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Statement by the Chair of the Conservative Party

1000 replies

newnamethanks · 08/08/2023 15:00

"If they don't like barges they should fuck off back to France". 30p Lee Anderson of course, not the BNP. Not the National Front or whatever their current name is. The Chairman of the Conservative Party. Supporters must be so proud. What a statesman. So Churchillian.

OP posts:
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49
AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 19:13

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AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 19:15

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CloudyMcCloud · 08/08/2023 19:15

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:11

The problem is that you've fallen for right-wing propaganda hook, line and sinker.

Do you really believe every asylum seeker is a fit young man from a safe country? It is simply not true. And why do you think fit young men cannot be asylum seekers? It is often men who are targeted first because of the obvious danger they present to violent regimes if they are opponents of those regimes; also, of course, get the menfolk out of the way and you have free rein to rape, kill and traffic their wives and children.

I can guarantee that they don't believe they can pick and choose where they live at taxpayers' expense, because they know perfectly well that they can't.

People who have lived on the barges have attested to what is wrong with them, and the conditions in which these people will be living will be considerably worse as they will have to share cabins, will be there most of the day, and will be subjected to a fire risk as confirmed by the Fire Brigade.

Yes, we do need a safe affordable solution, but how on earth can you possibly believe this is it? The barge will house around 1000 people, whilst during, due to the government's massive inefficiency, we have a backlog of 50,000 claims.

What would be a safe, very affordable solution would be to accept France's offer of asylum processing facilities there, and make our own asylum processing system much more efficient. We could then quickly deport genuine illegal immigrants and move genuine refugees on so that they can work and become net contributors to our economy. I cannot for the life of me understand why people like you dismiss that and favour ridiculous initiatives like this that manifestly achieve nothing.

I don’t think Labour are up for doing processing in France are they? I thought they’d keep the barges

The issue is numbers, think about how many would apply. How would you handle a huge increase in numbers? Say the increase in legitimate claims was very high, how would you deal with it?

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:15

AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 18:07

I haven’t said we should be exempt from taking refugees, so save your pious eye wash. The comment being complained of relates to people coming here from France. Therefore the emotive wailing about about rape and torture was irrelevant.

Only irrelevant if you ignore the reasons why people claim asylum, and why their claims are accepted.

But of course it suits the supporters of 30p Lee to close their eyes to nasty little facts like that.

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:17

CloudyMcCloud · 08/08/2023 18:08

I don’t think it’s a dead cat anywhere with the same problem tbh, which is the case for many countries. It’s only going in one direction due to increased crossings, the Med is the same. Crossings are going up and will keep going up.

Politicians are going to get more demands on it

They wouldn't go up if the government had the sense to make arrangements to process claims from France.

IClaudine · 08/08/2023 19:17

Remembermynamealways · 08/08/2023 19:07

And we can take them all can we?
Where the hell do you suggest we put them exactly?

In terms of the number of asylum applications per head of population, the UK ranks 22nd highest in Europe. Perhaps we can learn from the other 21 countries how to manage it?

AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 19:18

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:15

Only irrelevant if you ignore the reasons why people claim asylum, and why their claims are accepted.

But of course it suits the supporters of 30p Lee to close their eyes to nasty little facts like that.

The question under discussion relates to
people who have come from France. Their reasons for leaving their country of origin cannot apply to their decision to leave France, unless you believe the conditions there are comparable to those in their country of origin. But that is a silly thing to believe, isn’t it?

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:19

Fuckingfuming1 · 08/08/2023 18:10

The Travelodge would charge you and I £70 a night to stay in one of their rooms. For many many completely understandable reasons, they charge the government triple that to House refugees. So literally, they are paying the equivalent of a five star hotel, and sometimes they are paying an actual five star hotel who I would imagine would charge more than triple to cover the inevitable damage to their property.

That still doesn't make Travelodges 5 star hotels, which was the point @HannibalHeyes was answering.

dimorphism · 08/08/2023 19:20

It seems to me the problem is that this topic is always discussed in isolation from everything else that is happening in the UK (NHS falling over, schools underfunded and oversubscribed etc). Maybe 21 countries who accept more asylum seekers have fewer problems and better infrastructure, it wouldn't be hard.

jgw1 · 08/08/2023 19:21

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You posted it originally?

Then, if you have read, it you will know that the UK government's obligations to asylum seekers under the 1951 convention. Obligations that include considering their application no matter their method of entry into the country and no matter what countries they transisted on the way to the UK.

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:21

AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 18:11

What law gives them that entitlement?

It's all quoted upthread.

AbyssiniaArms · 08/08/2023 19:21

Wsmi · 08/08/2023 18:35

Just take a look at the moral superiority dripping from this post. The absolute contempt for anyone with a different view. Then these people wonder why the general public does not want to be lectured by them. Wonder if they realize how detached from reality they are and how they are shouting into the void, just hearing their own voice and feeling smug about it.

