To not side with Sis over her ex

[PrFi]

My sis & her ex (bil) were together 22 years & about 2 years ago they separated, they never married & have 2 DD 17 & 19. Prior to their separation we were always together as a foursome & saw each other several times a week plus my DH & he are very close friends. Their split was amicable & mutual, both just decided that relationship had run its course but we were all naturally upset about it. Bil moved into a flat that he owns & sis stayed in house, the house is bil’s (inherited from his parents) but he wanted kids to stay in their home so he moved out. My sis doesn’t work & bil has been paying bills, all child expenses, her credit card, her private pension & healthcare since he left but he now says once DD leaves for uni this will all stop as he’s not bank rolling her anymore & he has told my sis that once youngest DD turns 18 & leaves for uni he wants his house back. He has also met someone else which I did know about but didn’t say anything to sis as he said wasn’t sure how serious it was plus it’s not my business. Anyway all hell has broken loose now & my sis is threatening all sorts but main problem is that she has asked me to cut him off completely, he’s not to come to our home or speak to us on phone, we’re not to meet up socially or invite him to any functions etc. I don’t agree we should as he is my niece’s Dad & has done absolutely nothing wrong & he is very much part of our lives still but if I don’t I could lose my sis..I’m torn but I don’t think she’s right to expect this from us

they separated 2 years ago so in that time she has been living an expense free life when he was under no obligation to do that

I agree with the other poster who said that you are validating your sister's ex rather than encouraging him to give her a settlement that gives her permanent security. It may be true that men are 'under no obligation' towards the mother of their children' if they haven't married, but it doesn't sound great to hear another woman say it, especially when they're talking about their own sister.

She "stayed in the home" looking after their children which probably meant it was a lot easier for him to do his job and become a high earner. I don't think that's being “bankrolled.”

You’re missing my point, it’s not that I don’t think she should get something (he hasn’t refused to give her anything) it’s just the attitude she has that how dare he stop paying my monthly 5k bill & all my household expenses..she doesn’t appreciate how lucky she has been over last 2 years & given that she knew it would come to an end at some point at no time has she started to take responsibility for her own finances

Considering he could easily afford childcare, I doubt it was any easier for him. It’s not like she hasn’t been well compensated for gladly giving up work for two decades, and he also hired in help for that.

Unless he could afford round the clock nannies I doubt that paying for childcare would make life just as easy. Anyway, I'm a bit sceptical of this whole scenario so will bow out.

You’re missing my point, it’s not that I don’t think she should get something (he hasn’t refused to give her anything) it’s just the attitude she has that how dare he stop paying my monthly 5k bill & all my household expenses..she doesn’t appreciate how lucky she has been over last 2 years & given that she knew it would come to an end at some point at no time has she started to take responsibility for her own finances

No, I haven't missed your point. I hear you. But I'm saying that, setting her infuriating behaviour aside, she's your sister and you need to do all you can to help her get her out of this situation with security that's going to last her her lifetime, ie a permanent home of her own not one that she's 'allowed' to stay in for however long suits her ex. She's in denial but she's going to be forced to take responsibility for her own finances, and it'll be tough for her. But for her sake and her children's sake, do what you can for her.

Would have to compare how much that would cost, versus how much he’s spent on his ex for two decades (longer than he would have needed to pay for childcare).

If they were married then surely the large sums of money the ex seems to have spent on her since the split - the accomodation, bills paid, 10s of thousands on her credit cards, generous pension provision, private health care, paying 100% of everything for their kids including uni fees and cars, etc etc as well as further offer of a 3 bed flat rent free all as OP as mentioned would all be taken into account in any legal finacial settlement and it well be that he would not legally have to pay her another penny.

I am usually on the woman's side in this sort of thing but the ex seems to have been incredibly generous. Teenagers might need nagging and advice but most of us hold down a job at least part of the week when our kids are in secondary school. She has not contributed to the raising of her children at all moneywise. I am not denying a mother's contribution especially pre-school and primary age but she can really have little to complain about for the last few years.

Many seems also to have weird knowledge of OP's like or dislike of her sister. They are obviously quite close or OP would not know what she does. Many also seem unable to comprehend OP's DH being friends with the ex. Would you give up your best friend of several decades because she had split from your husband's brother? How would you feel if your husband tried to impose that split on you? Some people just don't think stuff through.

I know lots of men who can afford childcare but prefer it when a woman does it for free for various reasons. And a mother at home provides stability and a constant for everyone to rely on, nurturing the kids, I wonder who kept on top of school and all of that domestic management unless you will tell us she did none of that or that it can easily be outsourced. I’m finding it hard to believe you are her sister tbh you sound more like her sis in law 😂 but then again in my community a woman’s own family throwing her under the bus is fairly common so I guess I’m looking at it differently.

I'm sure OP will be along to say that her "sister" didn't do any of the household management either. I think she sounds more like the new woman than the sister.

Oh dear, WobblingTree86. That would make a lot of sense.

