To think that secondary school uniform rules are ridiculous?

[TrulyFlumptious]

Just for transparency, my DC are nursery and primary school age, so I currently have no skin in this game.

When I was in school (I’m in my late 30s, for reference) primary and secondary uniforms were very similar. Shirt and tie, branded cardi/jumper, plain black shoes and black or grey skirt/trousers. This was the standard from reception up to year 11.

Over the years, primary uniforms have gotten a bit more casual. Branded polo tops in place of shirts and ties seem to be the standard now. I have 3 primary schools near me and I can’t remember the last time I saw a small child in a shirt and tie.

However secondaries, even the local community schools, now seem to be channelling private school style uniforms as standard. My old school now insists on blazers, school issue tights, and uniform skirts in a school-particular check pattern. This seems to be standard process across most senior schools now. You also barely go a week without seeing a story about a child getting into trouble for not wearing the uniform tights, being put in a weeks isolation for forgetting their jumper, or children being forced to keep their blazers on in heatwaves whilst their teachers are in short sleeves or summer dresses.

AIBU to think this is completely ridiculous and getting out of hand? The argument of “this is preparing them for work” is totally arbitrary now - the world has changed, especially since covid, and barely anyone wears a shirt, tie or blazer to work any more. Most office workers are in smart casual and can adapt their dress for their own comfort levels, and even in the jobs that do require uniform it usually consists of branded polos/tees, or a tunic. What exactly are these students being “prepared” for? Yes, there should be some uniform rules in place to ensure students are not inappropriately dressed, but as far as I can see, these ridiculously over-complicated uniforms are out of touch, out of date, and do not fit in with modern society. I feel they are used simply as a means of control.

And don’t even get me started on the cost.

What do you think?

YANBU – senior school uniforms are ridiculously over-complicated, out of touch, and need to go back to basics
YABU – school uniforms are as strict and complicated as they should be.

I wonder if that's my son's old school. A whole section on uniform was appended to the newsletter.

I went to an all girls school with a SUPER strict uniform policy and n hindsight I’m so grateful for it.
It created a standard look for everyone and reduced bullying a lot. We never had own clothes days as it created so much fuss.
I think it set the tone for the day in school - we was up and dressed smart and in the right frame of mind.

That's actually not a bad argument, but I don't like the control - eg you have to wear a blazer and jumper on a hot day unless and until we say you can take it off. I mean what on earth is that about? For goodness sake let the kids be comfortable!

I don't see how this is new. I'm in my 30s and wore a poloneck, sweatshirt and skirt in primary and full formal uniform in secondary, with wool blazer, school shop tights in a specific colour, a specific skirt, and shirt and tie.

I am still trying to work out how I feel about uniforms and whether we should have them or not. Part of me thinks not. part of me is also very conscious that one of the first things the new head did at the school across the road from us ws insist on strict uniform code and somehow that seems to have gone hand in hand with overall improved outcomes, better behaved children etc.

But I do know that certain aspects drive me mad and I think should be banned. Having uniform, branding, neatness and consistency shouldn't come with added ridiculousness.

DS high school insists the girls wear branded skirts. OR they can wear the same plain, generic trousers the boys wear. I don't know why the skirts can't just be plain black. Added expense for girls and a clear "pink tax", especially as almost NONE of the girls wear the trousers.

Ties? Why? Almost no one wears them anymore in the real world so insisting on them for school is silly. ESPECIALLY in summer. If they must wear them, make them an October half term to Easter thing only.

Blazers are actually quite practical but I like DS' school which has just instituted a "no blazer" rule due to the current temperature. I believe they still have to wear blazers if they are attending any external events etc but he's in year 7 and it doesn't seem to impact him.

I am probably in the minority here but I completely agree with uniforms, for nothing else other than it reduces bullying. If everyone turns up wearing the same stuff there is no issues around the school cool gangs turning up head to toe in designer gear and the kids whose parents just cant afford that and them sticking out like a sore thumb.

I totally agree with OP.

I used to be very pro school uniform, but all of this bullshit and the enforcing of it to ridiculous levels turned me against it.

Needing permission to remove a blazer in hot weather is ludicrous. School issue tights are ludicrous too. Children in detention for having forgotten their jumper, even in the heat we have been having, is too ridiculous for words.

Some "student managers" at the school two of my DDs went to took it upon themselves to start going into tutor groups in the mornings and measuring the length of girls' skirts against the length of their legs to declare whether or not the skirts were too short!! They did this in front of the whole class and told the girls concerned that if they didn't like this they could find another school to go to!

They did pick my DD for this and her skirt was in no way too short, just below the knee.

Lots of parents complained about this and we did get personal apologies from the headmaster, who assured us that he had not asked for this to be done, had not been consulted about it, would never have agreed to it and had put a stop to it forthwith, disciplining a member of staff in the process.

