To say no to social services re: my niece and nephews...

[mrsneate]

To cut a long story short, this is the fourth time in 9 years social services are involved with my brother and his children.

The first time. I drove 200 miles with no notice to collect Brother and his three kids. They lived with me for 8 months. It was hell. Small 3 bed house, 3 children of my own and my ex husband (we were still married) I supported them all financially, got them into schools, he was then given a council property, the children were taken off the register (on it because of their mum)

Fast forward 3 years, a neighbour reported him for various things. They were put back on the register, my brother worked with them, I supported him.

18 months ago, 2am police knock on my door with my eldest nephew. (16 at this point!) him and dad had gotten into a physical fight, could I take him, of course I said yes, the next day social worker came round, when police had entered their property. It was t fit to live in. Stinking dirty, rubbish everywhere.

Me and my SIL (other brothers wife) went round, and blitzed his house, I did 20 loads of washing, 16 dishwasher cycles. The house was spotless.

They asked me to take all 3. I couldn't, I work full time night shifts and was a single parent, my nephew was with me for 10 weeks with no support from
Social services or my brother financial or otherwise, then my nephew was 17 and could decide he wanted to go home. He went home. Case was closed

This week, I randomly had a phone call from a social worker. There had been an anonymous report from someone that he was leaving the youngest alone for long periods (she's 11) and there was no food in the house. He's drinking all the time, the house is a state.

I only ever see my brother these days when he pops to my house with my niece. She always looks clean.

They told me it's looking like it's going down the route of removing the children (11 and 16?) and would I be in a position to take them in, until he decides to cooperate and work with them, told them no, although I'm no longer single, my fiancé works away for months at a time and I still work night shifts, and still only live in a 3 bed house with 2 of my boys (oldest has moved out) she got really arrogant with me after that. I pointed out they need to stop closing the case, keep them on the register.

But guilt is eating me up, there has been a suggestion they go back to their mother. But that will be a disaster. I have text my brother and offered to help him clean the house. Again, but I am
Pissed off with him, and it's annoying me that he keeps having passes because he's a male single parent! He works school hours and earns good money, he's not skint.

What would you do?

I tried this last time I took my nephew in, I was repeatedly told no. All be it after weeks of pressure of them asking me to take the other two. Believe me I shouted and argued. I went above to management. I put a complaint in because the social worker in question just expected to drop in on me whenever she wanted, if I was out she would demand I immediately come home. She repeatedly said she was allowed,

When I went above her head and got legal advice, unless I was under investigation my self they weren't alllowed. My complaint went no where!

Sadly, I don’t think you have much choice. The children will have to go into foster care. I’m sure you will be able to play an active part in their lives. How was your meeting?

I tried this last time I took my nephew in, I was repeatedly told no. All be it after weeks of pressure of them asking me to take the other two. Believe me I shouted and argued. I went above to management. I put a complaint in because the social worker in question just expected to drop in on me whenever she wanted, if I was out she would demand I immediately come home. She repeatedly said she was allowed
I am shocked at this.
I work fo SS but not a SW. However I come across your situation a lot. Our authority does pay extended family members to have children. Sometimes there have been battles but it's been between the social worker sticking up for the family and the finance dept. However it is always cheaper for the authority for children to be placed with family and pay them rather than have them in reaidential care.
I have never heard of a social worker doing an unplanned visit and demanding someone returns home immediately. It is recoded on our system that no one was home and a note is dropped through the door saying they had called. Your situation is outrageous. Which authority are you under?

By interacting with her at all you’re giving her an in and she will contribute to apply pressure and exploit that.

She clearly isn’t the sort to respect boundaries and will continue to try and ride roughshod over you, no matter what you say. The only thing that will get through to her is you not saying anything at all. Block her number, and don’t engage. It may be hard for you to do, and that’s something she knows and is relying on tbh. It’s going to be the only thing that works though, and will serve you better in the long run.

Actually, could you talk to your other brother? Depends on your relationship of course, but he may be able to give you moral support in shutting down the social worker if it’s something you find difficult to do.

I’m very much a ‘no, and goodbye’ type, and I’ve been happy to take on that role when friends have been finding it hard to put their foot down.

Alternatively just block her and stop answering her messages.

Gawd, I loathe virtue signalling folk who have no real first hand experience of such a situation. A parent needs to put the health and well-being of their own children first!

OP I honestly think you might need to direct all contact from this social worker via your lawyer, if it's still the same one. She's appalling. Even if you were able to accommodate these children there is no way anything sensible could be put in place with her involved.

