to think they would feel differently if they had children?

[Violetbeauregardesgum]

Just reflecting that the three most vehemently pro-abortion, abortion on demand up till 40 weeks women I know are all child free. Was talking to one the other day and was taken aback by how uncompromising she was. The 32 week old baby that the woman was imprisoned for aborting was not a baby, all women have the right to end a pregnancy at any point.

I am pro choice but think the 24 week cut off is about right. AIBU to think they would feel differently if they had gone through a pregnancy to term themselves?

And furthermore, when being made to become pregnant (hiding contraceptive pills, refusing to use a condom, rape) is part of the abuse …

I'm very pro choice up to the current legal limit. Your have choices right the way through - birth control, morning after pill, abortion up to the legal limit, adoption. I haven't changed my opinions since having babies.

This.

It's an awful tragedy, obviously, and this girl has been failed by the system at every turn.

But it's not an argument for legalising the termination of a healthy full term pregnancy.

This is absolutely spot on

What do we do when Sarah who is 36 weeks pregnant and struggling whether she has ongoing mental health issues, is in a violent relationship or just has decided she doesn't want to be a mother again or perhaps at all?? Who is going to prescribe the medication to terminate her pregnancy, who will be the one who inserts the needle into the foetus through her pregnant belly to stop its heart? Which midwife would you like to do the job of delivering babies terminated late in pregnancy? What would you like to be done with the bodies of those babies effectively terminated when they're viable?

Are all those shouting about choice going to stick their hands up to be involved? It's easy to have ideals about protecting a certain group of people when you don't have to get your hands dirty.

There has to be a cut off, it's very easy to throw out 'as late as necessary' when you're not involved in the medical process.

Totally agree, having my own child has made me even more vehemently pro choice than I already was.

Of course they're not. People like that just love screaming stupid slogans.

There have been a spate of threads recently which over simplify the abortion debate and ostensibly come from a position of pro choice, but actually characterise pro choicers as baby murderers who want full term babies to be killed left right and centre on a whim. Specifically blaming child free women is a new one I'll admit but the theme is always the same.

Why is that, I wonder?

"Pro choicers" aren't a hive mind. Some people are pro choice but would make the cut off point for terminating a healthy pregnancy earlier than 24 weeks. And some people do actually say that a woman should be able to terminate for any reason at any point in pregnancy, which is just a less emotive way of saying it should be legal to kill a healthy full term baby provided it hasn't drawn breath yet.

I am wondering about this recent spate of threads though. Other than in Northern Ireland, UK abortion law has remained stable for a long time. I didn't think there was much interest in having a debate about it.

I hear you on this- though I am more pro-choice than you- but I still think the motivation for this thread- and many other threads lately- is dubious.

I'm not sure why anti abortion groups would target the UK. There's essentially no appetite among either the general public or politicians to restrict women's access to abortion more than it is now.

I wonder whether it's a distraction technique, to make women worry that their abortion rights might be under threat so they focus on that and not other things.

No of course not everyone who is pro choice has the same opinions. But the recent crop of threads all seem to be trying to portray pro choice as indiscriminate baby killing, usually leveraging two recent very sad, very rare legal cases to suggest that that is what pro choice is advocating for.

I personally think it's about moving the Overton window, to pave the way for more restrictions in the UK, against the backdrop of what's happening in the US.

Maybe, I'm not convinced though. I don't think most people in the UK have any time for that kind of thing, and the backdrop of what is going on in the US only serves to illustrate why religious conservatives shouldn't be allowed to control the abortion debate.

I have a feeling that this is sort of, "Look! A squirrel!" to draw attention away from other areas where women's rights actually are under attack in the UK.

YABU. I have a child and I am pro choice at any stage of pregnancy.

Even on the due date?

I don’t think that passed viability abortions should be an option but I think abortion before that should be an option.

I do think that there should be more available information and support during pregnancy to inform about continuing a pregnancy but not keeping the baby.

I don’t think that makes me pro abortion or pro choice. I guess I’m a middle grounder.

The medical process would be the same as a woman deciding to have an abortion at 36 weeks because the foetus has a non life threatening birth defect or genetic condition such as Down Syndrome which is legal.

Yes. I believe in bodily autonomy. When something is living in your body, you should have the right to remove it at any time.

How many women would actually have abortions on their due date anyway.

Exactly.

The vast majority of abortions happen during the first 12 weeks. That isn't going to change.

So you think that on a woman's due date (or several weeks before) instead of delivering the child she should be allowed to kill it inside her and then still go on to deliver it?

Either way the baby is coming out of her, but you think killing it first is fine? How about if she kills it 30 seconds after instead? All of a sudden that's different I imagine.

Out of interest, is there anywhere in the world where it is actually legal to terminate a healthy pregnancy on the due date?

The U.K., if two doctors agree that it would be very detrimental to the mothers mental or physical health

Sorry didn’t mean U.K., meant England

Yes. To reiterate, I believe that when something unwanted is living inside your body, you should have a right to remove it. When it is no longer living in your body, it's no longer your choice.

From a cursory Google, Canada? Happy to be corrected.