Page 8 | To not side with Sis over her ex

PrFi · 2023-07-26T10:09:39+00:00

My sis & her ex (bil) were together 22 years & about 2 years ago they separated, they never married & have 2 DD 17 & 19. Prior to their separation we were always together as a foursome & saw each other several times a week plus my DH & he are very close friends. Their split was amicable & mutual, both just decided that relationship had run its course but we were all naturally upset about it. Bil moved into a flat that he owns & sis stayed in house, the house is bil’s (inherited from his parents) but he wanted kids to stay in their home so he moved out. My sis doesn’t work & bil has been paying bills, all child expenses, her credit card, her private pension & healthcare since he left but he now says once DD leaves for uni this will all stop as he’s not bank rolling her anymore & he has told my sis that once youngest DD turns 18 & leaves for uni he wants his house back. He has also met someone else which I did know about but didn’t say anything to sis as he said wasn’t sure how serious it was plus it’s not my business. Anyway all hell has broken loose now & my sis is threatening all sorts but main problem is that she has asked me to cut him off completely, he’s not to come to our home or speak to us on phone, we’re not to meet up socially or invite him to any functions etc. I don’t agree we should as he is my niece’s Dad & has done absolutely nothing wrong & he is very much part of our lives still but if I don’t I could lose my sis..I’m torn but I don’t think she’s right to expect this from us

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 26/07/2023 14:36

Yes your SIL is out of order and needs to get a job.

But honestly why did she become dependent on him without getting married? When will people learn not to do this?

I think in his shoes I would look at what is fair in terms of giving her some sort of settlement. But she is stupid not to have used these two years to start her career.

Changedname23 · 26/07/2023 14:38

PrFi · 26/07/2023 14:33

I don’t need to mention every woman that he’s casually seeing, there were quite a few after the first year. If it was a serious relationship then I would have & it’s her attitude & behaviour I don’t like

Show quote history

How come you know about every casual relationship he has had? Why is he telling you this? Has he no cop on at all. He's a right dick.

sandyhappypeople · 26/07/2023 14:39

MargaretBall · 26/07/2023 13:14

Be wary of the charming man.Your loyalties lie with your sister here OP, things have changed and you need to move on. Perhaps take some time to think about why you are casting him in the role as the good guy in all of this, given that the relationship ended by mutual agreement . He may indeed be the personification of all that is good but it may also be that you exasperated by her head in the sand approach , jealous of her previous good fortune or in thrall to her ex. I’ve seen this classic manipulation before , where the in-laws rally around the ex, including the ex in family events, and blame the sibling.

My sympathy is with your sister. Yes she has been very foolish for not marrying if she was a stay at home parent ( assuming that her ex would have agreed of course- he may have been protecting his assets ). However that goes both ways, she was foolish but he assumed financial responsibility . Your DSis was I assume a full time mother and her future earning capacity is likely to be very low having been out of the work force for so long. It’s not easy to snap your fingers and find a job when you’ve been at home for so long- confidence and skills are likely to be low.

It’s likely she will need to move , support her in up skilling , she could probably do with counselling/ life coaching . She should take legal advice- I’m not in the U.K. but in Ireland there is a redress scheme to protect a financially dependent member of the couple if the long-term cohabiting ends.

Why is everyone assuming he won't do right by her? He understandably wants his parents house back when the kids are old enough/at uni, but he's offered her the flat so it doesn't sound like he's opposed to sharing some of their assets. He was well within his rights to stop paying for everything 2 years ago but he hasn't, so that doesn't correlate with the image of him being the selfish bastard that some posters are trying to imply.

She obviously thought she could keep the house, but it was an inheritance, not a joint purchase, so I'm not sure the 'she stayed at home, so he could go to work' line really is applicable here? It was never hers, the only thing she should morally have claim to is anything they've built between them as a couple/family.

Ultimately she's had chance since the kids started secondary school to upskill herself, go to work, not be financially dependent on him, but she's chosen not too, because she liked the lifestyle too much.. very risky strategy.

Original poster

PrFi · 26/07/2023 14:40

Changedname23 · 26/07/2023 14:38

How come you know about every casual relationship he has had? Why is he telling you this? Has he no cop on at all. He's a right dick.

Show quote history

Because he’s best friends with my husband & he tells him. Why is he a dick because after 22 years with one partner he was making most of being single? My sis did the same & waited lot less than a year, good for both of them

OP posts:

Hankunamatata · 26/07/2023 14:41

Iv read this thread and initially thought she is being a cheeky cow but thinking about it if he were genuine and that wealthy he should sign over the flat to her as though they were married. He knows he had a lucky escape financially, he could afford to give her a property as a place to start.

Dacquoises · 26/07/2023 14:42

What were their housing arrangements before the inheritance? We're they renting or sharing a mortgage on a property if she was working?