The OP wanted us to tear strips off her sister I think. That’s it.

Your sister is a nightmare.
Do not bend over backwards, keep the relationship with your BIL and ignore her tantrums.

She has a lot of growing up to do and you all have to stop enabling her immature behaviour.

That’s would be a brilliant plot twist 😂

Well I’m not but anyway..I spoke to my ex bil about my sis not getting anything byway of property & he said that he would have sorted something for her but he wasn’t going to give her his house but would have offered her enough to get a flat but since she threw him out when he said he wanted the house back next year he can’t talk to her anymore so if she wants to behave like a brat then that’s on her. Our mum spoke to her about her demands re cutting him off & although she agrees she massively overreacted she still doesn’t understand why after supporting her these years after separation he has just decided to cut her off. I’m not cutting him off & I told her that but I have also said that unless he provides a permanent home or means to acquire one then I can’t see how I (cannot & will not dictate to DH) can maintain any sort of relationship with him similar to the one we had previously.

I'm glad you stuck up for your sister, OP. Her ex has had two years to make sure she and their children have a permanent secure home together, but he hasn't. He says it's because of the way she behaved recently but that doesn't really ring true as they got on fine before he told her she had to leave the family home. I hope he thinks about what you've said and does the right thing.

I’m glad that the voting (even if not the comments) have shown that most people agree with you OP.
Your BIL has been more than reasonable, and your Sis is very stupid and entitled. I feel sorry for her (in the way I’d feel sorry for a puppy that bit his own tail) but your attitude all through this thread has been correct.

And I think that going on past history, that BIL is very likely (even if just for your nieces’ sake) to continue to be generous with her living standards going forward. Unless she continues to be so nasty and ungrateful…
I guess your job now, is to try and get her to see sense…? Good luck with that.

Very well put.

Shame on all those posters who cannot see this…

@PrFi
btw, what does your oldest niece make of all this? And your parents…?

Did your Sis actually plan to ensure that at least one of her DDs lived with her into her 30s to ensure she always had a home? Did anyone ever ask her about her future plans for when they both left home, or has she always just put her head in the sand?

I agree that morally he has an obligation to look after her - but he has been doing that. Generously. Now BIL has given her 6/7 months notice of the change (from now) or > 2.5 years (if either of them had thought to clarify the Uni situation at time of the split), AND offered her time and a place to help her move on. He has provided a decent pension, and she has significant savings.
Who knows what else he may have planned to settle on her? But being rude about him and resentful of a new GF may now change his mind.

I do hope you can talk her into apologising for her attitude. She doesn’t know a) how good she has had it all those years (together and since splitting) or b) how lucky she is now!

My oldest niece is a bit ambivalent about it but she doesn’t want to get involved as ultimately she knows her Mum won’t end up destitute & our parents are the same as me..think she’s had a good life over last couple of years but want him to at least give her a home. One thing we don’t agree on is giving her an allowance’ but that’s a different issue. She admitted to our mum that her reaction was unreasonable so hopefully she will come around

She admitted to our mum that her reaction was unreasonable so hopefully she will come around

suspect she is still in shock - and reeling from new GF news (didn’t it all happen at same time?) - and hopefully she just needs time to calm down and let it sink in

Glad it seems BIL and your DH will still be friends though

Your posts read like you hate her and love him, I suspect she’s picked up on this and probably feels similar too. You speak about her with a shocking and uncomfortable to read lack of empathy, yet seem to be very empathetic to BIL. It’s odd. And this will be fuelling a lot of her defensiveness.

I feel a bit sorry for her really, he’s got a lovely new girlfriend, two properties, owns a business and is wealthy, probably a decent pension pot, somewhere to immediately house the girls, and the support of her family.

She’s got no job or career, likely would need retraining to get back into the workplace, small to no pension, no immediate housing for herself let alone the girls, no partner and seemingly very little support from her family who are rallying round her ex.

I’m not at all saying how she’s acting is okay fyi. But I can to some extent understand why she might feel bitter and defensive and why she might be lashing out at people. Could you not be more compassionate of the situation? She’s likely depressed and scared, people who act angry and bluster a lot in difficult situations, usually beneath that is a very scared and worried person.

I don’t agree that you should cut BIL off but I do think you should put her first, I certainly wouldn’t be having him at family parties where she will be. And I’d ask DH to pull back from having him in the house for the time being. At least until the dust settles.

Well done for sticking up for sister.

Had a thought earlier, do you think new girlfriend is pushing the change? If they split two years ago, and bil had several gf since, how long has he been with his current gf? Has she smelt the money, and wants a bit of what sister is getting? I may be doing her a big disservice, but a wealthy divorcee is an attractive proposition to some.

She should sell some stuff from the home she has helped make for the past few decades. She is going to need the cash.

Sorry how has she helped make the home if she voluntarily opted to stop work in 2010 after the BIL inherited the money and seemingly also had hired help?