To think some people on here can be a bit naive with regard to ‘the village’?

[Buildyourvillage]

I see it quite a lot on here, that if you need sudden childcare either because of an emergency or last minute change of plans, you should have a village to call on.

I found out I was expecting my (planned!) baby a couple of weeks after the first lockdown was announced, but I was still determined to be as sociable as possible. My own parents died before I turned 30, so I didn’t have them as support, but we had DHs parents although they live about an hour and a half away.

We did the NCT course and we were really lucky as everyone in our group hit it off and I know not everyone does. However, we’re a little widespread geographically and most significantly, out of six of us, four went back to work FT: two straightaway, two initially went back PT but then got different FT jobs.

Toddler classes here are hit and miss at best. We do the activity with the toddlers and I am always friendly and sociable but somehow it’s hard to strike up meaningful conversations beyond ‘how old is she …’

I have seen on another thread that you should be apparently organising childcare swaps with other mums to cover for school holidays and the like and I’m not against that in theory but in practice I do wonder if one persons village is another persons CF. AIBU?

YANBU - modern life is hard when everyone is so busy the ‘barter system’ with kids doesn’t often work in practice

The village was not meant as free childcare though but as overal society where child would grow up and learn from various people as well as have the "village" for safety.
Eg. My parents knew they can let us out at young age because if anything happened or we caused trouble "the village" would help or tell us off. We generally walk to school at 6 without adults and someone on MN once had a logical explanation why it not done in UK. Because in many other places even unrelated adults intervene and somewhat watch over kids. While also telling them off!
I got so much telling off from strangers when I was a kid😂

Yanbu. My youngest has been so challenging I had to give up a social life and she wasn't able to cope with other kids in the house. I was never able to reciprocate. In my experience the SAHP's had a better village as they had time to make one.

I think some people are a bit naïve about how easy it is to make friends. You cant really just decide to, you meet 100 nice people, and maybe 1 of them is someone compatible with you at a level of close friendship over many years.

I recently listed my 20 closest friends and drew a rough timeline to show when I'd met them. 1 is a relative, 5 others from childhood, 6 I met when moving to my current area over 20 years ago, and the other 8 are spread out along the time line, with 1 every 3 years or so.

Of course when I moved here, I met probably 600 people in the first few months, church, work, hobbies etc, but of those 6 have become long term, close friends. So really, in normal life, I make one very close friend every 3 years or so, and of course it take 3 years before you know they are a good friend, not just a nice person you know.

Hold onto your good friends and work on looking after your friendships. They are not easily replaced.

Most people don't understand what the phrase means

I thought the phrase meant that children need to learn and develop with input from lots of different sources, such as local friends and neighbours, teachers etc. To raise them into well rounded adults.

When my ex-partner and I had relationship counselling, one of his gripes was that I didn't ask other people like his family enough for help when our kids were ill. My reason for not asking for help was that a) they never offered and b) they were both working

The relationship counsellor was an older woman, she told me I was unreasonable and should have been asking others for help when my toddler was ill - even neighbours, as apparently people want to help.

Who all these neighbours were who a) didn't have jobs b) would have had free time to look after a sen toddler with a fever and not worry about getting ill themselves or their children catching it were I'll never know!

Agree with this. For example, I have a neighbour who will e.g. occasionally ask if I can watch her two younger DC for fifteen minutes whilst she collects the eldest from an activity; or she knows I pass the local recreation area when I go running and will look out for her eldest who often plays football there and make sure he’s okay. And I’m happy to do my bit. But she also knows that if I e.g. saw one of them out and misbehaving on the bus I’d give them a bollocking - and she’s totally fine with that. To me, that’s “The Village.”

As others have said, it isn't about babysitting, more about keeping an eye on when out-which includes telling them off.

If you're in a group where you can organise child swaps etc. that's fine but it's something that tends to need someone to start it rather than it just happening-and one person can ruin it much easier than setting it up in the first place.

We moved here less than a month before dd1 was born. We have no family within babysitting distance-most are well over 2 hours away.
I've never had a shortage of people I could ask for babysitting.
But a lot of it is give and take, because I would volunteer to do things for them, so when I asked if anyone was free, people were then prepared to come out for me.

So if you want to look at that sort of thing, next time someone says they've got an appointment/want an hour to themselves etc offer to babysit. They may not take you up on it, but the offer remains, and then if you need it they'll be more likely to be happy to return the favour.

It’s probably true I used the phrase incorrectly, but in general I mean having a network of people you can support and who support you. I’ve got friends from years ago but I didn’t grow up around here, and most of my friends who are local are in exactly the same boat as me with regard to small children and work. They are brilliant emotional support and I’d like to think they’d say the same about me, but equally I can’t expect them to suddenly leave work or their own children to come and support mine.

I know if I was asked by another mum to look after her children during the school holidays I’d happily do so as a sort of one off but it isn’t an arrangement I’d like to do as an actual commitment and I think most people would probably feel the same.

I think you're missing the OP's point.

It's not about what 'the village' means, it's about people on other threads suggesting that you should be able to find someone who lives nearby to be able to look after your kids one day a week because you work and need help. And that in reality this rarely happens or works out long term - and that people who try to do this are generally considered CF's.

The village as a term is neither here nor there.

We don’t have family nearby. I think that what can work well is other people in similar circumstances recognising each other and then over time helping in various (small or large) ways - my eldest is in Reception now, for example, and there is always lift sharing to activities/parties, offers of help during the holidays or strike days and so on. But it has taken time. The idea that the seven random couples who you meet on NCT are automatically “a village” - no, unrealistic and will end badly as people’s expectations vary.

