To feel sorry for the teacher who was secretly recorded?

[Forster2018]

Link to article here:

While I don't agree with recording anyone without their consent, the teacher has shown herself to have poor judgement by calling the girls despicable, which they are not, they're just disagreeing with her. The teacher is a poor debater and unable to challenge the girls without name calling.

What really bothers me is the teachers poor grasp of scientific fact and is actually incredibly ill-informed. In using the term intersex, the teacher is being incredibly offence to those with DSDs, many of whom have already stated that they do not want their sexual developmental disorder to be weaponised and used as part of the argument about there being a third sex, because there are only two sexes.

Ultimately though, the teacher is pushing an ideology, not fact. I do not believe this should be allowed in schools. I hope schools (as a whole) take note of this case and realise that gender ideology does not belong in schools.

Isn't that a strawman argument?

Saying racist things such as All XXX are <something derogatory> is not the same as saying that e.g. There are only 2 sexes, a human can't be a cat, or whatever.

The children were not being racist. The children weren't doing anything wrong at all so why was this even said? The teacher was at fault. She may well be told to teach this ideology as fact - she certainly wasn't told to be abusive or threatening. It's a good job she was recorded because even with the evidence she's still being excused.

Why give greater publicity to the horrid child who secretly recorded that poor teacher?

You are both beneath contempt.

Trans is a protected characteristic and some kids can be very cruel to those who are in any way 'different'. Personally, I can't wait for the white paper which will hopefully give some clear guidance as to how schools should manage these situations.

I haven’t read the whole thread so apologies if someone else has already picked up on this but…“trans” is not a protected characteristic. The PC is “gender reassignment”. Children are not eligible to apply for a GRC, so legally (as well as permanently physically, of course) they remain the sex they were born; the “legal fiction” that a GRC provides does not apply to children.

I don't feel sorry for her. She's delusional. She shouldn't be anywhere near children.

Those girls know more about this subject than their teacher. She’s the one who needs educating on inclusivity and respect.

They're already being accused of manipulating the recording and not being believed. At least no-one seems to be saying that the teacher's behaviour as heard on the recording was acceptable.

She was proselytising and showing shocking intolerance to non-believers. I would hope that if she'd been a Christian talking like this to Muslim girls, calling them despicable for not accepting Christ as their lord and saviour, there would have been an outcry.

Saying racist things such as All XXX are <something derogatory> is not the same as saying that e.g. There are only 2 sexes, a human can't be a cat, or whatever.

Well exactly. Completely different scenarios. The kids were right to challenge the teacher, if the teacher cannot handle it, she shouldn't be in that role. The kids were not rude, nor disrespectful, that was all the teachers behaviour.

Exactly this.

They may have been unkind to someone who is vulnerable and they may have used inappropriate terminology to discuss mental health issues.

In which case, the professional educator in the situation asks them to stay behind. Asks for their version of events. Explains that they are part of a class/school community in which they show kindness and tolerance to each other and where you can have your own view on things but that personal attacks or making others feel awkward or sad is to be avoided.

This teacher has decided their guilt because whatever they said/did or believe IT IS NOT PERMISSIBLE TO QUESTION SOMEONE'S IDENTITY.

She starts the conversation in a combative and accusatory way, she shouts them down, she attempts to shame then and she repeats inaccurate and untrue assertions in a tone that coerces then to acquiesce and agree.

She's inarticulate, factually wrong, unclear and confused in her points and delivery and threatens children with more senior adults, worse consequences and tells them they are not welcome in school.

For me, almost the worst thing is her telling them that them being sure their parents would want to be part of the conversation and would support them "well that's sad isn't it" as it's so much a feature of this movement. Undermining the trust children have in their parents and that they will support you when life gets confusing, that they are likely to be your best supporters.

I DO feel sorry for any teacher caught up in this nonsense. I DO feel sorry for this woman being individually exposed in this way.