Ok lovely.

Your comment above is a bit daft.

AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 19:22

dimorphism · 08/08/2023 19:20

It seems to me the problem is that this topic is always discussed in isolation from everything else that is happening in the UK (NHS falling over, schools underfunded and oversubscribed etc). Maybe 21 countries who accept more asylum seekers have fewer problems and better infrastructure, it wouldn't be hard.

I think in truth, those countries at Europe’s borders who of course receive more applications are very much struggling, and there is substantial public disquiet there too.

AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 19:23

AbyssiniaArms · 08/08/2023 19:21

Ok lovely.

Your comment above is a bit daft.

Why? It makes perfect sense. If you disagree, say why, don’t just sneer.

AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 19:23

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:21

It's all quoted upthread.

Then you will have no difficulty directing me to the relevant provisions. Go ahead.

jgw1 · 08/08/2023 19:24

AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 19:18

The question under discussion relates to
people who have come from France. Their reasons for leaving their country of origin cannot apply to their decision to leave France, unless you believe the conditions there are comparable to those in their country of origin. But that is a silly thing to believe, isn’t it?

It was established in a UK court and upheld by the HoLs that it is fine for an asylum seeker to transit other countries on their way to the UK.

CloudyMcCloud · 08/08/2023 19:24

AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 19:22

I think in truth, those countries at Europe’s borders who of course receive more applications are very much struggling, and there is substantial public disquiet there too.

Yes. It’s going to cause more tension, it’s already happening

EllenVannen · 08/08/2023 19:24

Twyford · 08/08/2023 16:04

Really? You think asylum seekers should fuck off back to where they came from, even if that means them and their children being raped, tortured and killed?

So France is now raping/torturing/killing asylum seekers?

Really?

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:26

Pollyputhekettleon · 08/08/2023 18:17

They changed the laws on this over the last several decades, very quietly, so most people are unaware of it. There's a reason they did it very far from the prying eyes of any democratic process.

No, the law hasn't changed substantively.

Happily, we have had a long and proud tradition of taking in refugees for hundreds of years. It's a real shame that this government wants to ditch that in the cause of desperately trying to cling on to power.

CloudyMcCloud · 08/08/2023 19:26

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:17

They wouldn't go up if the government had the sense to make arrangements to process claims from France.

How would this help if the numbers grow very high?

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:29

Remembermynamealways · 08/08/2023 18:19

It’s going to be very interesting watching this play out, the lefties genuinely seem to have NO IDEA of the reality.

This issue is going to come to the surface and surprise a lots of people.

What reality?

Righties are great ones for making dark, unspecified threats that they can't explain.

DoraSpenlow · 08/08/2023 19:31

Lifeomars · 08/08/2023 17:41

Think back to all the Ukrainian refugees, they were allowed to choose which country they wanted to go to, now why didn't that have the Mail and Express lot up in arms? Of course they want to return to their country when/if it is safe and the chances are people fleeing the conflicts in Syria and Iraq will seek to go back when/if things are safer

The difference was that the majority of Ukranians were women and children. The men stayed behind to fight for their country as opposed to many of those who arrive here on the boats who have left their women and children behind in conflict areas.

They don't believe that women are equal but are there to serve them and for their pleasure.

Housing all these young men in a seaside town in summer where there are likely to be lots of young women in swimming costumes and walking around in skimpy summer clothes could be a recipe for disaster.

Twyford · 08/08/2023 19:32

Wsmi · 08/08/2023 18:20

Like it’s been said already, MN is a bubble cut off from the real world. In MN world the majority are genuine asylum seekers, and everyone who questions is is racist. These people are totally cut off from the majority vote that has been in line with what Lee Anderson is saying.

The fact that Tories have failed to control the borders is another issue. But what the majority vote for is clear. Living in an echo chamber and shouting ‘racist’ at everyone doesn’t change that.

You've got a basic problem there, namely that it's not just in MN world that the majority are genuine asylum seekers. It's in the government's world as well, as demonstrated by the statistics they publish. Why don't you just go and check, it's not exactly a secret?

I think it may be you living in a bubble, scared of finding out the real facts.

AbyssiniaArms · 08/08/2023 19:33

AgathaSpencerGregson · 08/08/2023 19:22

I think in truth, those countries at Europe’s borders who of course receive more applications are very much struggling, and there is substantial public disquiet there too.

Because @AgathaSpencerGregson

You are clearly on a windup.

It upsets me to see the likes of @jgw1 even bother with you.

I long gave up on the country I was born in. I am disappointed in myself for engaging with the likes of you.

I have EU Residency. But I cannot help but care about my native UK.

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