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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think my bereavement counsellor was out of order saying this?

175 replies

TryingToGrieve · 26/07/2023 13:22

‘It sounds like you idolize (your dead baby) and prefer him to (your living toddler). All the time you spent visiting him in the mortuary makes it sound like you were trying to escape being with your older one at home.’

She did preface this with, ‘I hope you don’t mind me saying this but…’. Yet AIBU to think WTAF?

OP posts:
Twatalert · 26/07/2023 16:25

Hi OP,

Counsellers do get it wrong and I think she needs to hear how it made you feel. I do find it early for her to say anything like that in the third session, when she is probably still getting to know you and your internal struggles with grief. Also, it is reasonable for you to sometimes stop in your tracks after she said something that gets you thinking, but you sound a lot more hurt and outraged (as you say) and for me this is a red flag. We go to counselling because we are off balance, but your instincts still work and not everything you feel needs to be addressed/is exaggerated etc.

Even if she felt she needed to somehow say this, she could have done it with a lot more tact, perhaps given herself more time to lead up to this. It does sound like a bit of a bomb shell to drop to a beraved parent in a third counselling session.

Viviennemary · 26/07/2023 16:27

She was absolutely out of order. Maybe she should have asked you why you made so many visits but on the other hand she certajnly should not have been making you feel bad and guilty which she did. Get a different counsellor. You have been through an unbelievably tough time and certainly shouldnt have to deal with being upset by what a counsellor says.

FluffyFlannery · 26/07/2023 16:30

How awful! YANBU! Who on earth does she think she is!

AgnesMiall · 26/07/2023 16:34

I'm so sorry for your loss. Anyone who has been through this would understand your actions and certainly wouldn't judge them like this.

You need to find a different counsellor.

Complain if you feel able op. I had to make a complaint about a bereavement counsellor (related to baby loss) who was very insensitive and I believe she no longer works for the organisation - it's a big relief that other grieving parents won't be on the receiving end of this (I believe someone else had also complained).

Thischarmlessgirl · 26/07/2023 16:34

As a bereaved parent and a psychotherapist I am shocked, it feels wrong on many levels and I hope you feel you can tell her how you feel, it’s a hurtful and misplaced intervention. I’m so sorry.

OLDERME · 26/07/2023 16:37

@NotBotheredAnymore This is such an intuitive post. Thank you.

However, 3 weeks into counselling is no time to challenge the 10 days a bereaved mother spent in the mortuary. This sounds like the counsellor lloks up the next chapter in the book before the session. Personally, I would find a group, rather than a counsellor. I am unsure why you went for counselling in the first place. Did you believe that something was wrong in the way you were prcessing your grief? Are you concerned about your other child. All love to you op.

ElephantGrey101 · 26/07/2023 16:44

TryingToGrieve · 26/07/2023 13:53

Very thought-provoking responses. Thanks everyone.

To me it feels unfair because there was only very limited time to visit my baby in the mortuary before he was buried and I wanted to make the most of every opportunity. Whereas hopefully I’ll have the rest of my life to spend time with the older one.

Yet she kept on about how ‘a dead baby who just lies still in your arms is so much easier than a live toddler who is all over the place.’ I had honestly never thought to compare the two like that myself.

I think that she was being very unfair. You were absolutely right that you only had that time with your baby. It is not going to affect your toddler who won’t remember this at all.

Councelling is helpful in letting you work through your feelings. This woman is not helpful to you as she is making you feel guilty for feelings that you are not even feeling.

OhComeOnFFS · 26/07/2023 16:45

I'm really shocked she said that to you - I would have found that incredibly hurtful, judgemental and cruel.

Of course you wanted to spend as much time as you could with your baby - that's perfectly natural. To say what she did on your third visit to her, when you lost your baby within the last three months is so awful.

I wouldn't feel she had an empathy whatsoever.

Enko · 26/07/2023 16:54

TryingToGrieve · 26/07/2023 14:18

Those who mentioned therapy being stuck and perhaps needing moving along, this was only our third session.

After 14 weeks it's early to be dealing with the grief. I work as a BSW myself and if I get a client this early into grieving it's more about " walking the journey" with them. Allowing emotions to be spoken and such.

However, I also agree that context is everything and there are times when a "shock" question can be helpful in counselling. As I don't know the context (and I am not encouraging you to share that either) I won't comment on if it was helpful she said it.

The bigger question is "How do you feel about it?"

Can you get past this and move along to other areas?

Could you be vulnerable with her after this comment?

Can you feel safe and held within the environment she is offering?

If the answer to those questions is yes I can be vulnerable and feel safe and be able to move to other areas of my grief with her. Then you can have the conversation about how it made you feel.
If the answer is no. Then it's time to find a new therapist.

I am so sorry you are going through this experience.

Rainiestsummer · 26/07/2023 16:55

Isn't this too early for bereavement counselling? I thought you had to wait 6 months or so.
I've known five counsellors in my life, three were great people and two I wouldn't let counsel my cat. You did nothing wrong Op. don't fo back to this person.

noctu · 26/07/2023 16:55

Chartered psychologist - chiming in with PPs to say that she was out of line to say this, and you have every right to bring this up with her.

Allthecheeseplease · 26/07/2023 16:57

I agree with people who say context is important. One sentence out of context from a session can be damning.

However I also agree with the people who said that you need to tell her. Honesty is so important in therapy.

I am so so sorry for your loss. I can't even imagine the grief.

