Is behaviour out of control in a lot of schools?

[Sophie12319]

Not sure whether to move DD (10) to another school. Everyday she's coming home saying she can't learn as there are a group of boys who throw stuff about the classroom, shout out when the teacher is talking, walk about the classroom in lesson. She has said teacher has sent them to headteacher in the past but it carries on.

This is not a teacher bashing thread btw (in fact, I have the upmost respect for DD's teacher as I have seen the boys behaviour at the school gate and I don't know how she does a whole day), maybe more of a parent bashing of why some parents let their kids behave like this?

Anyway, back to the point of thread, I spoke to my sister about moving her to which she said there's no point as he DS' school is the same.
Feel a bit hopeless as I feel DD's education is being ruined! I've emailed the school before about their behaviour but I feel at a loss!

This school is not far away from me, ds plays football with a few boys from there. Just shocking 🙁

There is a national shortage of EPs, and it’s the govt which funds the training places. LA support is non-existent because that’s the way this government wanted it. They push academisation and take schools out of LA reach/influence. For whatever reason some MATs just haven’t stepped up to replicate even close to what LAs were expected to provide pre-2010.

Quite clearly yes . A teacher has been stabbed today . Social order is breaking down .

It's really amazing there aren't more attacks on teachers, all things considered.

There are, including ones that put teachers in hospital. You just aren't hearing about them.

You only heard about this one because it involved a knife and a lockdown.

You are right, schools are factories churning out children that have ticked the right boxes boxes, made the HT look good by hitting targets. Yet it seems many of our children leave education at 16 with such a poor standard of reading, maths and find it impossible to follow orders or organise themselves.. Our education system is a joke and needs stripping back 40 years.

Fatal or near fatal attacks usually reach the headlines. That's what I was referring to. Do you mean attacks in a broader sense - pushes, punches etc?

Yes this is very true. Thankfully not often as serious as the awful stabbing news today but attacks/assaults do happen regularly.

My close friend works in an inner city school and regularly has chairs and even tables thrown at her.

I work in a rural school that’s always been very calm…until post lockdown. Now it feels much more dangerous and there is definitely more violent behaviour. I am thankfully leaving the profession very soon. The turning point was when I was 8 months pregnant…the week before my maternity leave. A pupil threw a pencil case directly at my stomach on purpose. Thankfully nothing too sinister or serious but no punishment was given and to me that’s unacceptable. You wouldn’t accept it without any consequences in any other job and herein lies the problem and the origins of the downward spiral in behaviour.

I truly hope the teacher involved in today’s horrific incident is okay.

Really horrific

Seemingly the Education Secretary is concerned. Pity she doesn't converse with Teacher Unions and find out what goes on.

We need to fund education including Educational Psychological services.
Parents and society in general need to be concerned. We all need to take responsibility and not find excuses for indiscipline in schools, home and in society.
Lead by example.

@AgnestaVipers

Studenta abuse teachers all the time it just doesn’t make the news. They get kicked, punched, pushed etc.

One of my colleagues had her can of Coke spiked by a student and collapsed in the corridor. Another colleague suffered an eye injury after a student flashed a laser in her eye and on and on it goes.

Schools won't enforce discipline and here we are.

Schools won't enforce discipline and here we are.

What do you actually mean by that? Schools have behaviour policies and sanctions which they carry out to the extent that they can. What discipline would you enforce, and how? How do you force kids to behave and to cooperate with the punishments you give them, especially if their parents back them up? Schools have no power. Do you honestly think it is the fault of the school that this student stabbed a teacher?!

There are loads of attacks on pupils and teachers - you just don’t hear about them. Primary going to secondary, lost count of the violent incidents I’ve dealt with. Always someone else’s fault though (namely the teachers). Nothing to do with the fact that parents can’t parent and blame everyone else. Oh and the “behaviour is communication.” So that makes it all ok.

Fuck the parents. Bad behaviour has to be punished.

Chances are he's got away with plenty before stabbing a teacher with a knife. Bad behaviour must be stamped on at source. Kids get away with all kinds now and this is where it leads.

It's not just the schools, it's soft policing, soft parenting. Bring back borstals.

Stupid remark.
Schools have had their hands tied- it takes a ridiculous amount of paperwork and repeated suspensions before we can exclude a child, even doing it for a day is made very difficult.
Then if you have space in school they make you take them back anyway!
There's not enough staff to supervise removed children in a room and they can't be left alone while staff teach.
Parents bitch and moan and complain- look how many on here bleat 'go to ofsted/the governors' at the drop of a hat.
This is probably outing but here goes- we have just had a residential trip, children were told in a meeting (that at least 90% parents attended) not to bring extra snacks or food, only 2 quid in an envelope for the tuck shop and no devices due to safeguarding.
I found a mini video camera, bags upon bags of extra food and purses of money with notes in.
There's no way the parents didn't know. If that's the level of respect they're showing their kids for us, no wonder the kids have none.

