Am I being AIBU not wanting brother to visit with his kids?

[Chocolatelover87]

So my brother has two kids aged 7 and 13.

We live an hour apart and they don’t visit often but on the last two occasions there have been some issues.

The kids will often just wonder in all the bedrooms and go through all my things, they run riot around the house and the 7 year old broke two of my cats toys.

The house was almost flooded as one of the toilets is severely blocked ( the kids wouldn’t of known this ) but I thought thought they they would of used the toilet first seeing as it is an en-suite in my bedroom.

I find the visits very stressful because the parents don’t seem to discipline the kids and afterwards the kids will leave a huge mess leaving me to clean up after them and I have to keep watching the 7 year old as he is very naughty and loves breaking things.

I don’t particularly like my SIL as she is quite rude and bit of a stirrer.

My brother and his wife have just invited themselves over and I’m not sure if I should just make an excuse or address the issues but this is the 3rd time they have invited themselves over and I have made an excuse.

My brother and SIL also never invite me or my sister to there house and all these meetings seem to be at my house which I think is a bit unfair.

My 7 year old nephew is very naughty and he does test my brother’s patience.

In the past brother used to tell my nephew of but SIL would tell my brother off and accuse him of being strict.

Hence why the kids have no respect and are very badly behaved.

When nephew came last time and started throwing plates and food around in my lounge SIL just gave him a cuddle and a kiss and never disciplined him.

I think it’s odd to invite yourselves round to other people’s houses-we don’t really do that in my family. If I wanted to see my brother, I’d invite him to me.

If it’s fine for him to invite him to yours though, say no-you’ll come to him.

You think it's normal for a 13 year old and a 7 year old to wander into other people's bedrooms, go through their drawers, leave plates on the floor, never say thank you and to break the cat's toys? Do YOU have children? Because this is absolutely NOT normal behaviour!

In light of your recent updates OP if I were you I'd just go completely NC with them. You're about to become a mother yourself, you absolutely don't want to expose your own child to your brother's awful abusive behaviour. Block them on everything, and refuse to engage. If family members ask why, tell them the truth. You need to protect your own little family unit now.

When nephew came last time and started throwing plates and food around in my lounge SIL just gave him a cuddle and a kiss and never disciplined him.

No fuck that. Tell your brother you'd rather meet up at another location as the kids trash your house and you've had enough.

What can he say? It's the truth. Surely you can tell your own brother this?!

He can handle SILs crushing disappointment (which i don't think she'll feel).

When he says "we'll come round on Saturday" tell him no, that you don't want them to visit.

Just that. If he asks why, tell him it's because the children don't behave and he and his wife don't seem bothered about it.

What's the worst that could happen? He gets arsey? So what. Tell him the truth.

Nasty bastards, YANBU.

If it was my brother I'd say I'd love to see you, but the last few times the kids have broken things- as I don't have kids the house isn't child proof it's better for me to meet out and about than worry about spoiling their fun when they want to explore why don't we go to the playground and cafe there?

Arrange to meet elsewhere. At McDonald's or a food court in a shopping centre or somewhere like that. Tell them you're not in the mood to be clearing up the chaos the children leave behind.

Why are you letting your brother dictate to you? Given what you said about h8m kicking you out at 17, I’d do the same to him, kick him to the kerb!

I think it's a good time to think about whether you actually do want a relationship with your brother and his family, and if so, why, and how will it work?

ie what will work for you?

How did he throw you out of your parents house?

Some good advice being offered here.

I don’t particularly like my brother, for me it was never the same after he kicked me out at 17.

I find him quite aggressive and I don’t like how he is always taking the piss out of other family members.
We are both close to our sister who is stuck in the middle.

I think I kept the relationship going just to keep the peace but I really don’t ever want them to visit me again in my home.

I think if he does invite himself over again I will just tell him the truth.

Its clear from your post you are childless - so with respect its possible you don't have much tolerance for some normal (though be it - annoying) behaviours. I was the same before my kids I promise!

So do your 7 and 13 year old kids do things like root through other people’s bedroom drawers and take stuff? Bit embarrassing.

YANBU OP. Just tell them it doesn’t work for you. If they ask why say their children aren’t well-behaved in your home. Matter of fact, no need for confrontation. People who behave like this rely on others not wanting to hurt their feelings, which is exactly why you need to not care if it happens - they’ll get over it.

Maybe it's time to be straight with your brother then saying it really upset you to find your bedroom trashed, things broken and have played thrown and maybe a meet in a place where the kids can run around would be better....park, padded cell oh sorry soft play...