I have seen on another thread that you should be apparently organising childcare swaps with other mums to cover for school holidays and the like and I’m not against that in theory but in practice I do wonder if one persons village is another persons CF. AIBU?

I managed to do a childcare swap - but - here's why:
We live in the village where DH was reared. It's remote and very close knit so not only do you know everyone, but you know their parents and grandparents etc.
The other family know his since they were babies. DH and the other husband were in school together, coach local sports together and are friends for decades.
The two boys know each other since reception.
The mum has become a friend to me outside of the boys friendship.
Cultural / parenting styles are alike.

We are lucky that the two mums have dovetailing FT work, but that the dads are reasonably flexible for the moment.

And even then, it's only a summer trial. Both sides are treating it as an experiment - if it works, it'll be brilliant, and we'll keep it up for term time. Childcare costs don't really come into it because our local nursery is very affordable and subsidised (not the UK) but the boys will age out of it next year.

I still think we need another mum & dad in our team to give it the fullest "village" flexibility. I know we are as lucky as fuck that we found nice, non CF people to team up with and tbh, there's quite a few families around who are like that.

The upside of knowing everyone in the village and literally their granny, is that you know well in advance the families who have form for being CF.

No one is saying that @TheWayTheLightFalls but nearly three years on I don’t consider them ‘random couples’, I consider them friends.

How else do you make friends, other than trying to join groups and meeting ‘random people’?

I think this is often raised on MN when someone says (for example) they are ill and there is not a single person who can take their primary aged children to school.

If you have a primary school aged child, then they have class mates.
If you a have a primary school aged child, chances are you live near other children that go to the school.

It's not being a CF to ask someone as a one off if they will take your child to school. If someone (and most people I know) asked me under those circumstances I would have no hesitation in helping out.
What people typically mean is that they don't like to ask or don't know people well enough to ask. And in those circumstances, it's definitely worthwhile, not to expect to be best friends, but at least to attempt to move to the "friendly small talk" level.

No one is saying that @TheWayTheLightFallsbut nearly three years on I don’t consider them ‘random couples’, I consider them friends.

Badly worded I guess - NCT throws together people at random based on due date, so (what I meant to say) there’s nothing to assume that you will all get on, be close or have similar outlooks. Once you find people who have more in common with you it does get easier, in my experience. I have three kids, as an example, and I know that if I need a favour another mum of 3/4 or a twin parent will always help me out (and vice versa). I suppose it’s about identifying people with the same needs/outlooks etc as you.

I always made a post of having favours in the bank. I don't think you're in CF territory if you've helped someone first?

I don't think 'the village' really refers to childcare swaps.

Childcare swaps don't really work with pre-school children/early years children. They can work when they're older and the reason is you go with your children's friends who are in similar circumstances rather than your friends. The pressure to be close friends with the parent is removed. It's basically you've just got kids in the same class who are friends and you're both stuck for childcare, no close parental friendship required.

I do agree with that @redskytwonight , but then again it does depend on where you live.

More often though I do see it pushed on here as in ‘what? You don’t have any friends who could …’ I am trying to say you can do all the right things and make friends but they aren’t always going to be in a position to help.

@TheWayTheLightFalls i do honestly consider myself a friendly person but while I know a lot of people locally I don’t know many who I could ask to help other than in a dire emergency!

This makes me laugh so much when people say child care swaps with another mum 🤣 I have 4 kids no one is going to do a childcare swap with me! Every mum I know only has 1/2

This again. There was a whole thread about this just recently. “The Village” doesn’t mean childcare 🙄
But here is a thought…
Typical mumsnetter going by threads I read….
” I just drop my kids off and don’t speak - school mums aren’t my friends “
” I won’t join the PTA because I am busy busy and they are all cliques anyway”
” I’m not joining the class whatsapp because I can’t possibly be bothered with all that drama”

But then…..
” I have no one to help babysit/collect my kids in an emergency/do a childcare swap”
😂

I think it can be daunting to take the first step into moving into exchanging favours with mum friends, but if you want things like childcare swaps you have to be brave and have a conversation about it. Some people will say no, some will say yes. The secret is finding a parent with the same level of childcare-related desperation!

I can't see how having a conversation is cf territory, unless you aren't planning to do your side?

My top tip is to bank favours whenever you can - if there are friends your dc want over over a holiday, it's good to approach the family to say "my dc wanted to invite your dc over, I wondered if there's a day that that would be handy for you?" Once you've offered something it becomes easier to ask for reciprocal favours.

YANBU - the childcare swap never really worked for me. How can it when someone has all school holidays off work and you only have regular annual leave? It was always very one way. I didn't want to spend my annual leave looking after other people's children (playdates aside).

Hmm I think it's a case of making an offer or discussing it with friends. I think a lot of people would be willing to help but are reluctant to ask for help themselves, although they would probably quite like it. I have asked friends for help with e.g. dropping off a child to nursery or looking after one for half an hour while I take the other for an appointment. These are people I like and trust but I haven't known them pre children. Children in question are under 4.
It really starts with holding a baby while mum goes to the toilet at a group, or lending someone spare clothes etc, and follows quite a bit of making the effort with talking to people. I can't see how you'd build up those networks with pre school children if you work FT.
It's not the same as having grandma round the corner to babysit on date night but if I need some help for an hour or 2 there are lots of people I could ask locally. As children get older reciprocal childcare could definitely work out.

Personally I found it a lot easier once my dds started nursery school.

And I found it worked well if I was more or less independent - aside from mutual play dates - and reserved the ‘village’ interactions for emergencies only.

But I like my own company and found those toddler group play things tortuous so I avoided them.