To want DH to understand the mental load

[Bongbingboo1]

Background
We have 4 kids. 3 are teenagers and 1 5 year old. Both work full time with me working from home.

I'm feeling extremely overwhelmed at the moment and the plates are falling down and no longer spinning.

We moved house 6 months ago and I feel completely disorganised and the house is a mess as I haven't had the opportunity to actually organise anything.

Husband works long hours and he is away 2-3 nights a week. I do all the house admin/child admin etc. he literally works and then thinks about his own hobbies.

I am trying to get him to see that I am overwhelmed but he keeps saying I'm making choices. I gave him the example of DDs birthday next week and how it won't even occur to him to think about anything until I ask something of him. It's the end of term and there are a million things to think about for each day of school, again he said my choice. I get it's a choice to buy teachers a gift etc or arrange play dates and have birthday parties.

I said I need you to understand that they are not choices all the time and he responded by saying 'I call bull shit on your examples'.

I am talking myself down by thinking it will be easier in the holidays as I can ask the older kids to help out more and life will slow down a bit without the school run but it's not a solution to his attitude.

So my question is. Have you ever got you DH to see the mental load and take some of it on without the kids suffering/missing out etc? What works well in your homes to split the work?

Mental load aside, he sounds very rude. And it's sad that you're more likely to get help from your teenage kids than your husband (although of course teens should be helping, but not because their father won't).

My husband doesn't see a lot of it, but he does work longer hours than I do so it's fair that I take on more. For us, having our own areas seems to work out well. So for example I deal with everything to do with school/nursery, doctors, clothes/shoes, social activities. He deals with dentist, swimming, church.

Of course there is some overlap when necessary, but dividing zones like this helps me to not have to think about everything all at once.

well I am an SP but agree that my ex would not have seen that sort of thing as needed- I mean, in theory they are right, but realistically, you aren't going to stop your kids going to a party, or going without a present, or not bother with hobbies, or playdates, so it isn't really. The only thing I can suggest is taking one week and writing down every single thing, the sitting with him and asking him to go through it one item at a time and explain why he thinks its bullshot not to interact and help yuor kids interact on a social level. None of it "essential" to life, but neither are his hobbies. What he is basically saying that anything that doesn't affect him is meaningless and unimportant. Not something I would find attractive.

This article is great:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/may/26/gender-wars-household-chores-comic

DH and I have regular (2-way) chats about what’s going on, what needs doing and who will do it (not assigned, often I’ll do x).
We often have a running written list when things are really busy (almost always!)

Choosing my words carefully as I was previously told this is still me doing mental load. Don’t see it personally as we are both active and engaged.

Saying it's just a "choice" is the bullshit. That is true of some things, but not your children having their birthday celebrated or getting to go on the occasional play date. As for teacher gifts etc, the question is does he want his children to grow up as selfish types who only think of themselves and never other people? Because it sounds like he is!!

Would he understand it better if you typed up a list of everything and said he needs to take responsibility for various things on the list, which you ca. agree between you. And he can point to things on the list that he doesn't think need doing at all and try to justify it.

I carry the vast majority of the mental load in our house but my DH, for example, is the one responsible for getting haircuts for our DC (both boys), selecting and buying all their birthday presents (again, boys who want Lego and computer games that he understands and I don't), sorting out our energy supplier and all insurance each year, and all DIY and anything to do with the car (I appreciate that's horribly gendered but he quite likes chatting to the garage about the MOT whereas I don't). If you both work full time he has to carry some of the load - even if he works 50% more than you (I doubt he does!) that only means you should split the home stuff one third / two thirds, not that he should do nothing.

I completely understand what you mean, I carry 100% of the mental load and it's exhausting. DS's last birthday, dh not only didn't mention or give any ideas towards any presents but also didn't even ask what/if I had got so come the actual birthday day, dh had absolutely no idea what one single gift was. The only way I'm dealing with it at the moment is by no longer doing the bit that will only affect dh e.g. he's mentioned a few times that he needs some new socks, no big deal and I would normally just pick some up from the shop for him but I'm not doing it- if he specifically asks me to get them I will but he won't think far enough to do that. The same with a birthday card for his auntie that I know won't get sent if I do it etc.

If he calls bullshit, fine, he is responsible for the children's birthday in its entirety.

Party?
Present?
Wrapping paper?
Sellotape?
Cards?
Reminding relatives?
Cake?
Decorations?
Siblings present?
Special meal?

And if he's being a dick, don't give him the list, and don't bail him out.

The problem lies with what traditions are important to you to be done in a certain way, and if you have the energy to do them, like a homemade cake. The kid might have a birthday different to what you envision, but you literally can't have it all, so you need to communicate and prioritise.

Are they all his children?

He sounds absolutely awful.

Working full-time with 4 children and a house move and a husband who conveniently works away half the week and has hobbies sounds absolutely horrendous.

You are heading for a complete nervous breakdown or and serious illness.

What ages are the teens?

Take this VERY seriously.

He doesn't care and your health is now at serious risk.

You need to take action to protect yourself as he doesn't care.

I sincerely hope this isn't a step children, one shared child scenario?