LAMPS1 · 26/07/2023 14:43

Your DS’s demands that you and DH both cut him off completely, don’t talk to him on the phone, don’t meet up with him socially and don’t invite him are crazy. No need to tell her that you aren’t complying though, as she is reeling in shock at this wake up call, and ranting for now. (Easier for her to get angry than to face facts calmly.) Just be discreet about it if and when you see him.
It’s not your decision whether he is invited to family parties or not …unless, of course, you are hosting and I’m sure your BIL would understand if you didn’t host him if you are hosting your DS at the same time.
Im sure your DS will calm down and realise it would be good to take him up on his offer of the 3 bed flat for now until she sorts herself out. But she obviously needs lots of encouragement from her family and friends to see the sense in this. Maybe her ex could be persuaded to sell it to her at a good deal if she has enough savings. I’m sure he will look after his DDs until they are self sufficient so, with a roof over her head all she needs to do is get back into work to support herself.
I would be more concerned about helping her take up his offer of the flat with far fewer running costs, before he withdraws it altogether, than worrying about her silly request to cut him off.

Original poster

PrFi · 26/07/2023 14:43

Dacquoises · 26/07/2023 14:42

What were their housing arrangements before the inheritance? We're they renting or sharing a mortgage on a property if she was working?

She was renting & moved into his mortgaged house, she was never added to the mortgage

OP posts:

sandyhappypeople · 26/07/2023 14:43

Hankunamatata · 26/07/2023 14:41

Iv read this thread and initially thought she is being a cheeky cow but thinking about it if he were genuine and that wealthy he should sign over the flat to her as though they were married. He knows he had a lucky escape financially, he could afford to give her a property as a place to start.

According to OP he was offering her the flat.. she wants the house though so has now cut off all communication with him in protest and is trying to get everyone else to do the same.

Blinkingbonkers · 26/07/2023 14:44

I agree your sister needs to regain her independence and find a job (and crucially accept the realities of her situation) but I absolutely also think that she should be given the flat/similar. She must be 50ish, no assets, no career - that’s a very scary place to be. If he’s prepared to leave their mother in significantly reduced circumstances I don’t reckon your nieces will be that close to him for that long (unless they are all about the cash…in which case they’re not very nice either!). Your posts do read like you’re enjoying her downfall @PrFi ….if you dislike her that much why are you wanting to save your relationship. Whilst she needs to join the real world I feel very sorry for her.

Dacquoises · 26/07/2023 14:45

So did she contribute towards his mortgage when they moved in together?

Changedname23 · 26/07/2023 14:47

PrFi · 26/07/2023 14:40

Because he’s best friends with my husband & he tells him. Why is he a dick because after 22 years with one partner he was making most of being single? My sis did the same & waited lot less than a year, good for both of them

Show quote history

You are his ex sister in law. Why would you want to know about all his relationships? It's just so overinvolved and OTT.

I get on extremely well with my BIL, as does my OH. However, there is no way I would be entertaining chat about casual relationships. Its so disrespectful and disloyal. I think another poster was correct, there is some sort creepy glee in your tone and attitude. By all means tell.your sister to cop on and get a job but the rest of your behaviour is seriously crap.

Original poster

PrFi · 26/07/2023 14:51

Blinkingbonkers · 26/07/2023 14:44

I agree your sister needs to regain her independence and find a job (and crucially accept the realities of her situation) but I absolutely also think that she should be given the flat/similar. She must be 50ish, no assets, no career - that’s a very scary place to be. If he’s prepared to leave their mother in significantly reduced circumstances I don’t reckon your nieces will be that close to him for that long (unless they are all about the cash…in which case they’re not very nice either!). Your posts do read like you’re enjoying her downfall @PrFi ….if you dislike her that much why are you wanting to save your relationship. Whilst she needs to join the real world I feel very sorry for her.

Well I didn’t intend for them to come across that way I’m just drained by the what seems like constant griping & moaning from my sis about this situation she feels she’s been unfairly left in. She calls & texts several times a day to check that we’re not letting him in the house or I better not have made arrangements with him, I hope you’ve told him what you think of him..it’s draining. I guess I feel that if she acknowledged that she’s had 2 years to get herself sorted but has done f all about it plus the fact that rather than accept/understand the situation she feels that she is indefinitely entitled to the house/credit card/lifestyle rather than try & negotiate a compromise with him & ultimate get something she deserves & needs she instead wants us all to bad mouth him & cut him off..like that’s going to get her what she wants. She’s already in a bad enough position without making it worse for herself.

OP posts:

Changedname23 · 26/07/2023 14:52

PrFi · 26/07/2023 14:51

Well I didn’t intend for them to come across that way I’m just drained by the what seems like constant griping & moaning from my sis about this situation she feels she’s been unfairly left in. She calls & texts several times a day to check that we’re not letting him in the house or I better not have made arrangements with him, I hope you’ve told him what you think of him..it’s draining. I guess I feel that if she acknowledged that she’s had 2 years to get herself sorted but has done f all about it plus the fact that rather than accept/understand the situation she feels that she is indefinitely entitled to the house/credit card/lifestyle rather than try & negotiate a compromise with him & ultimate get something she deserves & needs she instead wants us all to bad mouth him & cut him off..like that’s going to get her what she wants. She’s already in a bad enough position without making it worse for herself.

