To not be desperate for 'mum friends '

[Zumma]

DS is 12 weeks old. We moved to a new area last year so don't know loads of people apart from a few neighbours and acquaintances from the pub we went to before he was born.

A few people have commented about joining local baby groups etc and said it will be great for me to meet 'mum friends'. I've signed up for some already mainly as I think they'll be beneficial for DS. I'll also happily chit chat casually to other mums there as you do, but I can't imagine that I'll find really strong friendships there nor am I that bothered.

I didn't bother with an NCT group, partly due to distance of nearest one but also not keen on the idea that you all have to be 'friends' after and keep up with eachother in a Whatssapp group. A few friends have told me about various dramas with their NCT friends and it sounds quite childish and exhausting.

I mentioned this to a cousin the other day and she thought I was being antisocial and unfriendly. I've reflected on my attitude as I can see where she's coming from.

I think over the years growing up, I had some bad experiences with groups of girls (mild bullying, gossip etc) so the idea of actively seeking out groups of mums to be good friends with fills me with dread in case there's any bitchiness or horrid dynamics. I know we're all adults but it still happens - I've read a few threads on here about NCT groups and mums at the school gate to see what goes wrong. It's my idea of hell and I think it would take me back to feeling like an inadequate young girl again so I actively avoid it.

When I was younger I was often making friends with people due to having one thing in common eg on the same course or houseshare but beyond that there was nothing else so friendships were so superficial and fizzled out quickly. I imagine it's similar if the only thing you have in common with someone is you had kids at the same time?

I do have old friends of 5 or 10 years who are mums and I've connected well with them on motherhood although they don't live close by.

I'm probably overthinking the whole thing and I will obviously be friendly and chatty at the baby groups and if a genuine and nice friendship emerges then great but I suppose I'm much more selective and reserved about closer friendships these days and don't want to feel like I have to be everyone's friend and force pointless mum friendships as it hasn't worked well for me in the past. I'm also OK with my own company mostly as I often see family and old friends at weekends even though they're not local.

I'm sure as DS is older they'll be more happening with playmates and parties but for now I'm not desperately seeking out mum friends.

YABU - motherhood is a great time for new friendships and you're overthinking and missing an opportunity

YANBU - you're right to be reflective and cautious about these friendships and do what feels comfortable and genuine

Motherhood (particularly in the early years) can be quite lonely and also incredibly monotonous - you are literally doing the same shit all day every day. I found that having friendships with other people that were in the same boat as me was incredibly useful. As well as being nice to have a wider social circle it's also really useful to see what other people do, pick up tips or just know that you are not alone with particular issues. My Mum friends were invaluable and whilst some where just acquaintances a few are now close friends.

The other benefit to having a wider social circle of mum-friends is that your little one will also get some exposure to a wider circle of baby-friends as they get older and start interacting more.

When I had my first son, none of my friends had children. I went to baby groups and would chit chat which was always nice but I never put in the effort to make friends as such because I thought it would be a bit odd to build a friendship over the fact that we were Mums. I was a SAHM at the time and I'd say it was a pretty lonely time!

After my second I made a lot more effort. When my eldest started pre-school I made a group of friends, when it came time for school we all broke off to different schools so I pushed myself to get chatting to mums at the school and I have a really lovely group of mum friends. I do think you need more of a connection than just being Mums but that comes over time, you just have to build on that initial connection.

I don't think you're being unreasonable. I see it from both points. Those friendships can be so important in that time of your life though, they really understand what you're going through when others don't. Just stay away from the 'perfect parents/my children can do no wrong' sort!!

I think it may be depend on the specific friends you already have, or your ability to make new ones.

I lost a couple of childfree friends when I had my son as they just didn’t want to hang out with me.

I also find it tricky to make new friends at work who don’t have young kids as I am much less able to go socialising after work etc due to childcare, or generally being exhausted.

I have found it much easier to make new friends who also have kids, due to the new lifestyle we have in common. I have also kept/made a couple of new friends without kids, but they have a lot of relatives with smaller kids so understand a bit more. And one of them is now pregnant so coming to me for lots of support.

That’s nice for you. Many people, like myself, will find pre-baby friends are working Mon-Fri or are a significant distance away, so not having activities, classes, coffee/play dates to fill the days can lead to isolation, boredom or loneliness on mat leave.

Mum friends are useful for intel on what people consider good schools (they're not always right), events happening, what clubs might be useful as DC grows. I found mat leave pretty isolating so meeting up with people helped.

Yes this is a really good point. I depend on my mum friends for playdates during the week.

Make friends or don’t make friends as you see fit, why would that be a matter you need anyone’s advice on?
But god I’m so fucking sick of this obnoxious self-defeating misogynistic narrative on here that women at NCT classes/toddler groups/school gates/insert gathering place for “mums” are bitchy/cliquey/unfriendly/insert pejorative.
They’re just a random group of people who happen to have children the same age. No more likely to be bitchy etc than any other random group of people. I’m pretty sure some people on here just see what they expect to see. You’ll probably click with some and not with others. It’s a bit bizarre making up your mind whether you’re going to make friends or not before you’ve even met them.

