AIBU to not need "the village"?

[holycannaloni]

Prompted to ask this by a number of threads over the last few days, and particularly today (childless friends with friend with baby, person whose family is all on holiday without them, childless weddings), where people end up asking "where is the village nowadays?" The concept of needing "a village" to be a parent seems to be such an online Mum-ism of the last few years, and I just don't get it. I've never felt the need for a big group of friends and relatives to pitch in with child-raising, or for me to pitch in with them, and I don't see it in the parents around me either.

I suppose I'm lucky in some senses as I have a great husband who is completely 50/50 on all home and children things, and we earn enough money that we have been able to pay for the nurseries that we've needed over the years, but that's not to say it's always been easy. But we've just gotten on with it, as have most of my peers who have children. Both our sets of parents are abroad, and we don't have other family in the UK, so it's not like we're getting loads of family help either.

I guess I just don't recognise this craving for a village, or a bemoaning that the UK isn't like other countries who apparently are better at child raising in this collective way. It's nice that our children (and us!) have close friends and that our families love our kids and feel close to them, which they do, but this collaborative parenting isn't something we've ever looked for.

Does anyone else feel that the mystical "village" actually sounds a bit OTT, or am I just the odd one out on here?

Surely "the village" is not just about practical help? It's also about having other adults around. Parents are not always on the same wavelength as their children. Extravert parents may have an introvert child; sporty parents may have a book-lover, etc. Unless the parents are very aware and self-aware, the child will end up feeling that their way of being is wrong. Having a variety of adults around makes it more likely that the child will find an adult kindred spirit.

What’s the point of this thread? For OP to be smug and boast about how much better she copes than everyone else and how perfect her family is? Or is there something deeper?

I love how many of you have gotten (and given) real support from villages, I'm glad they've existed for those of you who have wanted them.

@viques the cardigan story made me feel a little emotional, that must be a treasured possession.

You've completely misunderstood what it means OP. It means everyone takes responsibility for the raising of good future citizens. If adults see dc needing help or guidance they step up and help. If kids are being shits, adults step in and break it up. If kids are being tearaways, neighbours would tell their parents. The kids would know that this would get them into trouble at home so they behave. Sadly now parents are more likely to square up to the neighbours/teachers etc and tell them to fuck off and not to dare to tell off their previous dc. Kids know this so they don't give a rats arse if they are caught out. Parents thinking no one else counts and their offspring are perfect have been a massive part of the degradation of society. No respect. No healthy fear of authority. Not talking about beating kids or abuse here before anyone suggests this. Back in the day if a teacher told you off, you would never tell your parents as you would then get a bollocking from them. Now kids run home and tell their parents who go charging in demanding the teacher apologises for upsetting precious little Finbar

This.

Those extra curricular activities you mention - it's about the football coach who takes time to practice drills, the karate master who helps them perfect a kata, the cubs leaders who give up their time for free to plan and facilitate hikes and camps.

If you got a flat tyre on the way to pick up a child - would you have the number of another adult there to ask them to bring your child home?

Or if your 8yo is going to a laser quest birthday party, do you partake in car shares with other parents so not everyone has to make the same trip twice?

If you were taking to hospital in the middle of the day, who would you call to collect children from school?

That's your village.

This. It doesn't literally mean a village size amount of folk to help with childcare!

Exactly! There's been far too much focus on this thread on what the OP or her children or anyone's children might get from being part of a village but the opportunity to contribute, to feel needed, to help build the society and community we want is equally important. And a great thing for our children to see, the giving as much as the taking. I know a few people in our village who are happy to always draw on the social capital created by others but who never seem to add to it. They are doing the village thing wrong in my opinion! (But I would never exclude them or make them feel bad for it)

I suppose I started this thread only seeing the village as practical support such as childcare, our children definitely do have and benefit from other adults in their life in this way and I'm a big proponent of this. So it looks like we do have a village after all.

Here is a description online .....The phrase “it takes a village to raise a child” originates from an African proverb and conveys the message that it takes many people (“the village”) to provide a safe, healthy environment for children, where children are given the security they need to develop and flourish, and to be able to realize their hopes and dreams. This requires an environment where children's voices are taken seriously (2) and where multiple people (the “villagers”) including parents, siblings, extended family members, neighbors, teachers, professionals, community members and policy makers, care for a child. All these ‘villagers' may provide direct care to the children and/or support the parent in looking after their children.

I think that children gain a lot from intergenerational relationships and having positive influences from outside their immediate family/nursery.