All this bollocks now makes me rather anti school uniform now.

I think the idea of having stupid uniform rules so children have something “harmless” to rebel against is totally ridiculous!

Can they only rebel against one thing at a time then? What if they choose a different rule to rebel against? Or all the rules?

What if instead of being occupied and fulfilled by wearing non-uniform tights, they instead end up deciding that some rules are pointless, petty and not worth following?

Somehow in places where they don’t have uniforms, they have managed to sidestep all the anarchy that lack of uniform to rebel against inevitably engenders.

I see no evidence of school uniform reducing bullying. Two of my three DDs encountered bullying at times and it had nothing at all to do with uniform.

I sit somewhere in the middle dds1 and 2 school it was school jumper, white shirt, black trousers.
Always looked scruffy, endless arguments about the sort of trousers allowed.
Dd3, blazer, school skirt from suppliers, tie, blue blouse.
2 sets have seen her through year 7 to year 10. Not one argument about it.

I do think all the logo only stuff is stupid. By all means pick a colour and it be smart clothes but my oldest has to have logos on bloody everything.

My middle however is going to a secondary where the uniform is business attire. Smart clothes basically. She can have bright red hair or shave the lot off if she wanted too as well along as she is in what they class as business attire it’s fine. So that can be dresses, full on suits or just just trousers/skirt and a blouse. If they where a blazer a tie is required though but again as long as it’s not offensive anything goes.

Yes this have a suitable PE type uniform that looks smart and yet allows more freedom...it does seem really silly making kids wear ties when no one else does.

Bullying happens regardless of uniform. Bullies will always find something to pick on.

Sorry but that is bollox.

Kids bully because they've brought up to be like that. If not about having the right brand of trainers, it'll be about it have your tie slightly too short or slightly too long or some other rubbish.

Blazers, shirts and ties look utterly ridiculous. Not to mention uncomfortable and unhygienic in summer.

I'd put them all (boys and girls) in joggers, t-shirts and hoodies

No skirts, no ties, no blazers, you're there to get an education not cosplay the 1930s.

Our primary is still shirts and ties. The shirts are really practical, they are cool in hot weather but also wash easily and dry much faster than polo shirts. The kids like their uniform - eldest in particular genuinely thinks the tie is a bit of a jaunty accessory. They actually love looking smart.

Its an adult imposed view that these clothes are uncomfortable. Tailored trousers etc are mainly uncomfy as adults because too many of us are overweight so they dig into fat stomachs (including mine).

The secondaries near us switched to tartan skirts too for good reason, it stops the kids wearing bum length skirts, cargo trousers & various other scruffy options.

It doesn't reduce bullying. At all.

I don't have a huge problem with uniform provided it's affordable and available to all at the cost of normal clothes, and is comfortable to wear. Things like jumpers with school logos etc that are only available through one supplier at a ridiculously inflated cost can fuck right off.

I am not anti-uniform in general, just the trend for over-the-top, corporate, fussy uniforms.

Those of you saying you agree with a school uniform, why not something like this? (Image pulled from google). This is a PE kit. It’s comfortable, branded, and the school would be identifiable in public.

Is there any reason why something like this shouldn’t be standard uniform for all students, not just for PE, with an additional branded hoodie or fleece for winter? Or does school uniform absolutely have to equal “children cosplaying as barristers in court”?

I agree with uniforms - saves thinking about what to wear and ensures everyone looks relatively smart. However I don't agree with the branded uniforms.

At our secondary school it's very unfair that the boys can wear a generic white shirt but they girls have to have a specific school blouse - their blouses cost £15 each. I find it disgraceful. Parents did complain last year but nothing was changed.

Also with uniforms, all the kids are on a level playing field. Doesn’t matter if they live in a 5 bed detached house or a 1 bed flat, they all look the same which particularly benefits the kids from poorer backgrounds.

No, I hated my blouse and tie as a teenager.

The collar dug into my neck, the fabric gave me the shivers and the tie got in the way.

Looks good to me!

Only if the uniform is actually affordable, of course.

Generic white polo shirts you can buy in Asda-> fine.

White polo shirts with a stupid logo which you can only buy from one supplier at £10 a pop -> not fine.

That would be a practical uniform and I might not object so much to that. It has no silly frills or accessories such as blazer and tie. It looks comfortable too.

I wouldn't object so much to that provided it was to be the same for both boys and girls - no ridiculous skorts or miniskirts that are sometimes required for PE.

I would hope that it could come with a suitable pair of shorts for summer weather.

I always found the logo polo shirts from suppliers washed much better than Asda ones, were better quality and fit, so lasted longer. It’s a while since I had primary aged kids though - perhaps supermarket polo shirts have improved in quality since then.