To think divorce is selfish?

[Readyforafallout]

( Totally different for abusive relationships so not including those in this post)

Am I wrong to think that the following are excuses for basically gaining a moral green light for being selfish and swapping your own discontent for a child’s upheaval and distress ?

’ Kids are resilient’
‘ they will pick up on it so you are better of to divorce !’ ( even if the parents DO hide it well, people being convinced they will notice feels again an excuse)
‘ You only have one life OP! …’ ( so do the children)

it just seems that people ‘ grow apart…’
‘ want different things’ and put themselves ahead of their children…. I know this is likely an unpopular opinion
but hearing how ‘ brave ‘ people are for ‘ having the guts to do something about their situation’ seems selfish to me ….

because the children’s world are being opened to who knows who!…. As potential step parents !…. Complete upheaval And emotional distress … That’s worse than ‘ picking up’ on not much in my opinion .

it’s not a post intended to be unkind to divorces but more to not hold it in the highest regard like some achievement of braveness. It feels selfish ?

I often feel like my mum used kids as an excuse to stay in a bad marriage because she didn’t want to leave. She had money, her own house and a good job. Literally there was no financial reason why she couldn’t. I never got it for years until I finally concluded that she didn’t want to leave. Even if was really bad. Even it drastically affected us. I stopped believing it when she said she would because I asked her several times to as a teenager.

She kept saying she would but never did. So I got out and became independent as quickly as possible. Which she initially resented me for because I had escaped.

I don’t buy it when people say they stay married for the children. I just don’t believe it. I think it is because they don’t want to leave themselves.( unfamiliarity, fear of the future maybe finances depending on situation, cultural reasons and just not wanting to be seen mistakenly as a failure).

Yeah.

But, even more horrified when they then go on to separate and say horrible things to you about each other and both go on to marry again to absolutely vile and abusive people that they move into your homes and then expect you to accept as "family".

@DojaPhat, Gilead is calling you....

YABU. My parents splitting up was the highlight of my teenage years. With hindsight, I wish they'd done it sooner preferably when I was born.

No, you're quite right. It's better to raise children in an unhappy home, with resentful parents who argue and make each other miserable

That is so very well put...you don't owe them the best possible life, just a good life. I am divorced because I didn't love my ex-husband any longer, felt pretty much nothing for him even though he was OK, not the worst etc. So to separate was undoubtedly selfish and very bad for him and not great for the children. There are no 'buts' there, I chose to put myself first. I have tried to minimise the harm by very much putting themselves first in the separation, as has my ex. Neither of us have so much as had a serious relationship let alone created another family unit (7 years in), we live very close to one another to minimise disruption and we parent pretty well together even if occasionally through gritted teeth. And O do believe that it is how it is done that is the key factor in how damaging divorce is. But still, I was selfish and I own that and may well suffer a backlash when the children become more conscious of this as they mature. I'll have to own that too.

No more or less than marriage is selfish.

Some marriages, and some divorces, are selfish: people may walk in or out of marriages for money, or brief sexual attraction, or trivial social reasons, or out of pure capriciousness. Some are carried out for altruistic reasons, or are simply inevitable. Most are probably a combination of noble and less noble reasons. In any case, it takes two to marry or to divorce, and often enough one of the partners has no choice in a divorce.

While I agree that children should not simply be assumed to be 'resilient', being in a seriously quarrelsome or abusive relationship is likely to be worse, sometimes much worse, for the children than divorce.

Many of the things you mention seem to be more reasons for not rushing into remarriage, or involving the children in a new relationship too quickly, than against divorce as such.

OK. The OP hasn't come back. Has deliberately 'taunted' us by saying they're not going to be around for at least the next 2 hours.

I think he's a man, who is being divorced by his wife. So he is now very resentful of all the things that will be expected of him, like paying for his children, looking after them at certain times during the week, and no longer having a housewife on tap.

Oh, and @vipersnest1 - you do realise that @DojaPhat was being sarcastic, don't you?!

Also, I used to think maybe my parents didn’t try hard enough, but talking to my mum about her divorce has made me see that she really did try, and that she was miserable. When you’re trying to tell your partner you’re unhappy and they don’t listen there isn’t a lot of choice. My dad is a tricky bugger, and he never treated her like an equal, more like a slightly stupid child, which is how he still occasionally treats me even though I am definitely neither.

My DH isn’t a bad person, but he wasn’t able to be my partner, my support. And eventually that broke us. But I’m a nicer happier person now, and a better mum.

