What lifestyle do you think disabled people who are not working should have?

[HmmOk]

Curious about what other people think. Before anyone says it, yes I am quite aware that plenty of disabled people do work and lots earn very well. However not everyone is able to do that.

I generally think disability benefits should cover a decent quality of life - should make up shortfall in rent as rents are so high, decent quality food, pay for therapies and tools that would help the person's disabilities, and pay for some fun stuff so that everyone can participate in society. People need to have a bit more money than only meets their basic needs, to be able to meet a mate for coffee or have a day out or whatnot.

Thinking about this today as not currently working due to bereavement and poor physical health and know I'm lucky to be in a loving marriage where i am supported, and for now we are ok with money. I'm hoping to find work I can do soon that won't further fuck my health.

In contrast I have a mate who is very ill with very serious life threatening conditions. She is single, abusive family of origin and she is quite vulnerable especially looking at the future. I think there should be better security for her future as the immense stress of money is not helping her health at all. Like why can't PIP be given for life to someone in that situation? It is cruel.

What do you think?

Good luck trying to find an employer who will allow people to work whenever they can. Sure there are laws in place but there's reasonable (ground floor office, WFH, screen readers, etc) and there's unreasonable. Would you really employ someone like me who needs a lot of time off work because of appointments or because they're too sick to come in constantly?

But that's my point- it doesn't say clearly who is responsible for the poster.
It was translated into English and the picture with the translation is still suggestive.

Because one thing you are missing here is, that good propaganda is suggestive propaganda.
It takes issues, resentments and fear into consideration and suggest something. In this case the cost to the community of a hereditary ill peron... and if you read a certain pamphlet an answer to the issue/ fear / resentment will presented. (Something that wasn't translated in the original post. )

Don't feign ignorance, it's very clearly a Nazi propaganda poster.

Where does it say so?

If you can't spot Nazi propaganda without it being explicitly labelled then there is something profoundly wrong with your belief system and or cognitive ability.

Yes I'm sure that the 30s magazine cover saying that disabled people cost tax payers too much money, in a currency primarily used in Nazi Germany, which also says that it's the official magazine of the office of racial policy of the NSDAP, could actually have a positive message.

I dont know if you're actually that ignorant or just a troll pretending to be. I hope its the latter, its better than you being someone who looks at a nazi propaganda magazine promoting the euthanasia of the disabled.

@Libraryloiterer - nobody needs to be able to identify or interpret 90 year old posters or magazine covers in a foreign language.

But then, I was responding to the original poster who placed the image with a translation.... without all the background information, because that is how it can be viewed in 2023.

@NoPazuzu - Maybe your own in depth knowledge of the use and content of such propaganda can also raise some questions about your wider motives and views? ...

I love with chronic serious mental illness. I am no longer able to do the professional healthcare role I trained for, and each time I tried after my initial breakdown/ diagnosis, I ended up on long term sick leave and eventually had to leave those jobs. I have 'used up' my entitlement to student finance/ loans so cannot retrain at a professional level.

There is no funding for people with disabilities to retrain - I've spent hours with my local careers service trying to find a way round this, but there is nothing. And because I receive ESA (support group) I am unable to access programmes for the unemployed.

I am also in the process of reapplying fir PIP for the the third time in a decade. The first time I was awarded daily living rate straight away. My application was fine by the benefits worker at my local CMHT. When it came to the time for review, the benefits worker had been made redundant and that service was gone. My PIP was stopped at review, and eventually reinstated a year later at tribunal. It was a long and arduous year which impacted on my mental health, which was poor anyway, and my home life and relationships, because we had to make do with £400 less coming in each month (my partner was on minimum wage).

Thos has now happened again. The assessor stated I was 'no longer under the care of CMHT' when, in fact the CMHT locally has been decimated by staff shortages and can barely care for and treat people in life-threatening crisis, let alone those of us who previously benefited from a fortnightly check in with a CPN and six monthly meds reviews.

The dire lack of services to treat me is interpreted by the DWP as me not requiring help, care or treatment. It's utterly twisted and people who haven't been through the process have no idea how utterly demeaning, humiliating and stressful it is to attempt to provide robust evidence for conditions that rely on services existing to provide that evidence. My illness generally causes me to self isolate through paranoia, derealisation and acute anxiety, but the DWP expect some kind of weird circus performance of madness to 'prove' I am mentally ill. And then I have to go through the same damaging process every three years to prove that my condition, which is worsening as I age (in line with all the medical resesrch on the illness) is still present, despite being medically recognised as a life-ling condition.

It's exhausting. Being ill is exhausting, and then having to prove all this, and complete all the admin and paperwork, in the absence of health services who could provide 'proof' just leaves me feeling broken, and worthless and a burden to my family and society. But I guess I should feel grateful, right?

Good luck trying to find an employer who will allow people to work whenever they can. Sure there are laws in place but there's reasonable (ground floor office, WFH, screen readers, etc) and there's unreasonable. Would you really employ someone like me who needs a lot of time off work because of appointments or because they're too sick to come in constantly?

