To ask why people are so against giving up meat?

[NewCracker]

Just that really, why are people so against giving up meat?
Without a doubt we know it's better for the environment, we know it's better for our health, we know it's better for animal welfare and it's actually quite expensive. But still as soon as you mention to the greater public about cutting their meat consumption, they get defensive and almost offended.
Would you ever consider giving it up, if you do consume it now? If not, why not?
I'm expecting some hate, this is MN after all, but I am genuinely just curious. Not trying to rattle feathers.

I won’t respond to deliberately provoking posts.

I haven’t come on here to question people’s habits and nowhere have I tried to promote a meat-free diet. I’ve given my reasons for quitting meat and answered a few questions from my perspective and unfortunately I don’t have all day to answer questions.

You're far too sensible to be here.

What unlike crop farming and destruction and fragmentation of habitats, or eutrophication of water bodies from nutrient run of or affects of herbicides and pesticides. At least in slaughter houses they get a quick death unlike the slow gradual suffering of billions of species of organisms from effects of crop farming.

How is discussion on the effects of farming on lad use and ability to grow certain crops in areas of the UK, deliberately provoking.

Its an educated discussion, which requires an educated reply you obviously do not have.

@Fernbreeze your point would make sense if vegetarians were the only people eating vegetables and crops. The bulk of the destructive evil grains you’re describing are eaten by meat eaters, plus the animals they eat. Why are we blaming vegans here?

BUT I will not buy into an industry that relies on the systematic abuse and slaughtering of billions of animals every year.

Well I am afraid you do.

That's the way it is.

You too are involved in the systematic abuse and slaughtering of billions of animals every year. Just not cows, pigs, sheep and chicken; smaller ones that don't seem to matter

Again, totally naive.

I am happy to be corrected, but I don't see how buying meat from my local butcher, which in turn is sourced by the surrounding farms, is any worse than transporting avocados into the country.

I also don't see how a local and well-bred bit of meat, the origin of which you're aware, is any worse than eating vegan "cheese" or a quorn burger, both of which are complete with modified starch and ambiguous "flavourings" as part of the 10 -15 ingredients listed.

In any case, even if I were to be convinced that veggie and vegan stuff is inherently better, I love meat. Plus I have coeliac disease and so often a steak and salad is the safest option on a menu.

Apologies, plant-based in my head also contains meat, but has plants as the focal point. I guess plant-based is being taken to mean the same as vegan / vegetarian now, but I always saw it as a different.

Of all the things you've listed, habitat loss, biodiversity loss, pollution, etc., industrial scale animal agriculture is significantly more damaging to them than industrial scale arable agriculture (and remember c35-40% of all crops grown goes to animal feed for livestock so animal agriculture impacts on arable agriculture too).

There's 100% an arguement that low intensity and low impact animal agriculture, such as silvopasture, can be both sustainable and environmentally beneficial, but those solutions would only be economically possible IF a majority of people switched to a plant-based / plant-rich diet (and were also willing to pay a lot more for their very occasional meat treat).

So if you're comparing industrial food production there is no argument that plant-based is better than animal-based

I don't know, what does it prove? That chicken and fish take similar times to cook...? That both take the same time to cook as lentils...? Should we keep guessing?

As a family we cut down to eating meat only 2/3 days a week for a long time but the truth is my children just don’t enjoy the alternatives unless they’re really processed to look and taste like meat. I love veggie meals but not the fake meat crap but my family just don’t want bean chilli or lentil bolognaise ect so there’s no point in cooking it. Also every vegan vegetarian I’ve ever known personally seemed a bit depressed and I always wondered if it’s because they’re missing something vital in their diet which impacts their mental health.

No one is blaming vegetarians for that. What I am doing is asking how vegetarians seem to think they can exclude them self's for suffering of many many species of organism by their food choices and accuse meat eaters of being animal friendly blood thirsty murderous.

They want to stop us eating meat, so how are they going to manage the land and what are they going to do with the areas that do raise livestock and wild game. Whist conserving these areas and maintaining them to ensure many specialist habitats are conserved and how are they going to pay for this and provide the people there livelihoods. ect.

Its an over simplified point of view that currently does not stand up to scrutinise and none of the antimeat people are able to provide and answer too.

Do you eat soy products @RoyalGala ?

I wouldn't touch them with a barge pole mainly for health reasons, but many vegans are quite happy to wolf down their soy products - a 'go to' ingredient for vegan products. It is laughable.

Calling farmers who care for their animals intensely and then give them 'one bad day' after a decent life; a life which has not destroyed every form of life around it - calling these farmers abusers and murderers. honestly it is just laughable how you have been caught up in such a nonsense ideology.

I don't have the imagination, or cooking skills, to go meat free

If you don’t have the ability to read your posts and your most recent one and not realise they’re not deliberately provoking, I’d seriously question who the educated one is here (clue - it’s not the one to do with crops) honestly I have no respect or inclination to discuss things with people who start off being provoking.

Have a good day!

Well at least that's honest.

Okay so you cannot answer me then. All I asked was for an educated answer based on facts. Have a nice day but next time please bring some intelligent discussion to the table not just veggies 🤗

Goodness people are very stroppy on this thread. I'm loving the stereotypes that vegetarians/vegans are ill-looking, eat fake meat and look depressed 🤣 The strongest opinions on here seem to be from the meat eaters who as ever are keen to bash the veggies. It's very interesting.

I have not said my eating habits don’t have any impact on anything else BUT I won’t pay into an industry which abuses and slits the throats of animals and that’s a fact, there’s enough evidence out there to suggest that. That’s not naive, that’s being aware of my food choices.

I haven't bashed anyone. In fact it's been suggested I'm not telling the truth.

We are all vegan and so are most of our friends. It's bizarre that people still eat meat but I live in hope it will become unusual to eat meat in time!

I've been vegetarian since childhood and it is so much harder to get a good amount of non super processed protein to build muscle, especially when insulin resistant and having to limit carbs. If I could stand to eat meat it would be so much easier.

@AutisticLegoLover perhaps the original post appears somewhat goady?

I have not said my eating habits don’t have any impact on anything else BUT I won’t pay into an industry which abuses and slits the throats of animals and that’s a fact, there’s enough evidence out there to suggest that. That’s not naive, that’s being aware of my food choices.

No soy products then?

@Fernbreeze I don’t see why it’s a vegan’s responsibility to design a new system because they don’t want to buy into the one the rest of us opt into.

Our current system of animal agriculture is pretty screwed up, but no one’s here challenging you to personally formulate a perfect solution.

I have not said my eating habits don’t have any impact on anything else BUT I won’t pay into an industry which abuses and slits the throats of animals and that’s a fact, there’s enough evidence out there to suggest that. That’s not naive, that’s being aware of my food choices.

I do actually agree with you that animals should not have their throats slit when still conscious. I don't eat halal meat for this reason and I do not agree that we allow halal practices in the UK. All animals should be stunned.