Show quote history

Wonder is she invited over for a drink once a week......

ScribblingPixie · 26/07/2023 14:54

She was renting & moved into his mortgaged house, she was never added to the mortgage

So he's held on to his money right from the start while she was thinking she would be secure financially for life? He must have led her to believe she would be or she'd have been keener on marriage.

Original poster

PrFi · 26/07/2023 14:54

Changedname23 · 26/07/2023 14:47

You are his ex sister in law. Why would you want to know about all his relationships? It's just so overinvolved and OTT.

I get on extremely well with my BIL, as does my OH. However, there is no way I would be entertaining chat about casual relationships. Its so disrespectful and disloyal. I think another poster was correct, there is some sort creepy glee in your tone and attitude. By all means tell.your sister to cop on and get a job but the rest of your behaviour is seriously crap.

Show quote history

I don’t want to know, but sometimes my dh would come back after seeing him & say ‘he’s seeing some other woman now’ or ‘he’s staying with another woman tonight’ just comments like that husbands & wives do chat like that it’s not ott at all.
No I don’t think she’s entitled to what she’s asking for hence why I think she’s unreasonable

OP posts:

whumpthereitis · 26/07/2023 14:54

Blinkingbonkers · 26/07/2023 14:44

I agree your sister needs to regain her independence and find a job (and crucially accept the realities of her situation) but I absolutely also think that she should be given the flat/similar. She must be 50ish, no assets, no career - that’s a very scary place to be. If he’s prepared to leave their mother in significantly reduced circumstances I don’t reckon your nieces will be that close to him for that long (unless they are all about the cash…in which case they’re not very nice either!). Your posts do read like you’re enjoying her downfall @PrFi ….if you dislike her that much why are you wanting to save your relationship. Whilst she needs to join the real world I feel very sorry for her.

Their mother made her own choices, and isn’t the responsibility of their father.

The nieces may in fact be perfectly lovely people who love and have a good relationship their dad, and have no interest in getting involved in their parents fights. They shouldn’t be expected to get involved, or judged as bad people if they don’t.

Notonthestairs · 26/07/2023 14:54

The Ops husband & BIL are best friends.

Hardly a surprise that the Op would know about BILs new relationships.

Just as she knows about her sisters subsequent relationships.

I'd hope the Op wasn't reporting back on those. It's not really for the Op to intervene in either direction.

They've been split for 3 years. Both of parties should be developing any new relationship they enjoy.

Ideally he'd offer the flat for her lifetime - after which it could be left to their joint children.
It would provide Ops sister with some long term security and still be kept within the family.
Obviously she'd have to accept that of course.

Original poster

PrFi · 26/07/2023 14:56

ScribblingPixie · 26/07/2023 14:54

She was renting & moved into his mortgaged house, she was never added to the mortgage

So he's held on to his money right from the start while she was thinking she would be secure financially for life? He must have led her to believe she would be or she'd have been keener on marriage.

He hasn’t led her to believe anything. Obviously when he inherited the house she knew it was his house & the house he mortgaged was sold & whatever money he made was spent between them as a family

OP posts:

JohnnyYenSetHimselfOnFireAgain · 26/07/2023 14:58

Changedname23 · 26/07/2023 14:47

You are his ex sister in law. Why would you want to know about all his relationships? It's just so overinvolved and OTT.

I get on extremely well with my BIL, as does my OH. However, there is no way I would be entertaining chat about casual relationships. Its so disrespectful and disloyal. I think another poster was correct, there is some sort creepy glee in your tone and attitude. By all means tell.your sister to cop on and get a job but the rest of your behaviour is seriously crap.

Show quote history

"The rest of your behaviour is seriously crap."

Absolute bollocks.

ScribblingPixie · 26/07/2023 14:59

So they lived together for 20 years & had two children together without him promising her anything, even in intimate discussion? How the heck would you know?

Riverlee · 26/07/2023 15:02

I presume when they moved into the inherited house they thought they’d be together forever.

It’s very telling that you say ‘the house he mortgaged’. I presume they made decesions together about how they would live their married life. Yes, she has been naive, but it was a life they agreed to together. Now he’s leaving her up the swanny without a paddle, so to speak.

i appreciate you’re worn down by your sisters hysterics and some of her unfair demands, but aren’t you a little concerned for her? How would you like to loose your home in your forties/fifties? You don’t seem to like her much.

Riverlee · 26/07/2023 15:03

Sorry, not married life, but life together.

WomblingTree86 · 26/07/2023 15:07

You say that he has done nothing wrong but he's actually taking advantage of the fact that they weren't married which isn't that nice. They were together for 22 years and she probably did a lot more than him in bringing up his children. If he had married her he would have to give her half the house. She clearly didn't realise that being unmarried put her at a massive disadvantage but I bet he did.

Nellynoowhoareyou · 26/07/2023 15:07

Maybe you could give him a wider berth for a bit while your sis cools off. If he is decent then surely if you explained he’d understand. I don’t think your DH needs to back off though.