If it is, pack a bag and leave with the 5 year old.

Even if it isn't, do it as soon as he returns and leave him in charge.

Thanks for that link @Yea2023 , that was a great read.

Although my husband does the shopping and most of the cooking, he feels like that’s his get out card for anything else. It never occurs to him to do the general day to day stuff without being asked. I just wish he’d use some initiative.

We have. DH understands that there is a mental load, that it forms part of the work that needs doing to run a family and home, and that he's lucky I'm good at it because he fucking isn't. I do the majority though not all of it, and am ok with that because it forms part of our equal division of labour. The things he does are exclusively his mental load area and not my problem.

The way we did this was by talking about it from the start, and checking in regularly to make sure we're both always happy with the balance. His mother was an excellent organiser and he's very respectful of that, so I pretty much acquired a ready made one there.

I don't have anything useful to add about how to establish understanding at this stage though. All I can think of is, if you do anything that specifically affects him that he'd see the downside of if you stopped, don't do that for a bit.

I used to get annoyed with mine about this but then I realised that there’s actually a lot that he does that I don’t think about at all so it all balances out. I’ve just accepted that I’m sort of. The default parent but he’s the default adult ha!

I also do all the finances, house admin, food shopping etc.

He’s gone away for 2 days on a non work trip. My parting shot as he walked out the door was it must be nice to leave knowing everything is taken care of and you haven’t had to think about anything to do with us.

His reply to everything is well just don’t do it then. I don’t know how to do that without the children suffering.

When the older children were younger I didn’t work as much so it wasn’t an issue but I do work more hours now and nothing has changed.

My ex didn't understand the mental load until I divorced him. He had a nasty shock when the dc created one morning when he attempted to give them one slice of dry toast for breakfast as that was all he had in. He's no way poor. Just stupid.

He sounds like an arse.
You sound like you are choosing to be a good, decent, caring parent who wants her children to be happy and cared for.
He is choosing to be an arse who doesn't care a jot about his kids or wife.
If he won't even have a dialogue, SHOW him what you mean by withdrawing your support for him. Let him do his own food shopping, laundry, organisation. Don't buy him a birthday present or do any errands that make his life easier. Just focus on you and the children. Then he might start to appreciate your contribution to family life.

https://www-huffpost-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.huffpost.com/entry/she-divorced-me-i-left-dishes-by-the-sink_b_9055288/amp?amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a9&usqp=mq331AQIUAKwASCAAgM%3D#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=16897672209720&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.huffpost.com%2Fentry%2Fshe-divorced-me-i-left-dishes-by-the-sink_b_9055288

This is a really good article from a man who didn't understand his wife's mental load and the consequences.

This might good article to share wuth your DH as it's from a male perspective and explains it very simply.

He sounds like an arse.

It's not just that you do it all, it's that he won't even see let alone appreciate it.

It's incredibly unfair, I'm not sure if there is any easy answer.

It sounds like he doesn’t care about you or the kids to be honest. Very rude.

I feel your pain, I only have 2 kids but we have a similar issue.
I asked DH once how he would organise or know when kids sports days, school trips, parties, dentist apts etc were and he said (without joking) "I'd look at the Calendar..."
MN advice is often to " just stop doing x, y or z" but that doesn't automatically mean the other person will notice or pick up the slack. It just won't get done....which is OK if it only affects the partner not doing stuff. one year I said we should each be responsible for one child's Xmas presents. I asked DH less than a week before Christmas If he had sorted out DS presents. (They each had a wish list on the fridge for weeks)He hadn't bought or ordered anything but was quite defensive about it. I ended up taking over because the likely alternative was DS not getting anything!!!

What exactly does he mean? Don't feed and look after your 5 year old for example. How is that going to work. If you also just upped and left without a backward glance that would be neglect

I would start with looking at what you currently do for him/ older teens and then let them take on the responsibility themselves. Laundry is the first thing to go. You sort out yours and the 5yr old's he does his, teens do their own. Next thing is food, just cook one meal a day. Anyone else is welcome to cook for everyone for the other meal on the condition that they tidy it up. I don't know if you can get him to take the mental load for the family but you can shift some of it off your shoulders.

If he asks you why you haven't done something he would expect you to, it's choices isn't it?

He doesn't sound great but maybe he needs some specific examples. and there is an element of choice. Your teens should be doing set chores in the house every day, not just in the holidays.

Fair comment. The trick here is to stop doing things that only cause him inconvenience. It might not amount to a huge amount but it is very satisfying.

Suggestion 1 - do not do his laundry. Put his back in the basket and don’t do it.

Suggestion 2 - do not sort out cards or gifts for his side of the family. None at all.

I think I would ask him to take on some specific responsibilities such as finances, house admin and food shopping. If he won't then I guess you need to make a decision about whether this is a deal-breaker thing and initiate a separation or put up with it.

If you ended it, you’d end up doing a lot less because you’d have every other weekend off plus days in the week.

When he is back I would make it clear to him that being a single parent is looking very attractive to you since it would make your life easier.

So it’s his choice what happens from now on. Hell either change or he won’t. Act accordingly.