There may be laws in place, but who enforces them? Who ensures employers make reasonable adjustments per The Equality Act anyway, except employees presumably, after they have left, at the employment tribunal? It’s like the victims of burglary having to prosecute the burglars, themselves?

WTF is that supposed to mean?

And then you have posters on mumsnet bitching about the amount of sick leave that someone takes without knowing anything about their circumstances

Uh, yes, they bloody well do - otherwise they end up incapable of comprehending what seems so very reasonable is exactly how the public can be softened up for abominations as compulsory sterilisation (something that always comes up in discussions about child neglect, death and maternal inadequacy), forced work and ultimately, the wholesale slaughter under the arguments of everybody being pure and perfect and productive.

everybody being pure and perfect and productive.

As long as it's the right kind of pure and perfect and productive.

My husband is disabled and been unable to work for 6 years. His benefits just cover food and fuel. We do get a motobility car which is much needed as it takes the worry away from owning our own car and having to find money to run it. I'm 55 and was planning on going to part time work instead of full time but that can't happen now because I pay all the other bills.

When you accidentally do a bit of Nazi sympathising on the Internet the kind, humane and dignified thing to do is to climb down, apologise and learn from it.

Why are you defending this so persistently? Just go "shit, I didn't realise, sorry!!"

I’m disabled enough to need carers. I don’t have carers because I can’t afford them. The local council will take the majority of the care component of your PiP, I cannot give them £121. Per week for 15 minutes of care a day.
So yes, we should be able to get both the help we need and decent monies to be able to afford said help.

I think rather than having enough money to pay for therapies, adequate healthcare should be available on the NHS. There shouldn't be a private need for this. Everyone who needs access to healthcare - whether on long term benefits or working on a low wage - should be able to access it.

People who need care should get adequate care, rather than having to ration home visits. That's not a decent quality of life. Again, I think this should be free at the point of use and actually available rather than having to come out of benefits.

I agree with re-assessing people depending on their exact condition, but I think the current system is a shower of shit, and better trained, better qualified and more empathetic people should be doing those assessments.

And yes, I know, I want a fairytale land...

Nah, that poster knew exactly where the image came from.

The disabled posters here can confirm whether or not they feel they are regarded as a nuisance in general society. Obviously never in any specific and limited way - because that would be too obvious.

But when you realise there's no ramps where needed, the staff that are paid to assist you aren't there, the disabled loo is being used to store cleaning equipment, the lift is still out of order. Menus are only available in microprint, you can only order at the till up a step and so on.

(And don't get me started on the lack of accessibility guidance on 95% of business websites.)

Then, you might agree with me.

Also it's got worse in the past 25 years.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001mck1

BBC Radio 4 - Fit for Work

"For 30 years, governments have tried to get disabled people into work by toughening up benefit rules. It's had tragic consequences, as many claimants have taken their own lives."

It's a distressing listen.

"For 30 years, governments have tried to get disabled people into work by toughening up benefit rules. It's had tragic consequences, as many claimants have taken their own lives."

Which isn't an unintended consequence.

We need to remember the reason the white van solution was investigated by the T4 committee was because they needed to find the cheapest way possible to implement their policies. (Fans of Tory governments will recognise the desire to do everything on the cheap).

Interesting to speculate the push for electric vehicles may change the narrative here.

Quite. As someone disabled, until recently married to someone disabled, (he died), the barriers aren't getting easier.

Lifts not working, non BB badge holders parking in dis bays, young parents thinking their prams are more important than wheelchairs, in wheelchair spaces, on buses - I could go on. 🙄

I've read newspapers, watched programmes, and been on SM a long time now though.

And I've realised that many people who aren't doing too well in life, for whatever reason (financially), need a scapegoat and someone else to blame.

The most popular three scapegoats at the moment are migrants, sick/disabled, and so called Boomers.

Sometimes the resentment is astonishing - envy seeps through posts and articles.

They don't seem to understand that, as tough as they think their lives are, it's probably not as tough as being old (and getting more infirm), being disabled, with the merry journey through life that brings..🙄, or being a migrant trying to make a new life in a foreign land.

Disabled drivers left without blue badges because of council staff working from home (msn.com)

@Jamtartforme take home plus rent/mortgage? That's more than I get, I've just worked 60 hours this week in a salaried role, not hourly paid; I'm at the top of my pay scale in a role that requires a level 7 qualification.

HermioneWeasley
I think work is good for you. I’d rather see the money put into supporting employers to help
disabled people into work, and better medical/mental health care to stop people getting so ill in the first place.

for the remaining people who genuinely can’t work I’d like to see a good standard of living. But I am deeply skeptical about paying for people whose disability is entirely reliant on self report - back pain, depression etc.
I agree. I would prefer the money to be paid to subsidise employers who take on/retain people who need to take more time off than non disabled employees. My friend wanted to return to work but her employer was unwilling to take the risk. I believe that nearly everyone can do something to,earn money and contribute, and it is good for people's physical and mental health to work, but employers expecting set hours or limited sick time excludes chronically I'll/disabled people. We can't have policies that reserve paid work for people who have a threshold of wellness.

What a society. What a country.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4875754-who-was-unreasonable-train-staff-or-passenger