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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

OP posts:
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10
FortheBeautyoftheEarth · 27/07/2023 21:44

It's absolutely horrifying and disturbing. I bet the footage is somewhere online too 😢

IMustDoMoreExercise · 27/07/2023 21:54

Brefugee · 27/07/2023 19:36

You didn't understand.

I have served in the army in trying circumstances in the 80s. I did jobs that nobody else wanted to do, and additionally i kept the russian 3rd shock army rolling their tanks over the north german plain.

You are welcome.

If you are denying that the police force(s) is/are institutionally racist, sexist, misogynist and corrupt - you are denying reality. and i have no further need to read your waffle.

Show quote history

No, you don't understand.

I am agreeing that that the police force(s) is/are institutionally racist, sexist, misogynist and corrupt.

All I am saying is that the reason that they are all of these things is because we have too many low lives breeding more and more low lives and so the only people who want to be a policeman are racist, sexist, misogynist and corrupt people.

So I think we agree with each other.

Soontobe60 · 27/07/2023 22:10

AnSolas · 27/07/2023 15:06

Lets try again

Do you think:

A) the woman was sexually assaulted and the police have made a choice to not inform her of this fact.

Or
B) the woman was assaulted and the police have made a choice to not inform her of this fact.

Or
C) Do you think the woman may have been sexually assaulted and the police have made a choice to not inform her of this fact.

Or
D) the woman may have been assaulted and the police have made a choice to not inform her of this fact.

Or
E) nothing happened to her.

Show quote history

Oh dear… have you been on the sherry?
What I think is completely irrelevant. I stick to what I know to be factual. The video doesn’t lie. The narrative around what happened that night is disputed because so far there is no evidence. She “thinks” she may have been sexually assaulted, and that may well be true. But she doesn’t know. She has no memory. Are you saying that the police have decided that the video that we haven’t seen does indeed show her being sexually assaulted in a police cell under CCTV cameras? If so, you're currently hazarding a guess.

Elemist · 27/07/2023 22:10

CherryMaDeara · 27/07/2023 14:51

Fuck the police.

This makes me so angry.

I wonder if her ethnicity played a part, knowing a Muslim woman would be unlikely to want her community to be aware of these events.

As a Muslim woman myself I agree. They never thought she'd go public and thought they'd get away with it. I had a lump in my throat when she said she went to the hospital straight after as she could feel pain in her private parts 😥.

Original poster
Dovetail40 · 27/07/2023 22:33

Elemist · 27/07/2023 22:10

As a Muslim woman myself I agree. They never thought she'd go public and thought they'd get away with it. I had a lump in my throat when she said she went to the hospital straight after as she could feel pain in her private parts 😥.

Show quote history

I guess she must of thought all this through and still proceeded to waiving her rights to anonminity.

Brave woman.

OP posts:
bernieaa · 27/07/2023 23:04

Did anyone read the article? This also happened to a white woman...... so stop with the racial bias.

dottyshihtzu · 27/07/2023 23:56

She “thinks” she may have been sexually assaulted

She went to the hospital straight after being released, and her medical records confirm that Zayna had sexual injuries.

Are you saying that the police have decided that the video that we haven’t seen does indeed show her being sexually assaulted in a police cell under CCTV cameras?

The article says the journey to the police station, in a van with no CCTV, should have taken 10 minutes. CCTV captured Zayna being taken in to the station nearly an hour and a half later.

She had sexual injuries, so that either happened in police custody or before. The first scenario is obviously horrific, but so is the second. If it happened before, then that means the police dumped an unconscious sexual assault victim face down on a bed and cut her clothes off instead of getting her medical help. She was in a state of undress and no doubt feeling incredibly vulnerable in the cell for 40 hours, even though they'd noted nine times in the police log that she was not fit to be detained.

It's appalling. I hope she gets the missing footage, and answers.

Ponkyandthebrain · 28/07/2023 06:01

The reporting here is ridiculous. How can she have been in detention for 40 hours. To go over 36 a superintendent has to go to a magistrates court and it must be an indictable (serious) offence. We don’t do that for anything less than murder. Certainly not having glasses knocked off.

The only way this could happen and what’s likely is that she was seen by a nurse, concerns raised and then sectioned by two doctors in custody and makes sense as to why she was then taken to hospital. That also explains why the custody record says not fit for detention. That explains the delay as this can take ages and then waiting for a bed takes even longer. As per previous posts police were sent on a welfare concern. Police officers shouldn’t be sent to mental health calls. They’re not health professionals.

This would be all over the custody record which sky news clearly have possession of. No wonder bbc isn’t reporting on it. Terrible piece of journalism.