Would be quiet fun to go in and trash it though wouldn't it.

ok so your brother and you have some real deep-rooted issues. That might be affecting your feelings towards the kids as well. Of course they shouldnt go through your things, but as I said, kids are kids, and yes they should explain to them, and you should too, you are their aunt, it is your house and you are allowed to explain this to the children.

I asked if you had kids because it was very clear from your posts that you sound a bit inexperienced with kids as per your expectations. To be clear I am not saying kids should be allowed to run riot, but I am saying things like accidentally breaking your cat’s toy isnt really a biggie. Going through your bedroom - again lots of kids love going to secret places, but parents should tell them that is not acceptable. So it is not really the kids fault , they are just acting normal - it is the parents. When I go somewhere with my kids I half expect them to do this stuff, so warn them in advance, keep an eye on them, tell them off if they are being inappropriate, and at some point they get it, my 8 year old did :D I equally get uncomfortable with people who have no experience and expect children to sit at the table for three hours without talking - that’s why parents hang with parents a lot I guess.

Food on the floor - unfortunately kids are rather clumsy, and while they might try not to be, accidents do happen and while it is annoying to be scraping food off the floor, I would never be upset at the kids for this, unless they do it on purpose and not by accident. Now that you are pregnant, you will know what I mean in a couple of months/years.

your brother sounds like an arsehole in general, and kudos to you for being the bigger person and bearing him. Dont invite him to your house anymore, but my suggestion is try to see the kids as separate personalities. Maybe even develop a relationship with them if you can.

as per the suggestion of the pp, when yours becomes a toddler, I suggest bringing him/her to your brothers house equipped with glitter and play dough to pass the time, and enjoy the scene :D

no sorry that doesn't work for me - is your answer

Hi there defo is some deep routed issues between me and my brother.
I can see your points of views on quite a few things.

The thing is the parents never discipline the kids or tell them off.
When they used to visit the parents would just be talking and let the kids run riot.
At no point did they ever check on the kids.

On the last occasion I brought the kids garden toys especially to play with to keep them out of the house, to no avail unfortunately.

The 7 year old will deliberately throw plates on the floor, and I will repeatedly tell him not to do such and such but he will still do it.

I will be moving closer to my parents at some stage and so that also means closer to my brother who will no doubt be asking me to babysit the kids as that is what he does to my parents a lot.

I defo do not want the 7 year old near the baby as he is quite aggressive with people/animals in general.

Im not sure how I would go about building a relationship with the kids to be honest, it would mean frequent contact with my brother and SIL.

Thank you for your kind words and advice.

On another note Mumsnet is very useful and great for gaining other people’s views/advice/opinions on things.

It sounds like your brother is continuing to bully you in a different way still. Allowing his kids to trash your house and inviting themselves over unwanted is domineering and intimating behaviour, given the history. And given your history, it's a firm no thanks, no way. They should not be in (and disrespectful of) your personal and safe space. It's a continuous attempt to have power and control over you. He threw you out!! Why should they come to you?!!

If he asks for a babysitter just say no your children don't listen to me and do not respect boundaries once you sort that I'll think about it.

Bit of a drip feed there OP, re your brother’s abusive behaviour when you were younger!!

In that case I don’t think you should try too hard, keep them at a distance. People like that don’t change just because you pull them up on their behaviour, he may even get worse.

But practice saying ‘No.’ Also practice not giving a reason why - ‘I can’t do that’ is enough, doesn’t allow wiggle room for him to tell you why your reason isn’t good enough.

The whole thing is dysfunction then, if your parents allowed him to treat you that way and your sister is on good terms with him. Watch out for yourself first, try not to damage other relationships as much as possible as that will hurt you, but having been in situations with very toxic relatives I can tell you there’s no real gain in having a ‘close’ relationship with them - it just means everything happens on their terms, so keep a distance.

@Chocolatelover87 : you say "I will be moving closer to my parents at some stage and so that also means closer to my brother who will no doubt be asking me to babysit the kids as that is what he does to my parents a lot."

Why do you have to move closer to your parents and your brother? Surely there must be homes that would be close to your parents but in the opposite direction to where your brother lives, unless he already lives around the corner from your parents?

You can politely decline any sort of requests for babysitting by stating "Just because I'm moving closer to Mum & Dad, doesn't mean that I'll be available for babysitting. I have activities that I'm involved with and I'm not giving them up. Also my time is mine to decide what to do with it, so I think it's probably best for you to look elsewhere for a babysitter".