But it cannot carry on, it needs to be exposed like this.

I don’t think they are backing her up.
From the Mail:
’A spokesman admitted to the Mail that the teacher should have acted differently, by 'ensuring that pupils' views are listened to' and 'encouraging them to ask questions and engage in discussion' – instead of angrily shutting down debate on a controversial issue. The spokesman said they would make sure 'such events do not take place in the future'.’

While I don't agree with recording anyone without their consent, the teacher has shown herself to have poor judgement by calling the girls despicable, which they are not, they're just disagreeing with her. The teacher is a poor debater and unable to challenge the girls without name calling.

Sounds like a lot of MN'ers tbh.

Just wait til you find out about CCTV.

Teachers have mortgages to pay

which they clearly think is more important than the truth and protecting children. They are adults who make a choice to bully and lie and gaslight children to protect themselves. What part of that behaviour by the adult ok?

It takes kids to record the lies and expose them in the public interest to protect themselves.

Just how fucked up is this?

The teachers should be refusing to teach this shit. The fact they don't, using the defence of their mortgage is simply cowardice.

I feel sorry for teachers who are forced to teach things that someone somewhere has decided they should. Even though it’s not biology and they may not agree with it. Or be sacked. Poor woman. People have committed suicide for less. I hope she’s ok and she’s in the union.

And as for a previous poster who said the children are heroines…eh no they are not. Heroines for what, showing someone struggling to keep the narrative so she can keep teaching and keep her mortgage and car? She’s probably had very little training in all this new stuff.

The kids shouldn’t be using phones in the classroom in the first place.

There should be biology taught only and not all this stuff about ‘identifying’ as this or that. Who cares what you identify as keep it to yourself as nobody needs to know. Feel like a cat by all means but you don’t need to say it. It won’t change anything! Wear a dress or trousers, be masculine or feminine no matter what genitalia you have. Be happy. Just don’t make others uncomfortable so you can do it.

Wonder if the teacher now identifies as unemployed….

People don’t stop being racist by being shouted down and threatened. If students are being racist then calm conversation is needed and sanctions following the school policy (which a PSHEE teacher suggesting exclusion isn’t),

Do you not think teachers have to deal with this shit on a regular basis!

What did the girls say that was wrong? There are only 2 sexes. A girl can not be a cat. Those are facts.

Gender is made up bollocks is more of an opinion (but one worth of respect in a democratic society!) so they should not be punished for saying that.

None of this is homophobic, which they were accused off.

Why include ADHD/ASD? The difference is these are not belief systems; they are fundamental differences in the way the brain experiences, processes and expresses information.

Teachers need to keep their own opinions and beliefs out the classroom instead of trying to brainwash impressionable children

You are actually scary if this isn’t a windup post. I seriously hope you don’t have children.

The core of the truth and journalism is to expose the lie. Recording exposed the lie. The child can not simply say x, y and z happened in class because she is a child and has no power as a result. The teachers word will always be believed over and above hers unless she demonstrates differently.

It is in the public interest to know this is going on in schools and the extent of the indoctrination.

I hope this student has been suspended.

Its an awful thing to record anyone without their consent and it’s not fair on the teacher and other students, many of which will not have parental consent to be recorded and can cause serious implications.

But the comments about other students being unwell, crazy and belong in an asylum are vile.

She sounds like a bully and although I don’t agree fully with what the teacher is saying I am glad they stood up to this student as she obviously has form for being a bully.

I work with many students who have dinosaur or wolf personas.
They are not allowed to bring them into the classroom but they can act however they want at breaks and at home.
They’re not crazy or belong in an asylum, they just have SEN and don’t fit into the stereotypical box they society has created.

You can disagree with someone without calling them vile names.

The kids shouldn’t be using phones in the classroom in the first place.

But thank god they did - otherwise we wouldn’t know about this teachers frankly dangerous teaching methods.

Scary. Proud of those girls.

Are you a teacher by any chance?