Exactly. As if it isn't hard enough to be a woman and a mum, you then have to contend with this idea that you are [insert sexist pejorative] purely because you have a child, and hang around in places where other women with children are.

We are the same people that we were pre-children, we don't go from being interesting and compassionate friends (or whatever qualities the OP is after in a friend) to cliquey judgemental unkind superior "bicthes" (hate that word!) overnight, just because we now walk around with the person we made strapped to us.

The school mum thing intrigues me. Lots of people sneer at "school mums" but surely once your child is between 4 and 18 , unless you home school, then all mums are school mums... aren't they?? (But the poster never includes themselves in this group...)

I’m in the middle! I didn’t join nct because I didn’t want to force friendships or be caught up in a group. I did the same as you - signed up for classes that I thought would benefit my Dc. I wasn’t fussed about friends. However I would say I’ve organically made good friends with some of the mums As I see them every week. Some of the mums I just chat to, but some I’m definitly friends with. It’s been nice as it wasn’t forced it was all organic. So I’d say Yanbu or anti social, but do keep an open mind at the classes you have signed up for.

Good for you OP. I wish I'd had your confidence when I first had my DC. It was almost expected to go out and relentlessly socialise. I'm a social person anyway but that phase of my life was so fake and forced. I can hand on heart say, I didn't make any meaningful 'mum friends' or friendships with mum in those early years. My friendships came as they children got older and I met people through their weekend clubs where you could drop them off and have time for a chat!

that phase of my life was so fake and forced.

I can relate to that for some friendships. I cringe at how long I kept one going. We've now stopped bothering and I think would both be relieved.

YANBU. I like friends but not "friendship groups". I'll only be in WhatsApp groups if it's for a shared interest or a specific activity. I've removed myself from a fair few WhatsApp groups.

Did nct as felt pressurised into it by other people but hated it and had a bad experience. I like seeing people 1 on 1 and am quite self contained so it doesn't bother me. Have a few friends I've met via the kids but am not part of a big group. With first child felt obliged to do all the baby groups and stuff and hated it. With second we just did our own thing and we were a lot happier for it.

I think it depends on if you go back to work full time too OP. I did, none of my other mum friends did so they could all socialise and I couldn’t.

Having said that, I made mum friends because we all lived in the same street and were pregnant at the same time. Without having same age kids I wouldn’t be friends with them - all we have in common is toddlers.

I’ll make more effort in groups next time. Not NCT - sounds awful to me - but deffo baby groups.

'Mum friends' doesn't have to mean you only have the children in common though does it. The ones I've made friends with tend to have other common interests too like similar career, or hobbies. But having those people there (similar other interests or not) who have kids similar age and who really 'get it' in my opinion is really helpful.

No one I know has had any problems with NCT, can't imagine why they would it's just a way to get adults to get to know each other, what you describe sounds quite childish??

They are also the ones who will be up for unless playground, soft play, toddler theatre shows, whatever else, that non 'mum friends' will either have to be dragged to or will get bored of within 10 mins

I just stayed friends with my usual friends when my DC was born. Didn't do NCT or anything. Continued to see them after she was born. Now she's at school, I'd describe some of the school mums as friends but we don't do stuff without the DC!

The only friends I've made at mum groups are people who I got chatting to because I knew their partners. Don't think I've met a stranger at a mum group who I've then progressed to be good friends with.
I was quite lucky as my best friend had a baby 3 months after me, as did an ex colleague- who I then became good friends with after she messaged when she saw me at work and said she knew it was random but would I fancy going out with her and her DS with mine being the same age, shes now a very close friend. I'm very grateful for those friends, I do find it hard meeting and talking to people who you don't know from Adam at groups and forming bonds with them.

I didn’t want ‘Mum friends’ either. I had lots of friends already and when I met up with them it was nice to talk about other things than baby stuff. I went to classes though and did make one Mum friend organically because she was my type of person anyway.

There's a funny assumption that people who are 'mum friends' are not the kind of people you'd make friends with if you didn't have kids.

The whole idea of having a "tribe" is not very appealing to me. I went to a lot of mom groups when my kids were infants and toddlers. I developed a couple of friendships because those two moms insisted on spending time with me and my kids and I enjoyed time with them, but once all of the kids started full time school they didn't seem as interested in keeping in touch and I was ok with that.

I think just do what you want to do. The older I get the less energy I have to waste on things that aren't important to me. No two moms need to live the same way or the same lifestyle. You live the way you want to and need to live and be the best mum you can be and you're doing great.

If you work part time or on mat leave good luck just sticking with your current non 'mum friends', I would have been very lonely during those times where my other friends were at work.

do you think what you did is different to what everyone else is doing?

The women who constantly bang on about other women, how they all behave like X, how female friendships are all like X are actually the red flags.

So many women on here have so much internalised misogyny and seem to feel on a high horse belittling “mum friends”, which ultimately are just women in the same situation as you. For most people only seeing their regular friends while on maternity leave doesn’t work because most people don’t have a plethora of friends who are free to walk around a park at 3pm on a Monday to get their baby to sleep or go for a coffee at 10am on a Wednesday.