I completely agree with this. Someone who would take on more children when they can’t feed them (food banks) and can’t properly provide for them (selling stuff and sleeping on the floor) and who thinks that means the children in question are ‘safe and secure’ is not someone who should be given custody of already damaged children.

Op, wanted to wish you and your family well.

You’ve done everything you can to date in supporting your brothers family, and I know you will continue supporting them in the best way you can. I agree, that for them, this is Not living at your house. The social workers have made it your problem, whilst it’s not. You’re the easy option (for them) but not the right option. You need to do what’s best for the children, and that’s all the children, your family and the nephews/nieces, which in this case is to go down the foster care route.

Heartbreaking read OP and you have my every sympathy. It's clear you're trying to do the right thing here. Being expected to take in 3 children with no financial support is just awful. Kinship care is vastly underappreciated and underfunded. Have you tried the family rights group for help and advice https://frg.org.uk/? If they do go into Foster care, your relationship and contact with them will still be hugely important and you'll probably need support to make sure that happens. Really wish you well

Thanks all.

The meeting went ok. I pretty much was very blunt with the SW. I told her changing my job is not an option,

Taking on 2 children in my house is not an option, we bought this house based on the fact we had decided no more children for us and it fits the four of us nicely.

She's grumbled, but listened thankfully, I've agreed to "check in" on my brother once a week, via phone, which I know is a pointless exercise cos he never answers his phone,

I told her I will help where I can but my "plates" are already full with my own children, my grand child and my very stressful job. This morning I went in for overtime and we were 9 nurses short. It a not easy atm and I do not have the head space to give them children the time they deserve.

My heart breaks for them
My brother is an arse

All the best, OP. x

Well done OP. You're important to those children, but it must be in a way that is manageable for you and not detrimental to your own children.

I'm glad you got your point across. You're doing the right thing, your kids and livihood comes first. You do not have the time/money/space/energy for them. I hope they get to visit you, when they're at their Foster family.

She's not abandoning anyone. Always some overly emotive bollock on threads like this.

You are completely right.

You will be far more valuable to your brother's children as a loving and concerned aunt than by making everyone's life more difficult by taking them in. Your long-term relationship with them, in foster care if that's necessary, will give them far more stability, connection and emotional support than putting everyone under the pressure of trying to accommodate them when you just don't have the capacity.

Good for you lovely. You've got enough on your plate as it is. Social work got a nerve trying to guilt you. Shocking. All the best going forward.

I do not have the head space to give them children the time they deserve.

Tbh you might not even without all that you have going on.

Glad you clarified your position OP and were heard by the social worker today.

Your brother and his ex should never have had children, let alone 3. Their children are suffering but you are doing as much as you can for them already.

I took my younger brother in under similar circumstances and SS were never seen again. No support financially or otherwise and I was only 21 myself with two young kids if my own.

Over the years it's been touch and go wether I would be asked to take in my sisters children and whilst it hasn't quite gotten to that point I have had to give it very serious thought over the years.

It's not an easy position to be in OP and my heart goes out to you. Of course every instinct in your body is saying take them in. It's human nature, but if you can't do it you can't do it.

The 16 year old can be placed in supported accommodation and will get much more help as he transitions to adulthood. The younger child sadly will probably end up in care, if this happens, please try everything you can to maintain a relationship with her. Give her someone she can talk to. A safe place she can come to and feel heard.

Wishing you the best of luck, all of you.

I think you have tried to help and are back to square one.

You shouldn't feel guilty for feeling like you do. It's a big ask. You and your kids need to come first.

I think the answer is to let them be taken into care (to ensure social services stay involved) but be a very active part in their lives.

It's so easy for people to say take them in but in real life it's rarely that simple, straightforward or easy.

I would and have. I had that phone call...

Here's what I would say. If you don't want to and would resent it, don't. Your nieces/nephews have had trauma and will need very emotionally present parenting that puts them at the centre.

It's very unfortunate SS waits years to make a concrete plan for children. It is not the children's fault. I always think what would I want if it was my kids, and that's helped me really focus on what's most important.

Is it hard? Yes. Have I had to grow and learn more about trauma and attachment than I thought I'd need to? Also yes. Any regrets? Not at all, even though I'm stretched thin at the best of times.

SW grumbled did she Too used to having her own way

My friend (also a nurse) took I. Her three great nieces and nephew. She loves them dearly. But to be quite honest it's ruined her life. She had to give up her job. Got no financial support for years and was on the bread line. The children have horrendous behaviour problems. Due to their early trauma. It's so bad that I'm actually surprised that the nephew hasn't actually stabbed her. As he's threatened to do. She's such a lovely person, but with hindsight they would have been better in care with someone trained to look after severely traumatised children.