Enko · 26/07/2023 16:58

Rainiestsummer · 26/07/2023 16:55

Isn't this too early for bereavement counselling? I thought you had to wait 6 months or so.
I've known five counsellors in my life, three were great people and two I wouldn't let counsel my cat. You did nothing wrong Op. don't fo back to this person.

There are no specific rule. Some people find it really helpful to have someone to support them through the early shock and dealings of grief. However, that is more about " walking the journey with them" aka allowing a space where they can express their feelings and feel safe and not feel they have to behave in a particular way.

Later on is often suggested as that is when you are able to work on coping mechanisms.

However, it is not a no go to go to grief counselling early on. Some people find it very beneficial .

CoteDOpale · 26/07/2023 16:58

What an astronomical cunt.

No-one that tactless should be working in a healthcare setting.

I’m so sorry for your loss, OP and good on you for getting some help in dealing with it.
From reading all your posts it sounds like she’s not the right one for you. I hope you find a better one, you absolutely deserve the best support.

Rainiestsummer · 26/07/2023 17:05

Thank you @Enko I think it was a GP who said that to me - as in, you're not needing any extra help to "manage" your grief early on as whatever you feel is normal. Or, she didn't want to have to refer me to someone! Who knows

willowthecat · 26/07/2023 17:07

I think you need another counsellor . There is nothing wrong with examining difficult emotions but this sounds abusive and completely wrong !

Enko · 26/07/2023 17:09

Rainiestsummer · 26/07/2023 17:05

Thank you @Enko I think it was a GP who said that to me - as in, you're not needing any extra help to "manage" your grief early on as whatever you feel is normal. Or, she didn't want to have to refer me to someone! Who knows

On the NHS it is more solution focused so supporting to find coping methods etc. They need to be able to show that there was an improvement. So your GP could very well have a "rule" that says not before 6 months. However, that is specific to their area not specific to bereavement counselling in general.

Also, 6 months is not always a good time some clients are not able to deal with their grief for a year or two it is just too much to cope with. Others are very ready at 6 months ...

Rainiestsummer · 26/07/2023 17:11

Thanks that is helpful

Cornishclio · 26/07/2023 17:12

That seems shocking to me given you had only 10 days at the mortuary with your baby. Obviously you are still grieving and always will but are you also present for your toddler now? How old is he/she?

So sorry for your loss. Was your baby a girl or boy and did you name him/her?

I wonder if it is too early to see a bereavement counsellor. Was this your choice?

MillWood85 · 26/07/2023 17:22

I'm so sorry for your loss. My second baby was stillborn 27 years ago, and I still remember that morning with him in my arms as if it was yesterday. It was the only time we had, and incredibly precious. I didn't see him after the post mortem because I wanted that memory of him to be my only one.

No one has the right to tell you that the way you are grieving is right or wrong. I've recently had bereavement counselling after losing my Dad, and had a wonderful counsellor via the hospice who made me feel that everything I was feeling was valid because it was my feeling. Not anyone elses.

I would ask this person if they've ever held one of their children when they were in a mortuary. Then they can judge you.

Thegoodbadandugly · 26/07/2023 17:27

NotAncient · 26/07/2023 16:05

It has been 14 weeks. It would be more abnormal for OP not to be wrapped up in grief still after losing her baby.

Show quote history

I haddnt realised it was that soon so I do apologise.

bpirockin · 26/07/2023 17:28

I agree with Allthelightwecannotsee76, although the counsellor's comment could have been put more gently, it is only by going through the discomfort and examining it, that you grow and find a way to move forward. As you've had a good working relationship with her, let her know how you feel at your next appointment. She'll have had time to think on it as well, and you may be surprised what comes out of challenging her.

I spent years paying a counsellor and changing very little, then moved to another who might have seemed quite harsh to others, but it was way more productive. She's only human, and maybe she misread the situation, thought you were ready for something more challenging, or maybe she is more used to seeing people further along in the process. All she needs now is to be reminded that you are not.

I'm so sorry for what you've been through, and hope that you can find a way to work through this jarring comment in what seems to have previously been a helpful relationship.

PurpleWisteria1 · 26/07/2023 17:33

Absoltely awful for the therapist to say any of this. Awful. You either need to find someone else or at least tell them how their words have made you feel.
Just be careful who you pick for your councillor. A family member of mine re trained (from a completely unrelated job) to be a councillor. They did a 3 day course. I know this person very well and I can tell you they are would be the very last person I would want to council me with anything. Advice totally off, lack of empathy, can be quite a bully, no understanding of others, quick to anger. Honestly it’s quite worrying how anyone can call themselves a councillor in 3 days and have very vulnerable people through their doors seeking help.

PurplePansy05 · 26/07/2023 17:39

Context is everything. We don't have it, we don't know what you've told her.

What type of therapy is it?

Perhaps she listened to you and made comments aimed at provoking some thoughts or responses in you that you haven't yet verbalised. This isn't always comfortable but it's part of the healing process.

I had grief therapy post baby loss and found it helpful and compassionate (talking therapy), but also challenging in how I had to have a look at myself and deal with things that I perhaps didn't want to deal with before.

You are very early on. I think deep breaths and next time share your thoughts with her. If you do not benefit from the sessions, find a different therapist.

PurplePansy05 · 26/07/2023 17:43

Also to the posters commenting on the lenght and unhealthiness of the grieving process, you are mistaken. Grief after losing a baby never ends, you learn to build your life around it over time.

Grieving is a healthy reaction too. It's normal. However, some people don't have the right support and sadly they are struggling to build their lives back in this new reality.