What lifestyle do you think disabled people who are not working should have?

[HmmOk]

Curious about what other people think. Before anyone says it, yes I am quite aware that plenty of disabled people do work and lots earn very well. However not everyone is able to do that.

I generally think disability benefits should cover a decent quality of life - should make up shortfall in rent as rents are so high, decent quality food, pay for therapies and tools that would help the person's disabilities, and pay for some fun stuff so that everyone can participate in society. People need to have a bit more money than only meets their basic needs, to be able to meet a mate for coffee or have a day out or whatnot.

Thinking about this today as not currently working due to bereavement and poor physical health and know I'm lucky to be in a loving marriage where i am supported, and for now we are ok with money. I'm hoping to find work I can do soon that won't further fuck my health.

In contrast I have a mate who is very ill with very serious life threatening conditions. She is single, abusive family of origin and she is quite vulnerable especially looking at the future. I think there should be better security for her future as the immense stress of money is not helping her health at all. Like why can't PIP be given for life to someone in that situation? It is cruel.

What do you think?

And...the Conservative Party have entered the chat.

Please be sarcasm, please be sarcasm 🙏

I was a clerk in a Remploy factory in the late 60s, I liked the job. Some severely disabled employees, a few who had been wounded during WWII. Various disabilities, some caused by polio, cerebral palsy, epilepsy, Down syndrome. The workers on the shop floor were all men then, women were just starting to move into employment there.

The factories were subsidised, some disability charities didn’t like the ‘sheltered workshop’ model. The labour government started closing them in the 90s, and closures continued until 2015 I believe. My recollection is that many of the employees enjoyed being part of a workforce, earning a wage, in an environment that was supportive. But thats a perception that could be wrong. The idea was to support people with disabilities into the more dignified world of mainstream work. Did that happen?

Just bookmarking to see how much attitudes change once the Tories decide "the migrant invasion" skit isn't working anymore and that actually it's"the disabled" who are the root cause of all our problems.

I think it depends on the need. Someone so disabled that paid employment is simply not possible should be cared for to a high level e.g. the sort of learning disabilities that mean that independent work is not going to pay a mortgage (ironically iny experience they tend to also be the people frustrated because they want to work but can't).

You should also be covered for a temporary illness to maintain a standard of living.

However, people claiming "disability" who actually are quite able or just not motivated to do what needs to be done to get well I feel shouldn't be given such a cushion that there is nothing to encourage them out of the situation. E.g. anxiety/depression may actually be better managed with structure, routine and a productive life than being at home all day.

I think more should be done to work with people to see how they can have a meaningful life/ career/ place to be every day rather than just handing out money which actually may just make people feel more worthless about their disability. E.g. what adaptions could be made in the workplace to make it Accessible. Are there volunteering jobs for people to build skills and confidence to work etc.

This is also my memory, I worked in 1 in the mid 90’s. More males than females but certainly reasonably mixed. Many people with learning disabilities working in the ‘factory’, very good at their roles and really enjoying it. Other physically disabled people were deployed on-site with other companies and reimbursed a % depending on level of capability. My recollection is once reasonable adjustments had been made these people did very well as it was just the physical/environmental obstacle and when companies were supported with how to accommodate it worked out well.

Seems like something of this philosophy is needed today.

I know several people with learning disabilities who have a very rich social life, and enjoy trips out. They can't work.
Having a life does not mean you can hold down a job.

For someone who can't work, I think national median income plus any extra money they need to meet extra needs seems fair.

This! Instead of saying those on dick:disable should suffer why don’t we say minimum wage should be raised so everyone had a decent income that covers the basics and a luxury or two?

minimum wage does not equal a living wage no matter how many times the government try to say it does. I’m f it did there’d be no UC top ups for working full time people as they’d be earning enough to live. And don’t get me started on over 18 being expected to support themselves when they come of parent claims for being 18 but don’t even make half of minimum wage and won’t get full minimum wage until they’re 25. Either they’re independent and should be paid the same as other adults or they should be able to stay at home and parent still claim something for them until they’re getting full minimum wage!

so many people just believe the propaganda and anti benefit claimant stuff that Nevis shove in our faces and don’t think deeper never mind try to empathise! Such a sad state for one of the worlds richest countries

They did this in 2008-15 remember? There were many suicides as well as attacks on disabled people in the streets as a result of media campaigns against benefits claimants, the UN investigated the (Labour initiated) UK privatised disability benefits system for human rights issues.

