To think it's embarrassing how English has one of the easiest grammar systems, and yet so many people don't know the basic rules...

[Skyeboat]

I'm a linguist, and the languages I studied have very complex grammar rules compared to English. So much so that native speakers have to memorise verb tables, moods, cases etc. at primary school level, and even those who didn't study to a high level know the basic rules.
English is one of the simplest languages, and yet the amount of native English speakers I see making really obvious mistakes is just embarrassing.
Is the problem that we just don't teach grammar and syntax in school?
For example, I saw a FB post today selling "Teddy's" (as opposed to teddies). That's actually the most common mistake I see - people, even businesses, not knowing how to use apostrophes and form plurals. I'd understand if it was a complicated rule that required memorisation with a lot of exceptions, but it's soo basic. It takes about 10 minutes to learn then you're all set.
I went to a pretty average state school, and I remember they did teach us these things, but we weren't rigorously tested on them or required to repeat them regularly. So I do believe the problem is with a lack of focus on basic English from a young age.
Am I being unreasonable or is this really embarrassing that we have such a poor grasp of our own mother tongue?

When I were a lass we were taught not to end a sentence with a preposition. It was a situation up with which we could not put. 😂

Pocketfullofdogtreats
"Amount of people" - No. This was covered at the top of the thread. Amount refers to bulk, numbers to plurals. It should be the number of people, the amount of waste (for example).

I find it more embarrassing when someone looks down their nose at people who are less educated than them.

You are obviously very privileged and sheltered.
Good for you.

Unfortunately, having a privileged life and a good education doesn’t teach you anything about being a decent person.

I bet native speakers of other languages make a myriad of different grammatical errors when speaking. You simply haven't been exposed to it as much.

@floribunda18 Well AI might make all human writing irrelevant very soon, so you do have a point 😉
But I do find it sad that people get defensive over this subject. It's not their fault if they weren't taught properly, but it is their right to demand it corrected for their kids.

We don't do aspiration anymore, just victimhood

I agree. The post below is a prime example:

What an elitist post

This.

But this happens in every language, in every country. It’s not peculiar to English. I have a French friend, who is a cook. His written French is terrible.

I would very much like to know why nobody seems to be capable of using colons and semicolons these days.

I have a feeling that the use of conjunctions at the beginnings of sentences is a direct result of people not really understanding how to use semicolons.

I have a massive bugbear about "with regard to" and "in regard to".

A large number of people say "with regards to" and "in regards to".

Why is this? "Regards" are greetings.

Apparently Chinese (not sure if one or both) is so complex not even the Chinese can speak it.

I think there are some language mistakes that are fine and done that can really grate but that’s probably down to personal tolerance. I do think reading is the best single way to improve language skills.

Reading these is like being on our local FB page 😂😂😂🙈

This baffles me as a person who has English as my second (or third) language. And I think the issue is lack of reading. People don't see text regularly except on SM posts. Therefore most things are spelt phonetically "should of/could of" etc.
I appreciate some people think your post comes across as ableist and are therefore suggesting that some children have better things to worry about than correct grammar and spelling. However, I don't believe the number of people who regularly misuse apostrophes would quite tally up with the number of children in poverty, surviving domestic abuse and battling with mental health. As a child who grew up in poverty and in an abusive household, I can absolutely confirm that education made me the person I am today.
I would disagree that English language is simple. Unfortunately, I am yet to grasp punctuation, article use, and obscene number of tenses. But I am working on it.

I don't disagree with anything you have said here but you have totally ignored the substance of my post. You claimed that English is the lingua franca 'largely because it is a very easy language to learn'. This is an incorrect claim.

English is a de facto lingua franca for complex reasons which have their roots in empire. It turns out that five hundred-odd years of colonialism are a highly effective way of seeding a language across the globe.

And yes, I can see it might well be the case that a highly proficient learner with an aptitude for languages might have an expert knowledge of professional vocabulary, even above their native-speaking colleagues. Struggling to spell in one's native language is not a uniquely British phenomenon. It's also my experience that colleagues with superb fluency in technical or professional English will nevertheless consult a native-speaking colleague to check their tone, or the use of an idiom.

I would very much like to know why nobody seems to be capable of using colons and semicolons these days.

I was definitely taught these back in primary school in the 70s. I have only a vague idea about how I'm meant to use them now! They rarely come up on my day to day life though.

Non english speaker here. English is the EASIEST language, by a mile! Grammar is easy, verbs as piss easy, construction is easy!
Sure, you might have a couple of tricky words, particularly with same spelling/different meaning, but trust me. It is one of the easiest languages around.

My housemate is English and she swears blind she was not taught grammar at school, and that that is probably why english people are so bad at it. Shes only 25, so its hasnt been that long since she was in school...

My grammar is terrible. I honestly have no idea how to use commas/apostrophes/semi colon etc correctly. Aware the previous sentence proves it 😂.

Despite that I still get a bit judgy when there's a massive post with no full stops or paragraphs.

How is it elitist? Are we saying that the poors don't need to be able to speak and write their own language correctly? What a patronising post

By that token, Spanish and Portuguese would be linguas francas as well, and they arent.
Not to forget that both the Spanish and the Portuguese colonised far and wide way before the English decided to do so.
No one used Spanish or Portuguese as a common language everyone knows.
Why? Because they are hard languages, with difficult verbs.

I think knowing how to write a plural correctly in your native language isn’t elitist, and to think so shows how low standards have sunk.

All those SM everywhere, by mums who will be passing on their own poor knowledge to their kids.

Of course it’s elitist.

It’s common knowledge that there is a correlation between class/income and education and how proficient someone is at reading, writing and speaking.

It’s one thing to acknowledge and accept that but to look down your nose and find it embarrassing that their are people less fortunate than you is pretty disgusting and definitely elitist.

Something I've noticed recently is the number of people missing out words when saying something needs to be done, e.g. 'Something needs done about that.' Where did this come from? Is it an Americanism or UK regional? I keep seeing it, yet I don't remember ever seeing or hearing it before.

I wonder.

The information I have about which language is spoken most worldwide is

1. Mandarin Chinese
2. Spanish
3. English
4. Arabic
5. Hindi

I have learned French and Spanish.
Once you have got past some of the 'odd' pronunciation in Spanish - silent 'j' and 'll' = 'y' IMO the verb construction and vocabulary are easier.

All those SM everywhere

Just means you are more aware of other people's poor grammar than you would have been 25 years ago. It doesn't mean standards have slipped.