CherryMaDeara · 28/07/2023 06:12

Ponkyandthebrain · 28/07/2023 06:01

The reporting here is ridiculous. How can she have been in detention for 40 hours. To go over 36 a superintendent has to go to a magistrates court and it must be an indictable (serious) offence. We don’t do that for anything less than murder. Certainly not having glasses knocked off.

The only way this could happen and what’s likely is that she was seen by a nurse, concerns raised and then sectioned by two doctors in custody and makes sense as to why she was then taken to hospital. That also explains why the custody record says not fit for detention. That explains the delay as this can take ages and then waiting for a bed takes even longer. As per previous posts police were sent on a welfare concern. Police officers shouldn’t be sent to mental health calls. They’re not health professionals.

This would be all over the custody record which sky news clearly have possession of. No wonder bbc isn’t reporting on it. Terrible piece of journalism.

Sounds like you are trying to defend the police.

I don’t watch the news but for you imply Sky News isn’t credible is ridiculous, it’s won news channel of the year award for years.

Your gullibility that detention won’t have been longer than 36 hours is bizarre.

Ponkyandthebrain · 28/07/2023 06:14

It’s the law???

Ponkyandthebrain · 28/07/2023 06:15

Why is there nothing on the custody record that says under what power her detention is being extended then

CherryMaDeara · 28/07/2023 06:17

The police regularly break the law though.

I don’t know why, it’s still being investigated. Probably another failing by police.

Ponkyandthebrain · 28/07/2023 06:18

If you read any of my previous posts I’m VERY clear about police failings. On this thread and others. Believe me I work here and we can do much better for women and children. But I’d also like journalism to be factual and accurate. This is one of a number of issues with the report I’ve seen and posted on.

Ponkyandthebrain · 28/07/2023 06:19

But then sky news would be saying police commit false imprisonment because that’s what it would be. But they’re not are they. I’m not blaming her, she’s every right to question her treatment. They’ve done a hack job of the report though.

Felix125 · 28/07/2023 09:45

Catchasingmewithspiders
Felixs is MNs meaning expert on why its okay to strip women, up to and including teenage girls for the most spurious of reasons. Every thread about women being strip searched he pops up to "reassure" us it's all above board and totally justified even in circumstances where it very clearly isn't.
And he's adamant he belongs in the feminism space, taking up time, room and attention even though he clearly doesn't give a shit about women.

And where have I said this exactly.....?
If you are going to accuse me of things, you need to back this up with facts.

'Strip Searches' in custody have to be justified and authorised and are not just done for the sake of it. I have explained the procedures of doing such searches and why the are sometime necessary. I have also said that if the procedures are not followed - it is wrong and the people/officers who are doing this should be sacked and jailed.

This 'feminism space' is in fact a public discussion forum for people to discuss things. I am following the rules set out by Mumsnet HQ and, unlike others, none of my posts have been deleted by them for breaking the rules.

TooBigForMyBoots
For clarity - I am a 20+ years response officer.

Teder · 28/07/2023 09:54

Felix125 · 28/07/2023 09:45

Catchasingmewithspiders
Felixs is MNs meaning expert on why its okay to strip women, up to and including teenage girls for the most spurious of reasons. Every thread about women being strip searched he pops up to "reassure" us it's all above board and totally justified even in circumstances where it very clearly isn't.
And he's adamant he belongs in the feminism space, taking up time, room and attention even though he clearly doesn't give a shit about women.

And where have I said this exactly.....?
If you are going to accuse me of things, you need to back this up with facts.

'Strip Searches' in custody have to be justified and authorised and are not just done for the sake of it. I have explained the procedures of doing such searches and why the are sometime necessary. I have also said that if the procedures are not followed - it is wrong and the people/officers who are doing this should be sacked and jailed.

This 'feminism space' is in fact a public discussion forum for people to discuss things. I am following the rules set out by Mumsnet HQ and, unlike others, none of my posts have been deleted by them for breaking the rules.

TooBigForMyBoots
For clarity - I am a 20+ years response officer.

‘Strip Searches' in custody have to be justified and authorised and are not just done for the sake of it.

Agreed but let’s be clear, there are many times where they are neither justified nor authorised and they are just done for the sake of it. We know there are pockets of dangerous, poor practice in policing. It doesn’t mean it’s all police officers but we know it’s not a one-off issue.
I am in a profession that is often ripped to shreds but I know that it can be deserved and it’s indefensible. Just because I don’t act that way doesn’t mean I’m not part of profession known to have individuals whom are downright dangerous.

Xeren · 28/07/2023 09:56

FortheBeautyoftheEarth · 27/07/2023 21:44

It's absolutely horrifying and disturbing. I bet the footage is somewhere online too 😢

Probably being shared on Whatsapp groups like the pictures of Bibaa Henry and Nicole Smallman.