There was a really interesting article that relates to this on Farnam Street, I’ll link it for you in case you’d like to read it. Basically it’s about social mistrust and how it disadvantages individuals and society.

I can see it in my own lifetime, when I was at primary school we’d often go to a friends house after school for tea or they would come to ours. Now it’s more likely to be afterschool clubs/paid childcare rather than favours for each other.

I think the main takeaway is, although it works for you now as you both have the financial means and health, it might be useful to build in some support in case your situation changes.

https://fs.blog/mistrust/

Sadly, the cardigan went the way of most of the baby clothes, didn’t have a huge amount so the ones I had were hard worn. I do have a shawl, unfortunately not hand knitted, but that is a different story.

You have a village.
You are paying members of it to care for your children whilst you work. I care for my grandson whilst my son and DIL go to work. They don't pay me because I am family. You pay because your village are not family.
You have friends to provide entertainment, a listening ear, etc . They may well not look after your children,or you theirs but they are still there . Your life would be less without them or why bother having them.
If you employ a cleaner, tutors ( when your children are older) , swimming teachers,football coaches etc etc. They will all be part of your village.

Absolutely - its not a new thing.

And its not a mumsnet thing.

Also one thing I have realised maybe colours my view of all this is we almost exclusively use public transport (along with most of our peers) because we live in London and it's so much more convenient. There's not such a need for lifts and all that to and from places.

It's not a privilege to have a husband 50/50
But it does mean that you don't need a village as much. I'm the same. I don't understand why that's complicated?

@holycannaloni thank your lucky stars you've never been in an abusive relationship!
2 of my very good friend's husband's have dropped dead ( 5 years between them), can you not understand why some poor women have to parent ON THEIR OWN?

You can cope great without a village up until the day you can't.

The village is there for somewhere to drop your kids and run when one of you has a parent dying in a hospice and is too upset to be safe driving. It's there for the day one of you needs to go to hospital right now and the other is working away. It's the emergency pick up when you're stuck in traffic and the ten minute school run has taken an hour and you're still not there.

Dh works away a lot. I’m on my own with the kids a lot.
My village mattered more than ever when my youngest broke her arm at school, right at the end of the school dayq. I was on the other side of the county that day. Two other mums I am very friendly with who had arrived early for pick up saw it all happen. The school phoned for an ambulance but it was going to be a while. The mums organised for other people to pick up their own children (extended village there) and took her to hospital, one driving, one sitting with my daughter. Meanwhile another mum took my older daughter home and fed her and offered lots of reassurance. By the time they managed to get hold of me (dodgy phone reception) oldest was playing happily with a friend and youngest was almost at A&E. All I had to was meet them there.
I don’t routinely ask for child care but I am so grateful to everyone who stepped in that day. The village matters when they do things like that. And it’s the kind of stuff that can’t be predicted.

YANBU. People like to hark back to times when supposedly life was like that, but I suspect it wouldn't be as lovely and helpful as they think. We are used to our individual bubbles. My children are too old for me to need 'a village' and I live a long way from nearest family. I do have a friend in my village and we do each other thd odd favour, but that's plenty tbh.

The idea of a village is about exposing the child to more than just the influence of you and your husband. As someone who works with young adults, those who have had very insular upbringings tend to be more socially weird and closed off than those who have had a ‘village’.

They get plenty of other influences at school imo. I'd say it's the ones who have had a 'village' who are more insular, especially the ones whose family have lived there for multiple generations and don't look beyond their literal ilor metaphorical village.

We'd be similar but do get lifts to birthday parties and that. We depend on others more than we probably realise tbh. But mostly self sufficient. But i massively appreciate any help we get, def am not expecting any of it.

I have "the village" and I don't flipping want them. Extended family constantly asking to have the babies overnight, have them all day at the weekend. I had children because I wanted to spend time with them myself. Constant interference is very annoying.

I think it’s nice to have the village not just for childcare and the more transactional side but for love and affection.
My baby is surrounded by grandparents, aunts, uncles and friends that literally adore him so I hope he grows up to feel loved and valued.
Plus when I think back to my childhood my best days were spent in my nans with cousins and family getting up to mischief and I hope he has that too.

The idea of a village is about exposing the child to more than just the influence of you and your husband.

this is also so vital for kids I think.

They get plenty of other influences at school imo. I'd say it's the ones who have had a 'village' who are more insular, especially the ones whose family have lived there for multiple generations and don't look beyond their literal ilor metaphorical village.

Yes @Fairislefandango I completely agree! This has often been my experience, and partly why I made the post.

Gosh, poor you. I know that's exactly how I would have felt in that situation.