, I’m well acquainted with the concept of milk siblings and where I live it’s still relevant today.

Yes.

I think my parents wanted to bury their heads in the sand and pretend nothing ever happened and didn’t want to think about it any more as they must not have thought I would find out to question it. So now I have found out and they don’t want to deal with the reality

Cousin marriages are very common in some cultures.

Realistically with the sheer amount on inbreeding in your family, you really, really, really shouldn’t be marrying your cousins anyway. There has to be a point where ‘customs’ give way to common sense.

I would also very much get a DNA test for your own peace of mind.

Is the main problem that you aren't sure if they're your parents, or is it about being chaperoned around male cousins?

It is more relevant than many realise and in unexpected ways!
https://publications.aap.org/pediatrics/article/147/2/e20200441/36260/Islamic-Beliefs-About-Milk-Kinship-and-Donor-Human?autologincheck=redirected

I'm sorry to hear your mother abused you growing up and that your family have lied to you all your life. I have a few Muslim friends and they might recognise this situation from previous generations but none of them live like this these days - they don't marry first cousins anymore. I recently watched a documentary on the horrendously life-limiting defects that children had inherited because their parents were first cousins. Many of these children were never going to live a normal life because their parents both had the same genes. Marrying your first cousin is not the be all and end all, particularly if you've got health issues that they might also have.

I hope you manage to escape from this controlling misogyny mentally and physically, OP. People should be able to be alone with anyone they damn well want to, whether they're male or female.

I think it’s more likely that it’s your mothers egg and the unknown parent is the male. Probably your fathers sperm and another mans sperm (possibly uncle?).

It would be far more likely your father had sex with your mother very close to artificial insemination with donor sperm, rather than costly ivf in a different country with two different embryos that many people have said wouldn’t be condoned in the uk and probably not abroad.
Diy insemination is easy.

First there's a difference between culture and religion.

Second @Evieanne you need to understand that interbreeding is very dangerous. It can cause abnormalities because mating partners have similar DNA. The chances of infant death is double in children born from first cousin unions. There's a link to genetic disorders due to inbreeding such as blindness, hearing loss, neonatal diabetes, limb malformations, schizophrenia, heart defects and others.

I have a family member who married her first cousin. She had 16 miscarriages. I baby that lived less than 24 hours. 1 child who is deaf. 1 child who has dwarfism and won't live till adulthood.

Just because something has been done for generations doesn't mean it's right or healthy.

This country spends an awful lot of money and resources caring for the severely disabled children of interbred adults. Time this nonsense stopped.

If you feel that your parents truly love you and have given you a good life despite some mistakes (a slap or two in childhood in an asian home is not considered abuse, but if you are being hit now or are frightened of your parents in any way, then it is abuse to be clear), OP, then see your way to having some compassion for them. They were probably pressurised to have children and the judgement on your mother would have been enormous if she had failed to deliver.

Haven’t read the full thread but there’s a great site called south Asian therapists if you are looking for a counsellor

It wasn’t a slap or two. It was constant beating with wires and wooden spoons and the metal roti holder for ages it was pure torture. She’s the reason I have a personality disorder and scars on my body so I’m afraid I can’t see any compassion for her because she didn’t see any for me.

Sounds a difficult situation, Op. Your circumstances are so far removed from what I consider family relationships and day to day living that it’s hard to understand the complexities and dynamic of what you’re describing.

Are you saying you can only go out and about with chaperones, and they can’t be certain cousins because they’re not milk cousins, but the milk cousins you can be alone with and they can take you out and about. I hope I am understanding correctly. Is it the case that you cannot go out alone? Or, are you saying you want, or there is a possibility, of dating one of these cousins? Which is not advisable for many reasons. And you simply do not want to go there at all. Dating near relatives can result in problems health wise in any offspring you have. Apologies if I am confused a bit. And disregard all that if that is not what you’re getting at. The language you’re using is a bit oblique so I’m not entirely sure about the parameters of the dilemma you’re in.

Ok, so if the problem is not that above but it is that you are not allowed to go out and about generally with one set of cousins but you can another, that is troubling in itself, as you should be able to move freely wherever and whenever you choose. What is your age? With regard to family ties, a DNA test as pp suggested might be a good idea, for clarity. To know who your parents are.

After that however, if it were me, I would think about freeing myself from the entire situation. I would want to keep my parental relationship on good terms of course. But I think it would be good to be free from all these difficult milk-cousin-and-who-breastfed-you-as-a-baby dilemmas as this is the sort of past history that you can do nothing about and should not affect your future and your happiness going forward. I’m not sure you will want to be in the care of any of the male cousins, milk or not. A romantic relationship is out of the question for the reason of near blood familial relationship that would affect the health of any children. And, you should be free of any possible oppression or control that cousins might exert over you. Thinking ahead to how to plan for independence from the entire group that you’re entangled with, even though they are ‘family’ may be something to proceed with. All the best to you, op, again, if I have all this wrong, apologies. It is difficult to wrap one’s head around the thought of not having complete autonomy as a human being, male or female.

Unlike western society, where women were pretty much unequal until WWI, in Islam, men and women have always been equal. It’s written in the Sunnah and Hadith, many times!

Women and men are not equal when men have multiple wives on a marriage and women cannot have multiple husbands. That is not equality. That is a legal harem. That is polygyny.

Also "western society" covers from ancient times all over Europe - with huge variety in equality across regions and across time. You sound very ignorant and deluded indeed.

Oh my, I have just seen your most recent post. You were beaten? All the more reason to free yourself and cultivate an independent life with supportive friends and relationships that are not familial in any way, and I would include cousins in that, because pressure can be exerted upon them and in turn upon you, to come back into the fold.