Brefugee · 28/07/2023 09:59

IMustDoMoreExercise · 27/07/2023 21:54

No, you don't understand.

I am agreeing that that the police force(s) is/are institutionally racist, sexist, misogynist and corrupt.

All I am saying is that the reason that they are all of these things is because we have too many low lives breeding more and more low lives and so the only people who want to be a policeman are racist, sexist, misogynist and corrupt people.

So I think we agree with each other.

Show quote history

ah ok, sorry.

Hibiscrubbed · 28/07/2023 10:00

Ponkyandthebrain · 28/07/2023 06:14

It’s the law???

Oh sweet summer child…

Wake the fuck up.

Hibiscrubbed · 28/07/2023 10:01

Is @Felix125 the man police officer who comes in to defend police on every thread like this?

Brefugee · 28/07/2023 10:03

Ponkyandthebrain · 28/07/2023 06:15

Why is there nothing on the custody record that says under what power her detention is being extended then

i haven't re-read the article, and read it yesterday morning but IIRC the custody record is as full of holes as a swiss cheese.

The constant defending of the police, here and elsewhere, in the face of overwhelming evidence that even the CPS and the police wouldn't even miss if it were a criminal case, is not a good look for the police.

I will agree with you about one thing: the police aren't equipped to deal with MH call outs. Are the police, and the police federation and the commissioners and all related lobbying the government to increase funding for MH services? They should be.

Hibiscrubbed · 28/07/2023 10:06

Ponkyandthebrain · 28/07/2023 06:18

If you read any of my previous posts I’m VERY clear about police failings. On this thread and others. Believe me I work here and we can do much better for women and children. But I’d also like journalism to be factual and accurate. This is one of a number of issues with the report I’ve seen and posted on.

You clearly don’t understand media law. At all.

Catchasingmewithspiders · 28/07/2023 10:09

Felix125 · 28/07/2023 09:45

Catchasingmewithspiders
Felixs is MNs meaning expert on why its okay to strip women, up to and including teenage girls for the most spurious of reasons. Every thread about women being strip searched he pops up to "reassure" us it's all above board and totally justified even in circumstances where it very clearly isn't.
And he's adamant he belongs in the feminism space, taking up time, room and attention even though he clearly doesn't give a shit about women.

And where have I said this exactly.....?
If you are going to accuse me of things, you need to back this up with facts.

'Strip Searches' in custody have to be justified and authorised and are not just done for the sake of it. I have explained the procedures of doing such searches and why the are sometime necessary. I have also said that if the procedures are not followed - it is wrong and the people/officers who are doing this should be sacked and jailed.

This 'feminism space' is in fact a public discussion forum for people to discuss things. I am following the rules set out by Mumsnet HQ and, unlike others, none of my posts have been deleted by them for breaking the rules.

TooBigForMyBoots
For clarity - I am a 20+ years response officer.

If you are going to accuse me of things, you need to back this up with facts.

Anyone who wants to check out my words can look at your posting history.

But the fun thing about being a poster on a social media site, and not someone you are speaking to as a police officer is that I don't NEED to do anything you ask.

Bananasandcorn · 28/07/2023 10:14

Brefugee · 28/07/2023 10:03

i haven't re-read the article, and read it yesterday morning but IIRC the custody record is as full of holes as a swiss cheese.

The constant defending of the police, here and elsewhere, in the face of overwhelming evidence that even the CPS and the police wouldn't even miss if it were a criminal case, is not a good look for the police.

I will agree with you about one thing: the police aren't equipped to deal with MH call outs. Are the police, and the police federation and the commissioners and all related lobbying the government to increase funding for MH services? They should be.

Show quote history

There simply isn't the staff or beds, to put this right will take many years and billions.

The Govt know this, all the lobbying in the world will not fix this, they have deliberately underfunded public services, hence we have these scandals and many others across the board.

Our two mental health units are beyond a joke, very sad what has happened.

Felix125 · 28/07/2023 10:35

Teder
I totally agree - and when its is wrong and not justified it should be investigated fully and the culprits sacked and/or jailed.

Custody logs should be fully endorsed and fully accurate all the time. The flip side to this is that it causes delays in custody to book prisoners in. I have been held in the holding bay for 3 hours plus. This then has a knock on effect in being able to respond to other emergencies

BWV should be used and i believe on all the time. The flip side to this is the cost of the data storage. This then gets passed onto the local communities in council tax hikes which the public don't like. I've have been 'requested' not to have it on all the time due to the cost - but I will continue to do this and encourage others to do it also.

Our force uses loads of 'cell watches' for safeguarding by police officers - again this has a knock on effect.