The thing is @Mookie81 some schools do manage discipline, so it can be done. It's not always the "naice" schools in the leafy suburbs either.

Then those schools obviously have enough staff to manage it, and are able to enforce the sanctions needed.
Ineffectual management may explain some of it, but not the vast majority of issues.

According to Sky News a teacher in Wales has been suspended for breaking up a fight between pupils!
When I have had to break up fights I have had to physically pull them apart.
Yes, I had to touch the pupil in order to do it.
No mean rask pulling young adults apart when your 5foot tall.

Does this mean that in the future staff should just wait until they have to call the ambulance?

@Teajenny7

I did just that once. Waited for the police and ambulance. They were just too big and too strong and the one male teacher we had on site really wasn’t capable enough to split them up. The incident only ended when one was rendered unconscious.

Actually I disagree. I think ineffectual management accounts for nearly all of it.

Discipline starts at home. Look on this site today, one mum who isn't sure how to tell her 16 year old he won't be getting £4 a day for a lunch deal, another mum wringing her hands because her adult son won't work yet she still pays for his social life, parents that won't hand over adultship to their little princesses by making them pay rent and be responsible for their own bills. we baby them. The cause of all of this whole chaotic mess is parents wanting to be best friends not parents, schools having their hands tied and can only punish by giving detention, you can't even tell a four year old that they are naughty. What the hell did we expect when we decided to pander to children ? We have a mess that we made. We have failed our children by being soft. Until we bring discipline back things will only get worse. Learn to tell your children off.

ive been home educating since 2015 my 12 y old only did 1 term of reception, no nursery started school at 5
(he would be just leaving y 7 if in school) so teacher strikes, all the lockdown stress of online all day teaching and the down fall of schools have not effects us at all.
we carried on as normal

we follow the radical unschooling route and mix with families that do the same,(via a meet up and that escalated to personal meet up, friends) majority of normal society doesn't know this but there are millions of us following this alternative lifestyle

the only school kids in person my son knows are his 2 cousins, they are 13 and 10.

we are rural Wales so local village schools with small classes.
i don't know if that's making a difference as to what im reading on here its big city classes and massive towns but they have no problems that i know about.

in one of support groups(im on many) on Facebook there has been roughly 2 thousand requests to join, as a member i didn't know that but a admin put this up earlier at 10.54 am so we are not counting today or when then break up tomorrow onwards IVE COPPIED AND PASTED THE POST

"i never tell members this as its a part of being admin and ive been a admin since January 16 but the last 6 days alone we have had a massive major intake, this have never happened before.

easter, Christmas and end of year we get a increase but never to this extent. 1.994 people have requested to join the group, that's just this group imagine all the others that's on here.

on the request form we ask why you want to join the group and age of child and has your child been in school previously? and why you chose home ed{we ask this to see if you need help as a newbie and to wheedle out las and authorities that have no right to be here}.

99% of new requests are because they are not sending their kids back in September due to severe behaviour of other pupils,{meaning they are playing up so badly their child's getting no education or have and are in danger} their fed up of teacher strikes and schools asking on a weekly basis for pricey contributions.

ive also been made aware that many special schools in England{don't know about other areas} are closing due to lack of council funding {ie refusing to fund extra money so specially trained teachers are walking out}
and there's no where for their pupils to go so many parents are being forced in to home ed."

I'm making members aware of this as future posts might be from parents that have no idea on what home education is and have questions about school and special schools and what rights la have over them{if your a old hand you know none}so don't be nasty as they are really new and forced into something they might not wanted to have done but had no choice as their children are not suited to mainstream school so there really is no where for them to go.

ive had hundreds of privated messages saing just this. i dont usually deal tihs way as thats my private messanger but i have bene helping parents as they are in distress.
us as community have to stick together and help these in need as these parents are being forced on to joining us.

this has never happened in all my year of home ed{i started in 2000 with 6 kids over all them years and my youngest being 6} so as we are home edders you probably wasn't aware on the state of the schools today

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ive never regretted home ed or doubted my decision as it suits/ed my disabled sons needs but reading all the threads on here in the last year I'm so glad we do.

I'm putting this up to say that what your saying is also effecting the home education community where as for years we have/had nothing to do with schools in general, striking etc but this has trickled in to our lives now.
pre lockdown times we were classed as wrong or weird by society to home educate and now millions are migrating to it

There was another thread about behavior on here the other day, someone went to France to an "up market campsite" she couldn't understand why the French children were sitting at the table and not running about between courses like her own. She thought there was something wrong with the French children, she was staggered they didn't even have tablets to look at or play with and just sat at the table, without making a fuss engaging in conversation. Thus is the attitude that breads the poor behavior in schools.

I do hope this admin person is not in charge of teaching her home educated children spelling and grammar.