I once heard a relationship psychologist say that they saw a lot of people who imagined that they would be happier with somebody else - and may even think they've found that person - but that they were deceiving themselves. They'd be better dealing with the problems they had relating to their current partner, and were most likely simply going to repeat the pattern in the next relationship.

Problem is, though, if you're on the receiving end of that, what can you do except divorce the self-deluded, difficult to get on with, cheating person?

Yeah it’s an unpopular opinion OP but I think YANBU.

Two of my friends’ parents divorced when they were in university. They had held it together for years for the children, came as a total bolt from the blue - children had no idea the marriage was on the rocks.

IMO parents should put their children first (obvs with the exception of domestic abuse).

Replied but not to say if you are a divorcee or if you came from parents who divorced 🧐

I disagree, the the subsequent blending of families often is.

YABU

And your incorrect use of full stops is equally annoying

As someone who's parents stayed together for me as a child and only divorced at 19 I can honestly say the 'fake' crucial marriage was just as obvious and hurtful and I really do wish they had been more selfish when I was 5/6 and divorced then and found happiness elsewhere...

I may of had a different life and I'm grateful for the things I had and opportunities I got but I wish for them they had been happier younger especially my mum

AND I had an amazing SM and step sibs who made my life much richer!

But that’s what “staying together for the kids” looks like a lot of the time. Grumbling on until they’re no longer children then admitting it’s been a sham for ages and splitting up. Those couples should have been honest much earlier rather than waiting so the adult children know their family has been a lie and they were the excuse/reason for that.

The word selfish is misused. We need to be selfish to survive and thrive.
No one wants to be around a martyr as they’re usually full of anger and bitterness.
At the same time I’ve already decided that if DH and I ever separated, I would not go near another relationship because it just messes children up.

Really annoying when people say you haven't tried enough. I'm glad you spoke to your mum to get clarification I'm shocked that anyone thinks this though. I'm a single parent and I left DS dad because I was doing all the slogging, ex was refusing to pay bills and rent and wanted to save his wage, didn't want to get involved in family days out. I'd had enough by the time DS was around 3. My mum didn't approve she also thought I hadn't tried. It's ridiculous it takes courage to leave and then the aftermath of taking on the status of a "single mother" it isn't easy or type of walk in the park. I love my Son dearly but he is a small child toddler at the time and no child gets or should get to dictate their parents relationship. Life is unfair it's tough!

Given the story after story after story on Mumsnet of women who find themselves after having children with an absolute fuck stick of a husband, who doesn't parent, doesn't do domestic tasks and treats their wife like an unpaid bang maid, I'm saying it's really fucking disrespectful to many many divorced women, doing the hard yards of raising kids alone to say that divorce is selfish.

They're fucking heroes to go through the upheaval of a divorce in order to put themselves and their kids in a better place.

I agree with you, OP. Marriage might be the most important decision of one’s life. It may not be fair, but this is adult life, you chose your spouse, you decided to get married and have kids, there’s not an easy way out of this and your cushy feelings should not rule your life… I don’t like broccoli but I still eat because I am not a baby. I think safest option is to chose spouse with wisdom (which people don’t usually do, they tend to ignore all the red flags) and once you decide to marry and have kids you need to know the first rule is always fight for your marriage, no matter what (very few exceptions, as you mentioned, physical abuse, etc). I don’t get this “you only have one life” thing either, yes, I only have one life but you wouldn’t advise someone to throw a kid in the street if they get disabled or letting a parent rot if they are sick just because it is hard work to look after them. I’d rather have a not so pleasant life but know that in my deathbed I did the right decisions and didn’t run away from my duties. So yes, I find having a divorce some sort of weakness not something to be proud of (very few exceptions aside).

I think what matters is to acknowledge any damage that happens as a result of divorce and not try to brush it under the carpet and pretend everyone is just fine. My father left when I was 10 to marry someone else and only saw what he wanted to see, so that he could feel OK about his new life and not feel guilty. 50 years later when he died (3 years ago) he still seemed completely oblivious

@ClairDeLaLune I ahree people should be willing to work at a marriage, but am not convinced people leave for trivial reasons

And when they might appear to (eg I left my dishes by the sink), it's not really about the dishes. It's what it signifies ie lack of respect

Christ the stupidity of the morally superior is truly something to behold.

I used to beg my parents to divorce. There wasn't any significant violence just tension everyday and I mean every single day, constant bickering and some plate smashing. Performative suitcase packing as 5 year old me sobbed because mummy was leaving as she tried to manipulate my father into being less of a useless arsehole. My parents had no respect for each other, I thought it was normal.

My relationship template was fucked before I even had a chance.

If you are incapable of providing a secure and mostly harmonious home for you children then it is selfish not to divorce.