💯this

A social life and 'trips out' are not the same as working. My social life is a takeaway and some wine with my carer. My trips out are to the dentist, Dr or community shop.

Those trips out are tiring for me.

I very occasionally get to the pub, and I mean occasional, I think I have been twice this year.

"but somebody who is well enough for a social life and trips out etc is well enough to be doing something to support themselves"

My son is well enough to go on trips out with carers but he is still so disabled he will never be able to work. Do you expect disabled people to be confined to the house.

The absolute stupidity of this post astounds me.

My DH is disabled. I am his carer. Yes we have infrequent trips out and occasional holidays etc. None of that is the same as going out to work every day (which my DH did, for 30 odd years until his disability got too bad for him to continue).

They have already started to gently explore this angle. There was a recent nasty article in either the Times or the Telegraph about disabled people and benefits.

https://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/telegraph-articles-legitimise-hate-speech-disabled-activists-tell-tuc-conference/

but somebody who is well enough for a social life and trips out etc is well enough to be doing something to support themselves

Absolute nonsense. So all the people with learning disabilities, early onset dementia, Parkinson’s disease, MS, or those going through cancer treatment, needing carers 24/7 are expected to be able to work; because they can enjoy going out? Going to the cinema simply requires people to be able to watch a screen - in what way, does it mean they can do a job?

Absolutely. I’m profoundly deaf, with multiple medical conditions including a more recent spinal condition that prevents me from being able to walk far (10 minutes slow walking maximum without a rest.) having disabilities costs a lot of money and time, managing the admin alone is hard enough, and I have to rely on a relative to do my phone calls for me because it’s too difficult having lengthy conversations over type talk/otter computerised phone call app. I’m lucky that I have a blue badge which means I can manage short visits to places. I’d be virtually housebound without it.

The sheer number of hospital/drs visits is hard enough without everything else in life. I managed to get pip but only because my consultants were so good at backing me up when the pip assessor tried to deny how disabled I was and tried to deny me of the benefit. I’d love to be able to work and when my disabilities weren’t as bad in my 20s I did work, and I loved it, but sadly the older I get the worse the more disabled I’m becoming.

Looks like some posters here might see this, and when they get it translated think "now they had the right idea".

To save time it says:

"This hereditarily ill person will cost our national community 60,000 Reichmarks over the course of his lifetime. Citizen, this is your money."

I had someone complaining about the fact that I lived on benefits for years as I home educated my autistic son - why should the taxes they pay benefit my “lifestyle choices” - I pointed out that the only other option - special school - would cost the taxpayer a hell of a lot more than I was getting. Unfortunately this didn’t have the desired effect and she now thinks all disabled children should be home educated 🙄

The same person had a problem with a local
family fundraising for a wheelchair that would help their child be independent. She likened it to her deciding that she wanted a Ferrari.

These people will never get it, unless an accident or illness leaves them disabled.

@SerendipityJane - its a suggestive poster it can be a positive or a negative:

A Hereditary ill peron will cost the community 60.000 over their lifetime. This is also your money.

◇ How can we ensure this person receives the best care and services available?

◇ without this person, you'll pay less tax.

◇ how can we, as a community integrate this person and give acess to paid employment. (Therefore costing us less).

I suggest you find out where it came from and where it went, and then sell me the positives.

Meantime, if you see a lot of box vans driving around for no reason - possibly with banging coming from inside - you'll know this government is a bit ahead of you.

It's still suggestive.

My point is, that this particular poster with your translation can mean many things.

You associate the poster with something you have experienced, something you know (find out where it came from) oreven something you are afraid of.
You also assume that others know or have the same experience. They don't - that's my point.

Are you for real?

You seriously can't tell that that poster is Nazi propaganda? I mean, I don't expect you to know the ins and outs of Action T4, but c'mon...

Arbeit macht frei, after all.